Wanting to make myself feel nice

[skate1968]

Hi folks,

Much appreciate all the feedback -- very helpful.

Honda Tech is excellent for the particular niche of 4rth generation, "EFs," -- both D series and B series engines. But folks on there are often wanting to build race cars -- which is not my cup of tea.

So between this forum and the other i'm enabled to make a more educated decision. Not to say that there'll no longer be a possibility of me buying a lemon -- just that i'm reducing that chance of buying a lemon)

Originally Posted By: supton
...My '04 VW lately has been requiring emissions repairs each year... Last year it was a $500 intake flap, and guess what is throwing trouble codes this year!?


Yech. That sounds awful and is why i wish to avoid OBDII. Gimmie good old OBD1 or no OBD at all. Nice and simple.

Originally Posted By: supton
Only problem is rust on those older vehicles. Well, that and we are talking twenty year old or more vehicles.


Yeah, it probably doesn't hurt for me to be reminded of rust being an issue. I've done some rust removal and body work. Nothing fantastic but darn good enough. If i do it again i WILL invest in a grinder -- absolutely worth it.

What is reputedly wonderful about 4rth genreation civics is that availability of quality used part. And by that i mean "clips" imported from japan. Arguably it's very easy to get a used jdm engine or trans with 80K or less on it. I swapped in a used jdm trans in mine and felt like i was driving a porsche (obviously i've never actually driven a porshce).

I've gotten an estimate from a shop for as little as 280$ labor to swap a "fresh D series engine" into my civic.

A guy at the car wash told me that i could swap it myself without even renting a crane.

"Just throw a rope over a tree limb!"

"Or, those things are so small, you could just get some buddies to help you lift it and drop it in there!!"

I don't believe this guy, at all, but it is consistent with the general thought that 4rth generation (non carbed) civics are easier to work with than other cars. That and the availability of quality cheap used parts make them economical.


thanks again for all of the feedback

 

[skate1968]

Hi Artificialist,

Thanks for posting.

Originally Posted By: artificialist
I remember working on some early Acura models which had EFI....


Many of the folks on Honda tech, 4rth Generation civic section, swap the the integra B series engines in to their civics to race them. I'm merely wanting a daily driver.

best regards

S

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
I would avoid anything WITHOUT an "i" in the trim level! I recall Honda having base-model Civics with carbs until about 1990. My sister had one of the last carb's Accords, and yikes, that car had more vacuum lines than you would believe.

That car was a disaster...oddly, it was otherwise a high-option car with power everything, sunroof, pretty much everything but EFI and the automatic. It had various electrical problems from day one....and like most Hondas, was starting to rot. The engine blew up (seized up solid with no warning, I couldn't budge it with a 4' breaker bar) with about 145K. Three weeks after a new clutch went in.

I had an '88 Accord carb for 18 yrs/340K miles('89 being the last year for Accord Carbs). Only the Prelude carried on into the '90s with a side draft carb on the basic model(Prelude S)not Si. The Civic HF's may have also stayed with the 2bbl or 3bbl carbs...
Your sisters Accord was most likely an EFI(unless it was pre-86) if it had the factory Sun Roof(std on the LX-i '86-'89) as the sunroof was only available from the factory on the LX-i/SE-i from '86-'89 with EFI. Or as Honda called it PGMFI.

But anyyyywayyyy, sorry! Your right, they were a vacuum nightmere! But, to Honda's credit, they did vacuum better than anyone else in most cases!

My Accord lost choke pulloff and secondarys due to loss of vacuum. I was able to tap into other vacuum sources for vacuum and got both to work sufficently but, the car was old anyway at that time. To anyone else not knowing how Honda's vacuum worked, this would have been a disaster to say the least.

And if you had carburator issues, you had better know how to work on a Kehein Carb. If a person thinks carbs are hard to work on then, a Honda carb is a train werck!

Fortunately, I had good success with all of my Honda's. I'd still buy 'em today if I didn't like so many other vehicles better

 

[Jarlaxle]

No idea if the sunroof was factory...but if they were only available on EFI cars, I'm thinking it wasn't. I think it, like yours, was a 1988. I remember for sure it was a white 4-door, with 4 sealed-beam headlights.

 

[CharBaby]

The '86-'89(the most aerodynamic Accords to date @.32Cd), had only 2 sealed beam head lights that were power flip up design as in the earlier Honda Prelude's. Your sisters Accord may have been an even earlier '82-'85 model, and the later Accords from '90 onward had/have sealed housings with replaceible bulbs/lamps as do everything else.

