we have some really bad rents right now. advise?

[cryptokid]

we own a number of residence here in palm beach. 1 our family lives in, and the rest we rent out and use the money as income.

we rented out 1 house to a section 8 family. for those of you who dont know what section 8 is. it is goverment assisted living. this is our first time renting to a secion 8 family, and a black family none the less. now before you all go soundng the racist alarm, theres a very good reason i mentioned this family is black. they are reverse descriminating against us!

they havent payed the rent in 28 days. if i go over there to collect they tell me "leave us alone whitey" and they dont answer my telephone calls. (probably have caller id). they told me i am white and have enough money and they dont need to pay me.

i already gave them notice of eviction if they dont pay within 3 days, and the 3 days expired to i took it to the sherrif and he served them a manditory eviction notice, which does not really do anything so i am sold.

then, i had the forsight to call the elctric company and tell them the renters are moving out soon and that i will eventually need the electricity placed back in my name. the elctric company informs me that our renters have not payed their electric bill in over 7 months!
i asked them why they did not cut off the elcctricity, they said it was their goof up so they are sending a man out that day to cut the power off.

so in the mean time out of curiocity i call the cable, phone and water companies and inquire about the rents bills. its the same thing with them too, only its worse. the water and cable guys have already disconnected teir services for not paying the bills. the phone guy said they never had a phone line to begin with. (use cell phones)

but i know this is impossible because i saw the guy washing his car!

so we fast forward a couple days and basically what it comes down to is that the water and cable were turned off months ago but the renters have electrd to turn the water and cable back on themnselves illegally.

its the same thing with the power company. they came out and disconnected the service after i alteted them. however within a days time i notice the lights are back on at the house, so i call the power company and they said they went out and REMOVED the power meter from the house so there is no way to turn it back on. somehow the renters have bought or stolen a power meter and are now illegally hooked up to power!

so now i call the police, they send a dectetive out to confirm everything i said is true, and now the police are not doing anything.

they have been at the house living for free for 28 days now, and we get $1500 a month rent for that house so every single day they are living there is another day i am not getting my $50.

so you think its gotten bad yet? you have no idea...
it turns out the people on the lease are NOT the people living in the house. they gave me false driver liscence numbers and social security numbers. i dont even know who is living in my house or how they are collecting section 8! i dont know the peoples names on the lease! the detective said the social security numbers and drivers liscences are fake and do not belong to anyone.

so what am i suppose to do now? i was so nice to these people in the past hewlping them out with their new baby and giving them furnature and i feel angry about it but i mostly just want them to go away. :/

 

[JohnnyO]

Consult an attorney, you Cracker.

 

[fuel tanker man]

This is too easy...

Hire an exterminator to come over and bag and fumigate the house (it'll probably need to be done anyway). Tell the occupants that they'll have to leave or else the police will be called and they'll be removed forcefully--for their own safety, of course. The police will help you with this. I would be relatively sure that you are within your rights to have the exterminator do as I suggest.

Once the exterminator has left, arm yourself (it's your house--they do not have a legal lease) and enter the property and begin transferring the stuff to the front lawn.

If you are confronted by any of the squatters, explain to them that since they do not have a legal right to be there, you are evicting them. Warn them that if they attempt to enter the house you'll lock the door behind you. If they break the door lock and enter, you'll be well within your rights to find out just how well a 230 grain Federal Hydra-Shok launched from a .45 auto works on a perp.

You do have a .45, don't you?

Dan

 

[srivett]

I'd definately get some photos and video tape of the people so you could show social assistance that the people in the house aren't the Chapter 8 people. I'm surprised the subsidy doesn't go directly to the property owner.

Maybe you can call the fire department and tell them about the illegal power? Substandard wiring might be one of their responsabilities.

If you get them mad they could easily trash your place and get away with it. Just how much illegal activity do you have to see before the police get involved? Identity theft, water/sewer theft, electricity theft, trespassing, and ?

Steve

 

[oilyriser]

You have to study the relevant laws, and make sure you do everything by the book, or else they will sue you. You have propety, while they have nothing to lose, and will probably even be eligible for legal aid.

Maybe you could get the electric company to completely remove the main wire going to the house. I doubt the squatters will want to spend the money to put up buy a new line.

But since you're in the US, there might be some more creative options available.

 

[ruking77]

Yes, how the law in PB. FL is really the guiding light.

Usually in a section 8 distinction in CA, the government will in effect guarantee the rent. The quid pro quo is if the section 8 subject stiffs you the government will make good on the rent and also cut their future benefits. You on the other hand will have to go thru the formal eviction process, and the probable rehabilitation. In CA if the eviction process is "handled by the procedures" the loss of rent is usually 3 mo and in hard cases 6 mo. I am sorry to hear of your dilemma. The bottom line if this is your first, it is best to work with an attorney. I usually used to do evictions myself, but never was interested in doing a section 8.

