US high school students are dumb as a rock

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Expat reminded me of a teacher I had an high school. He taught physics and chemistry, but he made things entertaining and engaging. In physics, our labs involved some degree of fun, like when we were studying potential and kinetic energy, and how efficiently something converts from potential to kinetic energy. Sounds pretty dry, except when it involved Matchbox cars. We would set up the familiar plastic Matchbox tracks, put a couple of photogates at the end so we could determine the speed of the cars, weigh the cars, measure the height we were starting them at, and determine the kinetic energy of the car at the end of the track. Turns out they are pretty efficient when they don't have bent axles.

Another lab involved frictionless motion, but we didn't mess around with those boring air track carts. He actually built a hovercraft capable of carrying a person. Just a plywood circle with some heavy plastic attached to it forming a bag underneath it, with some holes poked in the plastic. You sat indian-style, holding a small Shop Vac in your lap, and used the exhaust of the Shop Vac running into a hole in the plywood. It actually worked! We would use a spring scale to pull the hovercraft with somebody on board, figure out how much speed it picked up with somebody using a stopwatch and counting tile squares, but we would float down the hallway as the other students played out the extension cord to keep it from pulling back.

I remember the day we were doing it, the district superintendent was visiting our school that day, saw this going on, and was so intrigued he asked if he could take a ride.

It's too bad we don't have more teachers like him, because I think he not only made it fun, but really helped convey the more practical ideas behind why we're learning physics.
 
To those that suggest parent dis-involvement is the problem:

My parents didn't help me one iota. I worked hard in school and becme an engineer. And I a succeeded bc of hard work, not brains. My daughter helps her kids hardcore. They have zero drive and do OK only bc they are all smart. I doubt if any one of them will be successful (comparatively).
 
Parental involvement =/= parental help.

Parental involvement means emphasizing and demonstrating the importance of education and studying, and following up with teachers and school administration to make sure those parties are doing their jobs. It doesn't mean doing lots of work for one's children.
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Parental involvement =/= parental help.

Parental involvement means emphasizing and demonstrating the importance of education and studying, and following up with teachers and school administration to make sure those parties are doing their jobs. It doesn't mean doing lots of work for one's children.


Exactly, We had a new teacher at one of my kids schools who came from an innercity district. She was blown away by the fact most kids had parents show up for conferences because at her old school she would spend conference night reading a book!
 
Originally Posted By: 01rangerxl
The stupidity runs rampant in a much wider age range than that. I have had to deal with 40 somethings who could barely write an intelligible e-mail.

Me too, and some of them have PhD's. It's appalling.
 
Originally Posted By: Al
To those that suggest parent dis-involvement is the problem:

My parents didn't help me one iota. I worked hard in school and becme an engineer. And I a succeeded bc of hard work, not brains.


That's my story too, Al...
 
Originally Posted By: tpitcher
That's my story too, Al...

I know motivation can be "cultured" but different people/kids will respond to a given stimulus in totally different ways, I suppose. With me it was need to be successful (not poor) at a relatively age, coupled with desire to do well in school.
 
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
No surprise, the average person is a moron and half are below average.


You are probably right. The politicians probably find this desireable (dumbing down of America).
It has been said in our founding documents that "all men are created equal" but this is not true with regard to inate intelligence. IMO......some people just don't have the intelligence to learn no matter how much money we spend (dumb as a rock).
 
Quote:
The politicians probably find this desireable (dumbing down of America).

No doubt about that just look around.
Quote:
some people just don't have the intelligence to learn no matter how much money we spend

You mean some people have to be Indians, we all cant be Chiefs?
You heretic.LOL
 
I have to experience this phenomenon every year as a new batch of Freshmen enter one of my classes.

They do NOT value knowing things. In the age of Google, they do not see a reason to use their brain cells to store information when they can use a search engine. Most of my class material is un-googleable and they really struggle.

Keep in mind that we now have an entire generation that has never had to remember a phone number or make change in their head.
 
Nobody ever seems to do anything about the failing educational system. There has to be reasons why it is failing. What do they teach in the average high school today? Whatever happened to history, math, geography, English, some science classes, etc.

I kind of think the answer might be charter schools, with the parents deeply involved in making sure the schools are being run properly.
 
GMorg maybe in a lot of math classes the students should be required to do calcuations on old fashioned paper. And where I work I have to know a lot of telephone numbers so the students better figure out how to remember telephone numbers.

