My 300,000 mile 1MZ-FE and 160,000 mile 1MZ-FE running Toyota filters agrees.
I will stick to the Toyota filters on it.
Toyota oil filter light leak
- Thread starter GI_GRIFF
- Start date
I will stick to the Toyota filters on it.
Where did that photo come from? If it's from Ascent's testing then I'd say these leaf springs were not leakers, and hence those filters came in efficient as advertised in the test. Both leaf springs for the two left filters (Ultra and RP) look pretty smooth and ruffle free to me - see zoom-ins below.But RP is a clone of Fram Endurance isn’t it? Are you then assuming the RP tested in both Ascent and its ISO had no ruffles or leaks?? In the top pic there doesn’t “appear” to be ruffles…. But if you zoom on the bottom pic, there still appears to be slits below the leaf springs on both filters in some spots.
Endurance vs RP
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The fact is, if there is any level of leakage at the leaf spring it's going to decrease the efficiency accordingly. Nothing is ever going to change that fact.
Fram the Ultra. Keep in mind that the Ultra Ascent tested was an OG Ultra with the fiber leaf spring gasket, so pretty much guarantee it was not leaking at all.
The Royal Purple leaf spring looks pretty smooth to me, so it came in pretty high efficiency too. The more warped and ruffled a leaf spring is, the more it's going to leak and the more it's going to decrease the efficiency. That's how it works, and always will work since physics doesn't change.
Yes, I pointed out both looked smooth nonetheless, we have what appears to be gaps below both Fram and RP in these close up shots
RP top Fram bottom
That’s Fram Endurance in the photos
And this is at the heart of this controversy>>>
“ Decreased Efficiency “ notwithstanding…..,
Do you accept the Fram Endurance ISO as stated as well as Its RP clone AND the likely possibility that BOTH had imperfect leaf spring contact as tested?
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Considering almost every example of these filters shown was "leaking" with the flashlight test it is very likely that they were also "leaking" when tested.
So 99%+ at 20 Microns with "leaking" included.
Bingo
Nobody can make any conclusions on those photos - "seeing" something that most likely doesn't exist. Need to do a light test to check for leak gaps. Grasping for "hope" that they have big leak gaps and still tested at 99% @ 20u ... which would be impossible unless the leak was below 1%, even less since the media has to let some through too, as I highly doubt the media itself is 100% @ 20u. So based on the actual leaf spring, the RP in Ascents test most likely wasn't much if any kind of leaker.Yes, I pointed out both looked smooth nonetheless, we have what appears to be gaps below both Fram and RP in these close up shots
RP top Fram bottom
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Then where did that photo come from, because Ascent did not test an Endurance. Nerveless, as said both of those leaf springs look smooth, so not a leaker like a big ol' ruffeled leaf spring would be.
No ... like I've said many times, if a filter with no internal leakage tested at 100% @ 20u, then there's no way it can ISO 4548-12 test at 99% @ 20u if the leak is bigger than 1%. If it's not leaking any at the leaf spring, and it ISO tested at 99% @ 20u, then that 1% loss in efficiency was simply from the media letting 1% of the debris pass through.
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Only way a filter could come in at 99% @ 20u is if the total amount of a particulate that got on the clean side of the filter was what went though the media combined with what got through from a leak path - the total amount of particles that got through, regardless of how. So based on the size of the leak gaps seen here, there is no way that those filters could have ISO tested at 99% @ 20u with a 10% to 15% leak going past the media - not even with a leak more than 1%.
Those look smooth to me and not leakers.
The ruffled leakers are obvious.
This Endurance with a particle count of 15 most likely is a leaker.
The ruffled leakers are obvious.
This Endurance with a particle count of 15 most likely is a leaker.
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I’m not taking issue with them being “smooth “
Take another look here… there appears to be small gaps under the leaf springs
RP on top Endurance below.
Can't make any conclusion based on those photos, or even by the view angle. Looks like shadows to me. Still grasping on to the hope that filters are still 99% @ 20u with big leak gaps on the leaf spring, lol. You never said where this video snap-shot came from. Not from Ascent either, so can't try to connect this rabbit hole dive effort to "prove" that leaky filters are still making efficiency claims. As said, the leak would have to below 1% to retain 99% @ 20u, and that's if the media itself was 100% @ 20u to start with. It was discussed in another thread, but there is also a super small leakage going on through the base plate mounting treads, but it's so small that it basically zero.
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Double blind effectively
Test 10-20 filters of the exact kind
have them disassembled by third party and see how each matches test results
Test 10-20 filters of the exact kind
have them disassembled by third party and see how each matches test results
Here's the actual leaf springs in the Royal Purple and OG Ultra that Ascent tested. Snap-shot from one of his videos showing the filters disassembled.
Royal Purple on the left, and OG Ultra on the right. Both show ZERO ruffles. Leaf springs stamped out like they should be.
Royal Purple on the left, and OG Ultra on the right. Both show ZERO ruffles. Leaf springs stamped out like they should be.
From the rabbit hole video - note that video was uploaded well over two years ago, back when Champ Labs knew now to stamp smooth leaf springs.
The Fram Endurance is on the left, and the Royal Purple on the right. Both have ZERO ruffles. Smooth, like a leaf spring stamping should be. Too bad it seems like some kind of difficult rocket science these day to simply stamp out a smooth leaf spring.
The Fram Endurance is on the left, and the Royal Purple on the right. Both have ZERO ruffles. Smooth, like a leaf spring stamping should be. Too bad it seems like some kind of difficult rocket science these day to simply stamp out a smooth leaf spring.
Would have been better to show the side that mates with the top of filter!
No matter, it appears there still remains a gap in the pics I posted even with the “smooth” surfaces.
BTW your pic shows
This ???
Love to see a FLASHLIGHT inserted into these two!!!