 

[wavinwayne]

[ March 24, 2005, 01:53 AM: Message edited by: 59 Vetteman ]

 

[Shannow]

Having seen the Aussie equivalent of this so many times where I live, rental properties is one "investment" that I'll not be partaking in.

Good luck cryptokid.

 

[Gary Allan]

Why would you rent Section 8 if you didn't get the check directly from the agency? This is, or at least was, the common way it was handled. The amount that the tenant would pay was dependant upon the number of members to the household and their income level. You should be getting a very small amount from the tenant ..and the lion's share from the agency.

The agency is also supposed to garrentee rehab for damage (again ..or at least did at one time since there was a shortage of available properties).


Spend the money on the attorney. Rental laws change annually. I had my first eviction ..it merely required a notification of intent to evict (no registered letter - the magistrate took your word for it) ....still took 90 days of no rent (typically used to save up escrow for next landlord that they scam). Okay ..second eviction ..gave the notice ...magistrate tells me it has to be registered mail 30 days prior to filing....same deal ..the people ended up taking off in the normal 90 day period. The THIRD clown ....

I wasn't going to take it anymore. They went out to breakfast on Sunday morning ...I started moving their stuff out. They called the cops ..nothing the cops could do ..it wasn't a criminal situation. They had a dog (allegedly a "very well trained") that crapped everywhere and instead of flushing it down the toilet ..they merely threw it in paper bags with the trash...

Anyway ...they moved out ..with my help.

About three months later I get a notice that they're suing me for $1300. I go to court with the photos and the this and that. The maglstrate found FOR the plaintif ...for ZERO $$$. He won his case ..and had nothing to appeal.

The result would have been no different if I had waited the full 90 days ..but I imagine that it could have been worse for me if the magistrate hadn't figured out that this was a real purposeful loser....with malice. This wasn't a case of me throwing a disadvantaged person out in the street ..the guy was employed and gave no reason to the magistrate for not paying his rent (medical bills ..lost job ..etc.). He sued ONLY on being removed unlawfully from the property (Yeah! He had a heck of a nerve screwing me while I was trying to screw him!!).

Bottom line ...this sort of thing is the cost of being a landlord. This is what goes with the turf. I am glad, however, that I never expanded my rental assets. I've been otherwise very fortunate to have tenants that have stayed 5 years or more. Those ..I didn't even assess damages for wear and tear..simply because they managed not to screw me for that length of time.

The hardest lesson that every tenant learned was to come to me when they know the rent won't be on time ...and when I would get my money. They would typically come to me 3 days late and THEN explain their troubles. I would work with those who were up front about any issues ...but those who waited ..paid the 10% penalty after 3 days. I finally got smart(er) and gave any new tenant the choice of bi-weekly payments (13 months worth of rent) ..OR a 10% discount for paying by the 25th of the previous month (5-6 days early). I just manipulated the numbers to work out to the same amount. After enough of this ..I finally became finacially mature enough not to depend on any income from the rentals ..beyond paying the taxes and water and sewer. Now my son lives in the detached unit ..and we live in the two unit. ..(yes, he pays rent).

BTW- Just how do you know they're Section 8? If you've got an agency document ...call them. These people are commiting welfare fraud ..along with a bunch of other crimes. Get them to prosecute. The electric and cable and water companies must be the ones to press the "theft of services" thingies. They are the ones that the crime is being commited against. I doubt that a DA would touch it without a complaint from them.

If this is their standard routine ..they'll be leaving soon for some other state. This is a standard format. You hang out in one region until you get too many warrants issued ..you then move on to more furtile ground. There was a trailer park in one somewhat remote area ..actually in fairly clean farmland. They kinda formed a regular circuit of rotating states ..figuring out how long it took for most of the warrants to expire. There must be a list of "most favorable areas to leach off of the residents" criminal freeloader handbook or something

 

[cryptokid]

i talked with some people who i know that are in rentals for many years now and they convenced me that my rents are scammers that are not on section 8, and are probably illegal aliens.

if they were section 8 then i would be getting a check directly from the government each month. now these people told me they get the check from the government and then cash it and give me the cash. thats how i thought it went because i had no reason to assume otherwise. not that it matters anymore.

sence the 2 people on the lease do not actually exist in the real world (fake dl's and ss's) i dont have to honor the lease to these people who are living in the house because i dont even know their real names!

im going to probably have to bust down my own front door and throw them out.

atleast this is what i now believe to be true...

im going to consult with an attorney tomorrow who knows the local laws reguarding rentals and such.
i need to get them out quickly because i think that as soon as the power, water and cable companys act to perminantly disable their services the people will go crazy with no luxurys and probably trash my place as revenge. thats why im going to bust my own door down and throw them out. a door is cheaper than a house, assuming the attorney said this is ok of course....

 

[wavinwayne]

I agree that you will probably have to kick them out yourself. But, this could be easier said than done. I mean, you can't physically put your hands on them & "throw" them out. So, it may be hard to get them to actually vacate the premises.

