UOA - Triumph Speed 1200 RR - Rotella T6 15w-40

[pax]

UOA from 5 track days along with some street riding. Newer engine hopefully explains the iron and aluminum. Oil did shear out of grade but not terribly so. I was surprised to see how low the zinc was. Not sure if that was a result of using it up or not much to start with.

 

[fantastic]

Actually more surprised at the lower Phosphorus level since Ford wants 1000 PPM min. Don't think I've ever seen one this low but these lower numbers are probably from break-in. I'd continue w/your plan & everything should improve around the corner. Great 1st post. Thanks for sharing your Triumph result.

 

[Dutchy491]

If you’re riding your bike aggressively, you say “5 track days”, you better be running an oil better suited!! Isn’t that why you’re doing this analysis? No need to make up any excuses for this very lacklustre oil, in my opinion.
Not sure what is meant by “harmless shearing” either. :>(

 

[RDY4WAR]

I don't get why people like BROtella. No moly FM, low boron, low ZDDP (for an HDMO), and sheared out of grade. Permanent shear is never a good thing.

There isn't much we can tell on the wear metals since this is the first UOA on this engine which is just getting out of the break-in period. I'd check it again at the same mileage or another 5 track days.

Please use a better oil, especially with racing. Rotella is prone to foam/aeration problems and the furthest thing from a racing oil.

 

[pax]

I don't get why people like BROtella. No moly FM, low boron, low ZDDP (for an HDMO), and sheared out of grade. Permanent shear is never a good thing.

There isn't much we can tell on the wear metals since this is the first UOA on this engine which is just getting out of the break-in period. I'd check it again at the same mileage or another 5 track days.

Please use a better oil, especially with racing. Rotella is prone to foam/aeration problems and the furthest thing from a racing oil.

I've used rotella because it comes highly recommended. I haven't heard anything about foaming issues and shearing out of grade seams to be almost universal for most motorcycle oils. I'm happy to hear suggestions though. What you recommend for a mosty track bike that sees very frequent oil changes?

 

[pax]

If you’re riding your bike aggressively, you say “5 track days”, you better be running an oil better suited!! Isn’t that why you’re doing this analysis? No need to make up any excuses for this very lacklustre oil, in my opinion.
Not sure what is meant by “harmless shearing” either. :>(

What would you suggest?

 

[Bonz]

I'd be interested to hear from the folks that mention foaming, and where they have seen foaming cause issues with this oil.

M1 10w40 4T is what I would recommend. Take a sample (don't change it) at a specific interval and see how it has held up. Base changing on how it does. 5,000 mile OCI's in my ZRX1200 and has held grade more times than not. No track days, however mostly miles in the mountains under stress here in Colorado.

With that, break it in a bit more and then you can start seeing what is break-in and what is not with respect to wear numbers.

 

[thescreensavers]

Actually more surprised at the lower Phosphorus level since Ford wants 1000 PPM min. Don't think I've ever seen one this low but these lower numbers are probably from break-in. I'd continue w/your plan & everything should improve around the corner. Great 1st post. Thanks for sharing your Triumph result.

Guess depends on the vintage of T6, iirc when they updated it to CK-4, it's phosphorus level was not high enough to get Ford's rating. But oil was revised to get the Ford's ratings, they increased phosphorus.

 

[pax]

This was a fresh bottle, ck4 sn jaso all printed on the back.

 

[pax]

I'd be interested to hear from the folks that mention foaming, and where they have seen foaming cause issues with this oil.

M1 10w40 4T is what I would recommend. Take a sample (don't change it) at a specific interval and see how it has held up. Base changing on how it does. 5,000 mile OCI's in my ZRX1200 and has held grade more times than not. No track days, however mostly miles in the mountains under stress here in Colorado.

With that, break it in a bit more and then you can start seeing what is break-in and what is not with respect to wear numbers.

I'd be interested to hear from the folks that mention foaming, and where they have seen foaming cause issues with this oil.

M1 10w40 4T is what I would recommend. Take a sample (don't change it) at a specific interval and see how it has held up. Base changing on how it does. 5,000 mile OCI's in my ZRX1200 and has held grade more times than not. No track days, however mostly miles in the mountains under stress here in Colorado.

With that, break it in a bit more and then you can start seeing what is break-in and what is not with respect to wear numbers.

Something in me, probably instilled by my parents at a young age, absolutely refuses to let me spend 12$ a quart on oil. It feels wrong!