The dealers in my area did use a local detail/modifying shops to install aftermarket sunroofs(manual and power) in many of their car. There may have been a aftermarket power sunroof that fit these cars.

But, a person(like myself), would have to be very Honda savey to know all of the details in Honda autos from year-year & model-model. As would someone who knows all the details from year to year on Corvettes/Harley's(my buddy).

But, no one cares this much about Honda's to know this much. I do because I drove'em for a long time and they were so reliable for me that they became a good friend.

But, as we were talking earlier, yes, Honda cars could be a vacuum nightmere but, in most cases they did it better than other MFG's.

 

[skate1968]

Hi Folks,

My car now overheats roughly every 5 miles. Hence i now carry 4 gallons of water in the trunk.

As many problems as my 91 civic has i still take comfort in the fact that i know that they are all relatively simple fixes. The car does not shout "complicated OBDIIb computer problem -- go to the stealership and get raped!"

Originally Posted By: skate1968
Wanting to make myself feel nice.


My gosh. It's as if i'm asking a bunch of mechanics to help me get in touch with my soft feminine side.

but seriously, thanks to all of you for the help

i will let you know whatever comes of this

regards

 

[whip]

You live in Philly. If you can find one with out rust, go for it.

 

[skate1968]

Thanks, whip!

I appreciate what you're saying. But i was thinking more along the lines of finding one without rust that i can't grind out, paint and prime over myself.

(granted i might be overestimating my ability to control and contain "body cancer."

)

regards

 

[skate1968]

Hi CTRC & Css,

thanks for posting

Originally Posted By: ctrcbob
Not all Hondas are trouble free.


I do somewhat agree. But i'll also add that the folks at the honda forum instructed me as to how to make my "unfixable" car feel like a porsche (like a porsche by my standards). I've found excellent info after reading over all of the "how to build a race car" posts.

Granted i don't know accords at all.

regards,

Originally Posted By: css9450
Lots of electrical issues and it would never start in the winter if the temperature was below about -10 degrees.


Had those same problems. Best advice i got was that electrical parts need to be "dealer parts" -- alternators, starter, etc. NAPPA is fine for break pads, axles, etc but NOT electrical parts.

regards

Skate

 

[skate1968]

Thanks, JarAxle & CharB. Appreciate reading of your honda experiences.

 

[skate1968]

Bump

Update on my misadventures in car shopping

I am realizing that i am in a small minority as i bought a 91 civic in 1999 because it was a grand below blue book value. Also because I am not a grandmother still driving the car that she bought new.

I did NOT buy a fourth generation civic (an "EF") because it is allegedly "tuned more often than any other car in the world." I am not a kid looking build a ghettofabulous racing car from integra engines found in junkyards. I have no desire to wire a 2006 acura, dual overhead cam engine in to a featherweight, 1988 honda civic.

What i'm getting at is that the price of Fourth Generations is insane. The Kelly blue book value of a fourth generation civic is sometimes the price of what they're selling the shells for. They want you to pay more than blue book for a car with NO engine!!!

This poor man's sports car truly was an excellent alternative for those who couldn't afford a sports car. But now the price of the economy class, poor man's race car has exceeded the price of the rich man's sports cars that honda owners wanted to emulate.

The premium that people are asking for fourth generation civics is outrageous. It defeats much of the purpose of owning a civic. Unless grandmom happens to bump in to me and tell me that she's ready to sell I really need to broaden my options.

Originally Posted By: eljefino
You probably want the proverbial old lady car.


absolutely, all of us EF people do, we dream about it

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Hondas attract fans and you may have to pay dearly for one.


Yes, and the term "fan" is a big understatement.


thanks for reading

 

[skate1968]

Technical details about honda engines:

B18C5, VTEC
Found in: USDM DC2 Acura Integra Type-R (Integra Type-R)
1997–2001 Integra Type-R
[edit]
Compression: 10.6:1
Power: 195 hp (145 kW) @ 8000rpm & 131 lb·ft (178 N·m), etc.


In layman's terms

The fact that you can easily replace the stock 92 horsepower in your fourth generation civic with a junkyard 195 horsepower engine causes fourth generation civics to sell at a premium. This is a "bolt on" swap -- no cutting, welding or fabrication neede.