Just make sure you have a couple of friendly witnesses & request that the police be there when you throw these folks out.

I hope it works out for you.

 

[loudist]

Call Homeland Security, FBI and tell them you suspect terrorists with false ID's and suspicious activity.
Find out about tresspassing laws and remedies.
Go to the police or sherrifs station and talk to a muky muck, and a patrolman or the desk person.
They usually know how to succeed in police assisted ejecting someone in a 'workaround' manner, for instance you getting them a crappy motel room for a night, this way you aren't putting them directly on the street.
The fumigation tenting idea is a good one, enforceable with a 24 hour notice (I believe).
Just work a deal with the fumigating company to not fumigate until you take possession, move their crap out and secure the property.

 

[wavinwayne]

quote:

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Originally posted by loudist:
Call Homeland Security, FBI and tell them you suspect terrorists with false ID's and suspicious activity.

---

Now THAT might actually work.

 

[ALS]

Your worried about $1500? I would be more worried at how much physical damage has, is and will be done to the property. If the people living there are not the actual people who's names appear on the signed lease then they are trespassing on your property. That folks means the police can escort them out today. Also isn't that identity theft? Again I would spend the $150 and talk to a lawyer today.

 

[robbobster]

quote:

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Originally posted by JohnnyO:
Consult an attorney, you Cracker.

---

I want to get into rental properties, and this confirms some advice I've been given: Always buy property to rent in nice areas, because you don't want to collect the rents in poor areas.

The other piece of advice I was given was to be a slum lord because you make the most money, but I choose to ignore this piece of advice.

Please let us know how it turns out!

 

[JustinH]

First of all, I really feel for you, but don't do anything Illegal, you don't want to get in trouble for something stupid.

Quick story, my uncle and cousin work as a team and they own quite a few properties in the metro cincinatti, ohio area.

Some of these areas are very poor and very dangerous.

My uncle and I talked about it for a long time, and I asked him isn't it dangerous going to collect rent from a bunch of tenants in such an area?

He said that both him and his son carry guns (they both have conceal permits in ohio). And that they only go to the properties when they "need to" and they don't collect any rent themselves.

The properties are well kept, they hired a property manager to take care of all the headaches, and this property manager doubles as the rent collector. Get this. The property manager gets 20 percent of whatever he collects, and he's a bonded agent. He says that the property manager is a big bouncer type looking dude, and he wears a bullet proof vest and carries a 9mm with him at all times.

My uncle also commented that the best tenants are the illegal aliens, because they pay cash and they take care of the apartment so well, because they don't want the police to show up and pinch them.

Justin

 

[brianl703]

quote:

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Originally posted by cryptokid:
i talked with some people who i know that are in rentals for many years now and they convenced me that my rents are scammers that are not on section 8, and are probably illegal aliens.

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http://www.reportillegals.com

 

[brianl703]

quote:

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Originally posted by JustinH:
My uncle also commented that the best tenants are the illegal aliens, because they pay cash and they take care of the apartment so well, because they don't want the police to show up and pinch them.

---

A couple of years ago I bought a house that I suspect had illegal aliens living in it, due to the fact that the mother COVERED HER FACE when the home inspector started taking photos. Despite whatever fears they may have had about about getting caught, they basically trashed that house (it was a rental property).

 

[TansLux]

This is “My Opinion” only & I may be wrong on all accounts!
Sorry about your trouble. I own several Sec. 8, properties in an LLC. My only advise is to stop & consult an attorney.
Sec8, requires. 1st, property would be inspected by local HA, then appraised by said HA. You determine rent rate, but the amount you receive is determined by the HA & the tenant voucher. You cannot receive more than what is disclosed to the HA. You may receive up to 100% from the government in rent but chances are a 70/30 split . 70% from Gov. 30% from tenant. ALL needs full accurate disclosure with the HA. prior to approval. You can only charge tenant rate disclosed on the contract submitted to the HA. NEVER EVER do anything without full consent and knowledge from HA, in regards to rental rate. If this was a Sec8, rental you & your tenant would be a name# in the system, & have stacks of paper work filed out by you & your HA.

I’m guessing, this may be grounds for criminal action. Not your tenants & you cannot get in touch with those responsible your agreement, it seems to me these people are trespassing. With consent of your Esq. I would have Sheriff accompany with an advisory that they need to relocate NOW or possibly face criminal trespassing charges. I would bring a camera & witness to document. Remain at the property & advise them that the Sheriff’s dept will be on hand as they depart, & they will be held responsible for damages incurred since by now the Sheriff would have ID’s.

In the meantime, actively seek a new tenant. FWIW I have never had a bad Section 8 tenant.
Good luck to you.

 

[brianl703]

quote:

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Originally posted by TansLux:
In the meantime, actively seek a new tenant.

---

Is a landlord allowed to ask for employment verification from their tenant, such as a W2 form?