Trying to decide between Michelin Defender 2 or Yokohama Avid Ascend GT

[NorthstarredToyota]

FordVWBroncoJetta, you’re in Kansas so snow, but not a huge amount?

Enough to justify getting Michelin Cross Climates?

Do you need V rated (what speed rating on OE tires?)

Or is H rated enough?

V rated

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Comp...17&sortCode=null&rearSortCode=&tireIndex=null


H rated—if that is enough for your car

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Comp...r=&sortCode=null&rearSortCode=&tireIndex=null


https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Comp...r=&sortCode=null&rearSortCode=&tireIndex=null

Consumer reports like General Altimax

One is snow rated, one is not here:

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Comp...r=&sortCode=null&rearSortCode=&tireIndex=null

Firestone “Final” Destination LE (leave earth?) 3

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Comp...r=&sortCode=null&rearSortCode=&tireIndex=null

Firestone still a no for me…

That last link includes a Continental that could be good.

More info on usage—highway, city, snow factor etc might be helpful—and speed rating (more heat than speed really) too.

 

[Crusher]

You have had 6 sets of defender 2's on your expedition? what is that 3 sets a year?
Joking aside, you may have had 6 sets of michelins you didnt have 6 sets of Michelin defender 2.

And while michelin makes many fine tires
The defender 2 is average.. for a high price.

Rand,
You're a Funny Guy!
That's 13 1/2 yrs. My current (6th) set has 30k miles on them. I've found virtually Zero difference in performance between the Defenders, and the Defender 2's.
I run these tires for about about 65-75k miles down to where they have between 5/32"-6/32" of tread remaining and sell them for $300-$350 on Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace. Then I buy a new set in the Spring or Fall with a Michelin/Discount Tire promotion.
Michelin Tires have been a Great Fit!
And I know what I'm doing

 

[OVERKILL]

Rand,
You're a Funny Guy!
That's 13 1/2 yrs. My current (6th) set has 30k miles on them. I've found virtually Zero difference in performance between the Defenders, and the Defender 2's.
I run these tires for about about 65-75k miles down to where they have between 5/32"-6/32" of tread remaining and sell them for $300-$350 on Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace. Then I buy a new set in the Spring or Fall with a Michelin/Discount Tire promotion.
Michelin Tires have been a Great Fit!
And I know what I'm doing

Are you saying you run a car tire on your SUV? Because the Michelin Defender/Defender2, a car tire, is not the same as the Defender LTX M/S2 (formerly LTX M/S and then M/S2, then Defender LTX M/S), the truck and SUV tire, FWIW, and I don't see the Defender/Defender2 listed for your Expedition, just the truck/SUV Defender LTX M/S2:

Defender2:

Defender LTX M/S2:

 

[oil pan 4]

Remember if Michelin kills you with a faulty tire they'll just write a check.
Yokohama is a smaller tire company and can simply not afford to accidentally kill a few thousand people like Goodyear did (a few times).
Yes the michelins are better but they're not nearly $200 a set better.
All I buy since 2018 is Yokohama and Michelin. Prior to 2018 all I was buying was Yokohama, ever since I lived in Japan.

 

[edyvw]

Remember if Michelin kills you with a faulty tire they'll just write a check.
Yokohama is a smaller tire company and can simply not afford to accidentally kill a few thousand people like Goodyear did (a few times).
Yes the michelins are better but they're not nearly $200 a set better.
All I buy since 2018 is Yokohama and Michelin. Prior to 2018 all I was buying was Yokohama, ever since I lived in Japan.

When CR did testing between brands and how they age, the difference in stopping distance between Michelin and Yokohama (which was last, losing most of its initial performance) was around 100ft from 70mph. So, how much money is that precisely worth? $100? 200$?

 

[CapriRacer]

When CR did testing between brands and how they age, the difference in stopping distance between Michelin and Yokohama (which was last, losing most of its initial performance) was around 100ft from 70mph. So, how much money is that precisely worth? $100? 200$?

edyvw,

I couldn't find that testing. I think this might be interesting for my website. Do you have a link?

 

[mco30mco]

Over the summer I picked up a 2022 Dodge Charger Pursuit. It came with some Firestone Firehawks that are bigger than what the car calls for and the front tires are at 3/32nds. With winter approaching I have been shopping for tires. Discount tire price matched these two tires.

Michelin Defender 225 /60 R18 100H - OTD $849.52
or

Yokohama AVID Ascend GT 225 /60 R18 100H - OTD $679.67

From reading up on these tires they seem to do quite good in most categories. I honestly can't decide between the two, they both seem to be very good options for the $$$. Any input would be helpful with choosing.

 

[edyvw]

edyvw,

I couldn't find that testing. I think this might be interesting for my website. Do you have a link?

