Tranny fluid change-which method?

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Patman

Patman

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This morning I'm gonna take my wife's car to a fast lube place to have the transmission fluid changed.

I just want to be prepared in case they don't have her filter in stock. I want to get them to just simply do a pan drop and filter change, which I realize only gives me 30-40% new fluid. But if they don't have her filter in stock I know they will push their fluid flush service. Is this service good, considering the old filter is still on the car? I had to do that with my Firebird when I bought it since the place didn't have my filter in stock.

So my basic question is, what are the pros and cons of each method? I know the best method would be a 100% full flush, plus the filter change. But given the choice between the other two methods, which would you choose, the full flush with no filter or the conventional pan drop and filter change method?
 
Patman, depends on miles, the transmission, and if I've learned anything special about wear issues from other owners.

My general rule in unknown cases is drop the pan, replace the filter, check wear materials, adjust bands etc, and when I'm comfortable it'll stay together then a flush is how I get a fresh exchange. Keep in mind I do the work myself. I don't do flushes to clean out transmissions. IMO that's an incomplete shortcut unless maybe on a recent vehicle.

If it uses a fibrous filter and not just a pickup screen then the safe bet says get a dealer filter/gasket set and do that first. Have a shop that knows these vehicles do the work. If I recall, Goodyear shops charge $50-75. Quality varies.

Not to spread FUD, but I know of too many cases of problems after flushing a worn trans. Some might have been easily fixed and AAMCO just wanted their rebuild fee but I wasn't involved early enough to be sure. I know what works for me.
smile.gif


FWIW.

David
 
The method of pusing the fluid thru must also include dropping the pan and replacing the filter. If you are not going to do that, then its a waste of time flushing out just the fluid and could be hazardous to the transmission.

I suggest you read this http://www.filtercouncil.org/techdata/tsbs/98-2.html

Another thing to condsider is the quality of the people working in these quick lube places. Around here, a majority of the poeple doing the work are inexperienced young kids who can't chew gum and walk at the same time. I brought a realtives car in for service at one of the best around here (or so I thought) and the fool put regular anti-freeze in a Dex-Cool system and when I caught him in the act, had no idea of the difference. So it cost another 69.95 at the dealer to flush the system. I would not let the quick lube place do it and they refused to pay the dealers charge. The dealer parts guy told me, the quick lubes have been good for their business. Lots of new engines and trans being replaced that are serviced in the quick lube places.

[ December 30, 2002, 08:04 AM: Message edited by: Mike ]
 
Sorry I didn't include more info! Her car is a 2000 Civic sedan, automatic (obviously) and has 40k on it. I'm on my way out the door to get the work done now, so hopefully they'll have the filter in stock.
 
OK, here's the scoop.

Went to the fast lube joint and they told me they can't change the filter on these cars since they don't have a transmission pan! I looked under the car and they were right. I then looked in the owner's manual and it makes no mention of changing a trans filter. So it appears the only way to do it might be via a complete overhaul of the trans (or at least removal from the vehicle anyways) So I had them do the flush method, what other choice did I have? None.

The one problem I had was that when it was done I asked them what fluid they used. They said Dexron III, which the Honda manual says not to use. They then said "oh wait, we have to add some additive to it" and they showed me this additive and it said right on it that it was to modify Dexron III fluid into Honda ATF. Wierd. Does this sound right or is my transmission a disaster waiting to happen now?
confused.gif


They couldn't do the fuel filter either, and I went to a second fast lube place and they said that imports are too hard and time consuming so they don't do it.
 
quote:
Originally posted by Patman:
OK, here's the scoop.

Went to the fast lube joint and they told me they can't change the filter on these cars since they don't have a transmission pan! I looked under the car and they were right. I then looked in the owner's manual and it makes no mention of changing a trans filter. So it appears the only way to do it might be via a complete overhaul of the trans (or at least removal from the vehicle anyways) So I had them do the flush method, what other choice did I have? None.