 

[RDY4WAR]

I've used rotella because it comes highly recommended. I haven't heard anything about foaming issues and shearing out of grade seams to be almost universal for most motorcycle oils. I'm happy to hear suggestions though. What you recommend for a mosty track bike that sees very frequent oil changes?

By who?

If you look in the sight hole after spirited riding, you'll likely see a lot of foam. I've seen it every time that oil is used. The CK-4 limit on foam is 20 ml (D892) and T6 produced 55 ml.

That VR1 synthetic is a better option. M1 4T 10W-40 is a better option. HPL's motorcycle oil and Amsoil's motorcycle oil would be top shelf options.

 

[Dutchy491]

Yep I agree with the AMSOIL. I’m a long time user and my friends always load up my orders
Check out their site and use their recommendations for your bike. Most likely their Metric in 10-40/15-50.
If you do UOA keep us in the loop, regardless of your choice.

 

[fantastic]

Guess depends on the vintage of T6, iirc when they updated it to CK-4, it's phosphorus level was not high enough to get Ford's rating. But oil was revised to get the Ford's ratings, they increased phosphorus.

I don't remember what previous level it was but 2017 was 7 yrs 7 months ago lol but I suppose some bitogers could have a heavy old stock supply in the garage.

 

[Overfill]

What you recommend for a mosty track bike that sees very frequent oil changes?

Mobil 1 15w-50

 

[GRUMPYDUDE2]

I've used rotella because it comes highly recommended. I haven't heard anything about foaming issues and shearing out of grade seams to be almost universal for most motorcycle oils. I'm happy to hear suggestions though. What you recommend for a mosty track bike that sees very frequent oil changes?

Street - Rotella T6 15w40 = good.
Track - Rotella T6 15w40 = Not good enough!

 

[Dutchy491]

Something in me, probably instilled by my parents at a young age, absolutely refuses to let me spend 12$ a quart on oil. It feels wrong!

Haha.
Now new bikes have gone way up in price since then. So $15-$20 for oil isn't bad now-a-days...LOL
All relative ;>)

 

[Overfill]

Something in me, probably instilled by my parents at a young age, absolutely refuses to let me spend 12$ a quart on oil. It feels wrong!

I can understand that, but you also have to set the standard expectations. Personally, I was pretty big on HDEO, but like @RDY4WAR showed from our sample testing, they aren't consistently meeting the specs they say they do off the shelf. In reality, it doesn't stand mountains above others in affordability--its marginal. If joe blow makes a 12-buck-a-quart oil, I am going to expect that it performs at least cost-proportionately longer than my cheapest options on those conservative intervals. The nice part about this site is that you don't have to carry that torch alone, there is data from others that we can share and discuss to help make those cases if they exist. Eg. @Bonz has done and posted many UOA on M1 4T, and we've discussed it. And those were done proportionately longer than most go on HDEO.

 

[12-Valve]

Actually more surprised at the lower Phosphorus level since Ford wants 1000 PPM min. Don't think I've ever seen one this low but these lower numbers are probably from break-in. I'd continue w/your plan & everything should improve around the corner. Great 1st post. Thanks for sharing your Triumph result.

I saw another analysis from project farm lately of T6 and it is pretty dang close to this one for zinc and phosphorus levels. 822 phosphorus and 919 zinc is what he got.

 

[Bonz]

Appreciate it, Overfill.

Z and P is low now days based on analysis of T6 15w40 for what I would want in a motorcycle engine if I was doing track days and running high rpm consistently and deliberately. For spending as much money on a new bike as a person will, an oil that holds viscosity for 5000 miles seems not overpaying when changing oil that costs half as much twice as often and disposing of 2x the oil and filters. M1 should hold viscosity better than 15w40 T6 doing track days, IMO, with a more appropriate (to me) additive package for any use. Sure, not doing 5000 mile OCI's when running track days, however it's a good time to try some, once, and make a decision based on the results as the oil is being changed frequently. Won't take long to see if it can do 2X the track days.

 

[fantastic]

I saw another analysis from project farm lately of T6 and it is pretty dang close to this one for zinc and phosphorus levels. 822 phosphorus and 919 zinc is what he got.

Always good to see what other comparable information is out there. Most likely PF used BlackStone as well? Other labs have shown a bit higher levels closer to what should be in them. Seems to be BS lab reporting lower. If that was a VOA PF sent in even worse reporting by BS.