I don't. I know someone posted here few years back results, or copied results from CR. But I am not a subscriber to CR, so I cannot find old tests. I was able to find this, but I cannot access it:
https://www.consumerreports.org/car...nsumer-reports-treadwear-testing-a5353952733/

I found this too, but what was posted here were actual performance numbers:
https://6abc.com/consumer-reports-tire-treads-driving-auto-news/1011942/

 

[camrydriver111]

I think Defender 2 is rated B for both traction and temp. Does that mean anything these days?

 

[odie]

Find the GTs' ( H-rated ) to have very good rolling resistance and do well on wet roads . The downside for them is a firm ride ,especially feel bumps or imperfections from the road . Last , they're also noisier than the RT43 ( H-rated ) that they replaced . Not likely to purchase the GTs' again . Keep them at 33 > 34 p.s.i. ( 32 recommended ) and they start at 12/32s'. Seem to be losing thread depth fairly quick . The alignment seems good . The GENERAL Altimax RT43 (H) are all time favorite A/S tires for 40+ years of driving .

 

[Rand]

When CR did testing between brands and how they age, the difference in stopping distance between Michelin and Yokohama (which was last, losing most of its initial performance) was around 100ft from 70mph. So, how much money is that precisely worth? $100? 200$?

I'm sure the yokohama are better than 99% of the Standard Touring OEM tires that came on new vehicles.

I had a set of Michelin defender (1's). They were below average round and black. The continential standard touring tires I replaced them with were better at everything.

 

[nickaluch]

AWD and i'd prefer to stay on the road

I just picked up cheap pirelli P4 Persist from simple tire online I called got it even cheaper

 

[Thebigm]

Over the summer I picked up a 2022 Dodge Charger Pursuit. It came with some Firestone Firehawks that are bigger than what the car calls for and the front tires are at 3/32nds. With winter approaching I have been shopping for tires. Discount tire price matched these two tires.

Michelin Defender 225 /60 R18 100H - OTD $849.52
or

Yokohama AVID Ascend GT 225 /60 R18 100H - OTD $679.67

From reading up on these tires they seem to do quite good in most categories. I honestly can't decide between the two, they both seem to be very good options for the $$$. Any input would be helpful with choosing.

Yoko's

 

[edyvw]

I'm sure the yokohama are better than 99% of the Standard Touring OEM tires that came on new vehicles.

I had a set of Michelin defender (1's). They were below average round and black. The continential standard touring tires I replaced them with were better at everything.

Probably they will be better than OE tires. They are always heard toward mpg.

 

[oil pan 4]

When CR did testing between brands and how they age, the difference in stopping distance between Michelin and Yokohama (which was last, losing most of its initial performance) was around 100ft from 70mph. So, how much money is that precisely worth? $100? 200$

Mmmmm not that worried about it.
Since I lose one or 2 tires per set due to people dropping building demo trash on the highway yeah wallet performance is pretty important too.

 

[oil pan 4]

Probably they will be better than OE tires. They are always heard toward mpg.

OEM tires are:
Number 1 above all else cheap!
2, need to get the vehicle sold, quiet smooth ride is the name of the game.
3, longevity is irrelevant once it's sold it's your problem.
4, only needs to have government spec wet and dry performance, no ones doing builders trials on a test drive.

 

[Propflux01]

If you want to out do both those tires, with a price right between the two, try these:

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...tact+LX25&partnum=26HR8CCLX25&fromSurvey=true

I had them on a Tucson. Very good tire.

 

[cbear]

I have been quite disappointed in the Defender 2. Put them on my Dodge Nitro a year ago. Too easy to get wheel spin and have ABS engaging on hard braking. I thought I was getting a quality tire.

 

[edyvw]

Mmmmm not that worried about it.
Since I lose one or 2 tires per set due to people dropping building demo trash on the highway yeah wallet performance is pretty important too.

Ah, finances before safety. It is important to have priorities set.

 

[CapriRacer]

OEM tires are:
Number 1 above all else cheap!
2, need to get the vehicle sold, quiet smooth ride is the name of the game.
3, longevity is irrelevant once it's sold it's your problem.
4, only needs to have government spec wet and dry performance, no ones doing builders trials on a test drive.

I'm sorry, but you've got this almost entirely wrong.

4) I am not aware of any government minimums for traction ANYWHERE on the globe.

3) I agree that OEM's don't care much about tire wear, but they do try. I've heard that 30,000 miles is kind of considered a minimum (with a few exceptions) and, Yes!! they don't always succeed.

2) Yes, smooth and quiet are important for OEM's - but be aware that that adds cost.

1) Cheap means poor quality. The carcass of OE tires are made from the same stuff the rest of the tires are. Complexity adds cost, and every effort is made to make ALL tires inexpensive. What's different about OE tires is the tread. The rubber is designed to give better fuel economy, and they do that by sacrificing wear and/or traction, especially wet traction. In other words, the design goals are different for OE tires.

And, yes!! the OEM's don't pay as much as you or I do, but they buy hundreds of thousands of the same thing, delivered in a steady stream to the same place on a very regular basis. It's easy to set up assembly lines and supply chains when things don't change for years!

I go into more detail here: Barry's Tire Tech: OE Tires