Valvoline Synpower Oil Treament

Motorbike · Aug 18, 2004

This is the product in the grey 15 ounce bottle .

Iron 1
Aluminum 1
Lead 5
Tin 10
Sodium 3
Potassium 10
Moly 234
Boron 289
Calcium 85
Magnesium 24
Phos 1578
Zinc 1565
Antimony 30

VI @ 100c 232.7
VI Index 228
TBN 2.58

I think some of the metals come as a part of the Antimony " trio or tri " I forget .

And the red bottle 15 ounce Valvoline Maxlife Additive copied and pasted here from other samples posted previously for comparison in one link for an easier view .

Al 3
Silicon 0
Sodium 12
Potassium 11
Molybdenum 489
Phosphorus 567
Zinc 625
Calcium 240
Magnesium 57

TAN 0.9
TBN 8
VI @ 100c 15.3

The Schaeffer's # 132 Moly EP Treatment

Chromium 1
Nickel 1
Lead 3
Tin 1
Silver 0.3
Vanadium 3
Moly 23
Phosphorus 104
Zinc 6
Antimony 23

Vi @ 40c 2545.6
Vi @ 100c 238.5
VI Index 232
TAN 0.17
TBN 0.34

[ August 19, 2004, 02:09 PM: Message edited by: Motorbike ]

TallPaul · Aug 19, 2004

I will throw in one other "additive," Redline Oil. Why not use it as an additive? Their tech told me that the 10w30 and 10w40 Redline has:

Moly: 950
Zinc: 1400
Phosphorus: 1300

More moly than any of the above, and both Z and P are about 2.5 x the MLEP and are getting close to the levels in the SPOT (SynPower Oil Treatment). I may return my unopened MLEPs and just go with 1/2 quart Redline as an additive (priced about the same as the SPOT). Also the Redline will give me some esters for better "Start Up."

dropitby · Aug 19, 2004

Thanks a lot Motorbike

Those adds. are great especially #132. You did forget Synergyn Add. which you posted before so how do we know which one to use.I just changed oil on my Toyota Mobil 1 10/30 and used a pint of Redline to hold the VI.I need coaching like with LC on how much to use. It does tell you on the label but putting a whole pint of #132 seems excessive they just want you to use it up.

Motorbike · Aug 19, 2004

He He I really don't use these additives I just like to look

MolaKule · Aug 19, 2004

For the 132, I use a rule of thumb of 1 oz./qt. for daily drivers, and for Light Trucks, 2 oz./qrt.

This will keep you from thickening up your oil's viscosity out of grade.

TallPaul · Aug 19, 2004

Well I am kind of between going with Redline and going with the Synpower Oil Treatment. Going to get more zinc and phosphorus with the OT, and since it is manufactured as an additive, there is no question about it's compatability with various oils, though I doubt Redline would be a problem. I can get the same moly level as Maxlife EP by using only 8 oz Redline.

The Maxlife stuff, while it has a fair slug of Moly appears to have less zinc and phosphorus than regular oil. It would actually reduce your zinc phosphorus levels, but maybe that is factored in when they put the extra moly. But I do think I will return the Maxlife, probably get the Synpower in exchange.

I find it disturbing that Valvoline reps told me these two products were similar. Guess they are in that they are both oil additives, but... Also, it seems clear the MSDS sheets being identical is either wrong, or so loosely stated as to cover both products. And the Synpower Oil Treatment product sheet actually says 2700 ppm of zinc, way higher than the VOA shows. At any rate, it appears you need to use an entire bottle of either of these products to make a significant difference in zinc, phosphorus, and/or moly levels.

Also, what is the function of boron in the OT?

Finally, does anyone know of a motor oil so chok full of goodies that it could be used as an additive? I am thinking a bit more zinc phosphorus than Redline and maybe not needing as much moly as Redline.

quote:

Originally posted by Motorbike:
He He I really don't use these additives I just like to look

Whatcha gonna do with the remainder of the Synpower Oil Treatment? Maybe for fun, you could pour the whole thing in your lawn mower!