I have a supervisor who tells people to 'Google it' to find an answer. Well, I know how to 'Google it' or 'Bing it' or 'Yahoo it.' And I am 60 years old. But a person can learn a lot just by watching better television shows. I love the History Channels and I watch a lot of history, shows about ancient civilizations, etc. And I don't use a spell check to write these posts, either. I no doubt misspell some words but I don't have to carry a dictionary around (or an iPad or iBook) to be able to spell a great many words with no spell checker.

There needs to be some changes in the schools. And parents need to take some responsibility also. So do the students.
 
Mystic they still teach those subjects or at least try to. But on the other hand Charter schools have been known to have their own failings. Parent involvement is the most important, but if you make any school open to anybody then you also get the parents that could care less and just want someone to baby sit their kid.
 
Originally Posted By: Mystic
Nobody ever seems to do anything about the failing educational system. There has to be reasons why it is failing. What do they teach in the average high school today? Whatever happened to history, math, geography, English, some science classes, etc.

I kind of think the answer might be charter schools, with the parents deeply involved in making sure the schools are being run properly.

There are very distinct reasons why the system is falling apart. There are also a couple approaches that would fix the system... though not overnight. It would take a good 3 to 5 years before the ship started to right itself after changing course.

Nobody ever seems to do anything about "it" because those who understand what is wrong and where/what the changes need to be aren't allowed to make those changes. Instead, the decision makers, those with the power/authority to make meaningful systemic changes are indeed seeking to "change" things by continually repeating the same mistakes over and over again and dressing up those mistakes with new terminology and a zest for the next "new" thing.

Those at the helm refuse to look at the past for a solution. It has to be something new in order to be good in their eyes.

I won't/can't go into any deeper detail because it would probably be deemed as crossing the politics line here despite the fact that the details themselves are entirely apolitical. Suffice it to say that there is a distinct agenda (not of politics but of more of a social justice angle) that has ruined education.
 
It's easy to blame the teachers and unions for abolishing phoenetics when literacy standards drop, and then blame them again when math drops because there's a new "official" system of multiple additions, or long division...

We had to pay for this system as individual parents, and that which we paid for wasn't even allowed to be brought home.
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My mother taught K-3 for ages (HS physics and math at 19), and was annoyed majorly that people could take an adaptation of an age old teaching technique, give it a name, throw a copyright on it, and then individual teacher's adaptations would become copyright infringements.
 
Our local high school reported last week that the year 11 past rate this year was 89%....compared to 48% last year. Maori girls had the biggest increase, from 37% pass to 82%. It's all just smoke and mirrors to make someone look good. They are open book exams, totally pointless.
 
I can appreciate the parental input point of view, but it really depends on the nature of the input. I have to deal with college seniors whose parents want me to change their child's grades. I would hope that by college, a student would be sufficiently independent to leave their parents out of my classroom. I have even had parents call me to get help with their child's homework. Parents that are doing their college-aged child's homework are a significant part of the problems that I have. These helicopter parents hover over the student preventing any development of responsibility.
 
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
I just have to say, when only 26 percent of high school students know what the Bill of Rights is, no wonder it's becoming so easy for the government to take those rights away.


89% of kids in the US go to government paid for "schools".

What motivation do those government run institutions (manned by a corrupt teachers union) have to teach the horrors of large government?

None.

It has every incentive to indoctrinate it's subjects into believing government is good and benevolent.
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Well, yeah. What do you expect?

We as a country don't value education. Teachers are hideously undervalued, not respected, poorly trained, and poorly supported. Our curricula are archaic. There are ridiculous and self-perpetuating disparities between "good" and "bad" schools that we seem completely uninterested in fixing. The push for "accountability" horribly undermines student learning, and favors cheating by teachers and administrations. Very little about the current state of education even resembles well-established information and theory about how kids learn. So much of our education system is carried over from the days when the purpose of the schools was to feed workers -- not good citizens, not people who will advance the nation and society, but workers -- into industry. That's why reading and math trump all, science and social studies suck, and arts are essentially nowhere on the map.

It's really stupid (no pun intended). And it's not going to change until we do.

There is no competition from school to school so as to force improvements or more efficiency. The conditions you list are fully expected because of this. Teachers, administrators, staff....they all get their pay regardless of the jobs they do. Add tenure and unions, and you wind up with a highly static, bloated, and inefficient system that costs a fortune.

This is typical of all government and socialized systems because their is NO INCENTIVE to improve. There is, however GREAT incentive for corruption via the unions and to "save jobs".

The cost of government education has more than doubled since 1970 (INFLATION ADJUSTED) for worse results and yet people think funding is the issue?

http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2010/02/more-on-public-school-spending-dc-vs.html
 
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