Wal-Mart fined for off-grade SuperTech Gear Oil

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Originally Posted By: buster
No I don't think they do. They probably could run all the engine sequence tests, but they don't certify AFAIK. Double check..

Ashland ran tests several months ago of many 5w30 conventional oils at a local auto parts store. Many failed the shear stability test.


I'm going to say they do. And here's my reasoning:

The chairman of the API is also the chairman of ExxonMobil.
 
Quote:
The chairman of the API is also the chairman of ExxonMobil.


So who do you trust? Comes down to the trust of the blender.
 
Originally Posted By: buster
Quote:
The chairman of the API is also the chairman of ExxonMobil.


So who do you trust? Comes down to the trust of the blender.


What it means is that ExxonMobil and the API are REALLY close.


Also, from an API PDF:

American Petroleum Institute
CRE
Subcommittee on Inspection
Task Force on
Individual Certification Programs
May 3rd, 2006
Dallas, TX

ATTENDEES – MEMBERS:
1. E. Blanchard Mosaic Co.
2. R. Dolejs UOP
3. F. Furillo ExxonMobil
4. F. Haydar Shell Chemicals
5. P. Hunt Shell
6. K. Jones Pro-Inspect
7. R. Nichols, Chairman Roddey Engineering Services
8. J. O’Brien Chevron
9. J. Peterson ExxonMobil
10. J. Reynolds Shell Global Solutions
11. J. Richardson CodeWest
12. J. Riley Chevron
13. R. Schubert Shell Canada
14. R. Smallwood DNV
15. K. Smith ConocoPhillips, Inc.
16. P. Smith Consultant
17. K. Tam Consultant
18. T. Briskin API
19. S. Carson API

.............
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: buster
No I don't think they do. They probably could run all the engine sequence tests, but they don't certify AFAIK. Double check..

Ashland ran tests several months ago of many 5w30 conventional oils at a local auto parts store. Many failed the shear stability test.


I'm going to say they do. And here's my reasoning:

The chairman of the API is also the chairman of ExxonMobil.


I think I see the problem now.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: endeavor to persevere
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: buster
No I don't think they do. They probably could run all the engine sequence tests, but they don't certify AFAIK. Double check..

Ashland ran tests several months ago of many 5w30 conventional oils at a local auto parts store. Many failed the shear stability test.


I'm going to say they do. And here's my reasoning:

The chairman of the API is also the chairman of ExxonMobil.


I think I see the problem now.


Most people have no clue just how big ExxonMobil is........
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Does ExxonMobil not certify oils?


Historically passenger car engine oil specifications used by the API in their engine oil category system were developed within ASTM by the ASTM Passenger Car Engine Oil Classification Panel, which then published them in ASTM D 4485, Standard Specification for Performance of Engine Oils.

ASTM then provided calibration materials and other technical support to labs wishing to conduct oil certifications.

Starting with GF-4 the specification was developed outside of the ASTM consensus process by ILSAC.

The ASTM, however, still provides substantial technical support to the industry and to labs interested in doing testing to standards:

http://www.astm.org/Standards/D6709.htm

and the ASTM Test Monitoring Center (TMC) provides a calibration service to those laboratories that supply performance data for product verification in tests such as the API Sequence tests.

There are labs which do this testing for a fee, the additive companies typically have formulations which are certified and are available to those using their additives, and the major oil companies all have fully equipped labs capable of running the API sequences and much more.

The cost for testing a passenger car motor oil formulation the last time I talked to anyone on it was in the range of a quarter million dollars. That of course could vary depending on whether the formula passed the tests the first time or required multiple test runs with formula modifications. Certification for a Heavy Duty Diesel formula was in the range of a half million.

Most of the major oil companies have their own proprietary formulas developed, tested and licensed.

Also, the majors regularly buy and test other majors' formulas.

The notion that Ashland has access to tests or procedures that ExxonMobil does not is wishful thinking.




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Originally Posted By: endeavor to persevere
I think I see the problem now.


Unlikely.

The API is an industry group, not a government watchdog.




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Seems like a conflict of interest to me. I used to push API certifications but I am about to waver from that position seeing how little integrity there is.
 
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Originally Posted By: Bryanccfshr
Seems like a conflict of interest to me.


All trade associations are populated by people in the trade.

Who do you suggest, Janet Reno?




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Originally Posted By: buster
http://www.valvoline.com/pages/media/index.asp

7th video down. They are the only oil company that can qualify oils.


Apparently you're the guy Valvoline is aiming their ads at.

http://www.oilanalysis.com/article_detail.asp?articleid=227&relatedbookgroup=OilAnalysis

http://www.exxonmobil.com.sg/NA-English/Files/2006_EMPR_Fact_Sheet.pdf

http://www.sae.org/news/releases/04horning.htm

There are dozens more.

ExxonMobil has complete lab and testing facilities to do everything from basic research, process engineering, formulation, lubricant evaluation on everything from hand tools to space shuttles.

Yes, they can run API sequence tests.



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Originally Posted By: Rolf
Originally Posted By: buster
It's XOM's silence that is swaying people.

All six or so of you.


06.gif
 
I'm aware of XOM's capabilities. I've posted two of those links before. It doesn't address the claims being made against them.

IMO XOM picked up on it as well and because it did fail, they are silent.

That article on their labs does not mention they can quality oils though. Or did I over look it?
 
Originally Posted By: Rolf
Originally Posted By: buster
It's XOM's silence that is swaying people.


All six or so of you.






.


You wish, this is on every automotive forum out there. And its not good for XOM.
 
Originally Posted By: endeavor to persevere
You wish, this is on every automotive forum out there.


Pardon me.

All two dozen of you.

The whole Group III hoopla did the same thing with many of the same players.

Not a blip on Mobil 1 sales.

You may notice that all the oil professionals and all the automotive service professionals have taken a "wait and see" attitude.

Facts are what is needed.



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