Motorbike · Aug 19, 2004

Are you certain that the MSDS says in PPM and not 27% by weight ?

The have the MSDS's mixed up . For the last time ever

this is heavy PAO and thats why they performed a TFOUT test on it and not the Maxlife .

I would just use any additive to enhance an oil not reformulate it. At 3k miles with a full crankcase you could add 5 ounces of the Valvoline stuff no problem . What would 5 ounces of Redline do for you ?

If either of the Valvoline's could produce effective results at 1 ounce per quart treat rate thats 3 treats per bottle . Enhance is the key word here . An entire bottle used might be called
reformulating

Take care , enjoy the analysis's as I just posted out of curiosity . The forum argues enough about which oil is best . I don't want to be a part of how is the best way to reformulate an oil with an over the counter additivetopic

Motorbike · Aug 19, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by TallPaul:

Whatcha gonna do with the remainder of the Synpower Oil Treatment? Maybe for fun, you could pour the whole thing in your lawn mower!

[/QUOTE]

It would just start smoking . Nope , that was when I ran pure Lucas Oil Stabilizer in it once

TallPaul · Aug 19, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Motorbike:
Are you certain that the MSDS says in PPM and not 27% by weight ?

Says 0.27 % by weight, which I understand to be equal to 2700 ppm. This from the tech data sheets not the MSDS:

VALVOLINE SYNPOWER OIL TREATMENT
Technical Data
Appearance Dark, brown liquid
Specific Gravity 0.8983
Viscosity, cSt @ 100 C 100
Zinc, weight % 0.270
Calcium, weight % 0.102
Magnesium, weight % 0.081

But looks like mg and calcium are wrong too. Aaaaaah... it's probably the wrong tech sheet!

TallPaul · Aug 20, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by T-Keith:
Then aren't you assuming that all of the parts have the same weight? -T

Oh yeah, "by weight." Basic chemistry. All the elements have different weights.

Resolves a lot of apparent discrepencies.

JonC · Aug 20, 2004

You are correct, 0.27% is 2700 ppm and the mw and density don't matter because these measurements are based on weight. You would only care about density or mw if you were converting to volume or moles.

Jon

Robbie Alexander · Aug 20, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by TallPaul:
*-*-*-*-*-
Finally, does anyone know of a motor oil so chok full of goodies that it could be used as an additive? I am thinking a bit more zinc phosphorus than Redline and maybe not needing as much moly as Redline.
*-*-*-

Yes. Unless you are a Terry or maybe three others here, I'd say avoid this with the new oils out.
I would guess Terry is best able to take ten different oils and make a blend based on your needs. You, will take a long time to get to the same place... But I'm glad you are having so much FUN>

T-Keith · Aug 20, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by TallPaul:

quote:

Originally posted by Motorbike:
Are you certain that the MSDS says in PPM and not 27% by weight ?

Click to expand...

Says 0.27 % by weight, which I understand to be equal to 2700 ppm. This from the tech data sheets not the MSDS:

Then aren't you assuming that all of the parts have the same weight?

-T

Motorbike · Aug 20, 2004

Hey Paul ,

Since you like 40wts why not run this one a couple years and just change the filter a few times ? Pour Point is -66F and it's made by Chevron . It has all the additives you could want and if used long enough the 5 buck a quart price would be a wash

John Deere 0w-40

Moly 121
Phosphorus 1906
Zinc 1744
Magnesium 17
Calcium 4663
Silicon 11
VI @ 100C 14.92

Want some oil with your Calcium ?