The one problem I had was that when it was done I asked them what fluid they used. They said Dexron III, which the Honda manual says not to use. They then said "oh wait, we have to add some additive to it" and they showed me this additive and it said right on it that it was to modify Dexron III fluid into Honda ATF. Wierd. Does this sound right or is my transmission a disaster waiting to happen now?
confused.gif


They couldn't do the fuel filter either, and I went to a second fast lube place and they said that imports are too hard and time consuming so they don't do it.
Click to expand...
honda does use Dexron III and adds an additive package..really they shouldnt..i dont know why...iono maybe that company is cutting corners, i myself work on accords, and some civics and never heard that. dont get no flush thing...
for the fuel filter ITS A DROP IN FILTER...takes like 5 minutes..in not exactly sure on the civics but mainly all hondas now are drop in filter...u can basically do that ur self. what idiots
 
if u want specifics on civics there is a forum called superhonda. everyone has had differnt experiances and use a forum like this one. its kinda controlled, but opinons are more open. u can try it, i go there to get tips as well.... www.superhonda.com . my screen name there is accordztech and there are alot of helpfull people there, but there is also the idiots..hehe cant get rid of those. sorrie if im kind of brief on my last post but im kinda sleepy haha. ill look into ur delema on other honda pages for ya though..
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike:
Very reassuring, those at the quick lube places, hey?

I won't ever go to one of those again, they don't care. If they would have told you, they had to add something to Dexron, would you have let them do it in the first place?
Click to expand...
Nope. I'm kicking myself for not just going straight to the Honda dealer. It's the price I pay for wanting to get it done quick though.

banghead.gif
 
quote:
honda does use Dexron III and adds an additive package
Click to expand...
Actually, according to my manual it says to use nothing but Honda ATF. It says that if Dexron III is the only thing available, it's good only for a temporary run, as it can mess up the shifting.

So I guess I'm the guinea pig. The lease is up in Oct 2003, so if it starts shifting weird on me, I'll just hand the car back in and play dumb.
smile.gif
 
hey i went to honda today. well they sold me some at fluid z1 or soemthing. i talked to the guy that im cool with and he said that the shop uses not Dexron III but hondas own formula with no additives. usually they put the new fluid in teh car and then they drive it, and then drain and fill it again. this is because we dont have a drain for our torque converter. so i asked him why does the book sometimes say use Dexron III/II he said that it is used as a temporary solution ONLY.

honda here dont use a pump becuase its bad for the torque converter...drain and fill is the best way. here they only charge about 30 bucks for htis process, though im in california. im doing my transmission service tonight.

they sell only this kind of fluid...."honda genuine automatic transmission fluid ATF-z1, advanced protectoin. cost me about 2.40 per quart and i bought 6 quarts...look around and ask about hondas transmission fluid...they told me additives should not be used period...
 
Patman, I've learned about Honda transmissions and fluid by default when I was kinda bequeathed an old acura integra. Honda automatics (that I've researched) have no pan and many have no filter (including mine). My manual calls for use of Dexron II or Honda Genuine fluid. While changing fluid and perusing an application sheet from Quaker State there was an asterisk next to my vehicle that said "use Dexron II do not use Dexron III". This set me off in a tizzy as it is near impossible to find Dex II anymore and Honda fluid is between $4-$5 per quart.
I wrote in to the auto column guy at the Chicago Trib (Motormouth) and also found a Honda Master tech whose bread and butter is trans repair/rebuilding. Both stated that Honda fluid has an additive of some kind of highly friction modified substance that is unique for Honda transmissions. Both said that Honda genuine is the way to go. But an acceptable alternative (which ends up being the same price after you buy the 10 oz bottle is the Lubegard black bottle highly friction modified supplement ($12 at Napa). They both said that the new Honda ZF transmission fluid is modified Dex III. The trans guy also stated that though Honda uses no filters, that if they replace a trans under warranty, they put an inline filter in (hmmmmmm). Anyway, trans will shift best with this stuff. I had wrg fluid in for about 100 mi and changed it out th Honda Genuine-it does make a difference. Don't ask me why. Have heard to use nothing but Honda power steering fluid as well and coolant, which is silicate free. Go figure.
 
Very reassuring, those at the quick lube places, hey?

I won't ever go to one of those again, they don't care. If they would have told you, they had to add something to Dexron, would you have let them do it in the first place?
 
they dont use Dexron II ne more, it is substututed for Dexron III....my manual says use Dexron II or oem..but some manuals say to not use Dexron at all...haha man i been using Dexron all my life. we dont have a filter, only a screen...sometimes if ur transmission does not shift right or jerks that means that ur screen may be clogged....im trying to do oem transmission in my car but i cant get the bolt off...if u read my forum "best way to flush transmission fluid" u will see my experiances...not many helped me on my bolt prob though
 
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