Service Ratings

API ratings (diesel) - CH-4, CG-4, CF-4, CF
API ratings (gasoline) - SL, SJ
John Deere - JDQ 78A
Mack - EO-M Plus
Cummins - CES20076, 72, 71
Allison - C-4
Caterpillar - TO-2
Military - CIDA-A-52306, MIL-L-2104F

Test Analysis 0W-40

Viscosity @ 40°C...... 85.74 cSt
Viscosity @ 100°C...... 15.17 cSt
Viscosity index...... 187
HTHS @ 150°C...... 3.97 cP
Pour point...... -51°C
Flash point...... 230°C
Total base number (TBN)....12.8 mg KOH/g
Sulfated ash level...... 1.57 wt. %

EDIT:

Since you like to brew how about 50/50 this oil and Pennzoil 5w-20 or Chevron 5w-20 ?

[ August 21, 2004, 06:23 AM: Message edited by: Motorbike ]

TallPaul · Aug 20, 2004

Wow Motorbike! That oil has so much zinc, phosphorus, and calcium it might qualify as "Monster Oil."

With that mixed into a home brew I ought to be able to create a Frankenstein's Oil that will plague my motor and cause me grief.

The JD oil would certainly serve to beef up a weaker SM or SL oil, but the more I explore this mixing topic the more I am running scared. I have good UOAs on straight Maxlife and what more could a person want? Must be something in human nature that folks like me just can't be satisfied leaving well enough alone.

The warnings are many and I am backing off on all this home-devised additive business, that is for now. When the SMs come out I may get right back on the mixing bandwagon, but will have to do some UOAs to track it. Since I still kind of like the idea of a little esters, I may have to mix in a little Redline, maybe 8 oz, and run a UOA or two. If it works out, could just run that regularly. The big question would be how the RL moly reacts to the other oil.

[ August 21, 2004, 08:48 AM: Message edited by: TallPaul ]

Motorbike · Aug 20, 2004

The add pack of Synergyn's 5w-50 makes that JD look like baby oil

It's so serious they do not recommend it for the street .

Hey , never guess what ester I have in the old hi mile Ford 302 right now .

Pennzoil makes a refrigerent oil called POE thats compatable with dino's . Two 8 ounce bottles was given to me by a friend and in..they went

Blue99 · Aug 20, 2004

Per Molakule in the other Valvoline Engine Protector thread:

quote:

The base fluid is an Amber-Dyed olefin copolymer, polyisobutylene

My observation is that this carrier has a distinct, sweet odor to it & is the viscosity of thick syrup. Definetly will push up the viscosity of the oil in the sump.

What's the function of the polyisobutylene other than a heavy viscosity synthetic fluid that justifies the "synpower" label?

LOL,BTW, Motorbike, you told Marty/Brian that you were busy knitting a quilt while actually you were out in the garage dumping esters into your engine!

TallPaul · Aug 21, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by JeepZJ4.0:
I also run an extra long filter (FL1A equiv.) to hold the extra amount of oil.

You mean the FL299 equav? Which is 1.5 inches longer than FL1A. The Purolator Premium Plu version, L40017, even has the bypass in threaded end. $6 order at Advance Auto, in next day. Good filter.

Cutehumor · Aug 21, 2004

Valvoline synpower spanks MLEP with Boron, Phos, Zinc, Antimony. Talk about thick.. how much does it cost? Where to buy? Can you tell I've never seen it.

This looks like a good add to beef up some 5w-30 I inherited

[ August 22, 2004, 01:27 PM: Message edited by: Cutehumor ]

JeepZJ4.0 · Aug 22, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by TallPaul:

quote:

Originally posted by JeepZJ4.0:
I also run an extra long filter (FL1A equiv.) to hold the extra amount of oil.

Click to expand...

You mean the FL299 equav? Which is 1.5 inches longer than FL1A. The Purolator Premium Plu version, L40017, even has the bypass in threaded end. $6 order at Advance Auto, in next day. Good filter.

The FL1A is extra long compared to the PH16 I'm supposed to use.

Valvoline Synpower Oil Treament

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