Sure there is value in doing UOAs reguarly even if the stats aren't perfect/fall in the 30 rule. Looks at my data....these data have value. The trends follow the repairs, modifications, issues etc. to a "T". Sure, can you compare M1 to LM without a lot of each? Not really but for my purposes of general trends, viscosity, it works fine.
Toyota 0w-8 FF, 2.3k mi; 2025 Camry
- Thread starter hitechrr
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I'd trust Mobil 1 over almost any other 0w8 (or any weight for that matter). E-M knows what they're doing when it comes to motor oil.
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Do you plan on going to a higher weight once out of warranty?
I Myself would not change out the FF that early, especially when it has high moly as an additive.
Pretty clear that High Moly is used to protect bearings during such periods whin the ultra-thin oil film is comprised for eaven a second or two. Its not used in heavier oils bc of oil cost and ability for the thicker film oil to protect. One reason both my vehicles will always have 500 ppm moly in them one way or another.
The high moly count is from the engine assembly lube, not the oil.
How do you know it’s not in the oil? Some factory fill oils absolutely use an oil with higher moly.
Actually, thats not true. TGMO 0w-8 and 0w-16 are loaded with moly at levels around 700ppm.
What would be interesting is an early sample and then a sample at 10,000 using the same oil (not changed)
Because i bet it has made practically all the metal it is going to make by 1000 miles and the results wouldn't be drastically different.
Interesting BlackStone didn't seem to mention how many miles are on the universal average.
Agree with SRR, there numbers are small.
IMO nothing gained by early change.
Because i bet it has made practically all the metal it is going to make by 1000 miles and the results wouldn't be drastically different.
Interesting BlackStone didn't seem to mention how many miles are on the universal average.
Agree with SRR, there numbers are small.
IMO nothing gained by early change.
Metallic engine manufacturing bits and debris as well as engine wear in metal shavings has the POSSIBILITY of causing more harm vs what Moly could ever overcome.
Certain Bob’s on here are hilarious to me.
We strive to find the BEST Oil and couple that together with the BEST Filter, (some even add a Bypass Filtration System to add EVEN MORE filtration ability) in order to have the CLEANEST Oil Possible, in order to have the LEAST engine wear —> DUE TO FREAKIN PARTICLES IN THE OIL CAUSING THE ACTUAL ENGINE WEAR yet when it comes to getting Break-in particles out of the engine as quickly and early as possible, some say “it’s perfectly fine” to leave all that JUNK in the oil and allow it to circulate thru the engine for THOUSANDS OF MILES.
What a joke. 
I would tolerate such comments from random uneducated NPC members on car forums but seeing this on an Oil Forum is truly SAD.
An engine is worn in within the first 30 minutes of running after assembly. Anything after that is stuck particles being dislodged and washing out.
The sooner you drain that out, the sooner the engine will be producing ZERO WEAR and the healthier it will be in the long run. Period.
How this is still debatable in 2024 just shows that the tree huggers have infiltrated our forums and along with bots from the auto manufacturers are trying to get your engine to wear out sooner, so you: GO BUY A NEW CAR.
Triple_Se7en
$50 Site Donor 2024
Wife and I have-had 13 new vehicles since 1970 and always used the 3k OCI religion when new.
Never a problem and all badly rusted vehicles were driven to junkyards around 20 years later..... still running well and not losing more than a quart in a 3k OCI. They probably averaged 300k in mileage.
Will we see 300k on these-2 Hyunkias we own now?...... no way Jose! Not even 175k on our-2 city-driven vehicles. These-2 historically shed debris from birth until death.... lol. I bought both of these to test and show the world I will beat the odds of the 2.0 and 2.4 being labeled junk engines. Boy was I nuts thinking that.
I am going to lose this bet, unless the wife finally agrees to sell these-2 Hyunkias premature of old age. Otherwise, they may be only 10-15 years old with 175k, when towed to a junkyard somewhere because of a grenaded engine. Or, in 10 more years, my Atrial-Afib and her Aneurysm will have finally put us in plastic bags.
How long will engines live on 0w8 oil?....... depends on the individual engine manufacturer's history. The Sun may darken every day at Noon, before we see Hyunkia Owners Manuals stipulate 0w8 oils.
Never a problem and all badly rusted vehicles were driven to junkyards around 20 years later..... still running well and not losing more than a quart in a 3k OCI. They probably averaged 300k in mileage.
Will we see 300k on these-2 Hyunkias we own now?...... no way Jose! Not even 175k on our-2 city-driven vehicles. These-2 historically shed debris from birth until death.... lol. I bought both of these to test and show the world I will beat the odds of the 2.0 and 2.4 being labeled junk engines. Boy was I nuts thinking that.
I am going to lose this bet, unless the wife finally agrees to sell these-2 Hyunkias premature of old age. Otherwise, they may be only 10-15 years old with 175k, when towed to a junkyard somewhere because of a grenaded engine. Or, in 10 more years, my Atrial-Afib and her Aneurysm will have finally put us in plastic bags.
How long will engines live on 0w8 oil?....... depends on the individual engine manufacturer's history. The Sun may darken every day at Noon, before we see Hyunkia Owners Manuals stipulate 0w8 oils.
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I bought a 2025 Camry hybrid almost 4 months ago (bought it early December, live in Michigan) and have put 7000 miles on it so far. I did a little experiment with oils in those 7000 miles. I wanted to hear and feel the engine and see if there were any differences in how it drove, MPG's, etc.
First 1600 miles I had the factory 0W-8 in it, and then swapped it out for 0W-20. Then I tried 0-30, and finally 5-30. Conclusion: 0-8 is never going in it again - had metallic engine sounds and was fairly loud. 0-20 was a bit quieter and less harsh, but not by a lot. 0-30 seemed quieter once again and no harsh sounds. And the biggest change I thought was going from the M1 AFE 0-30 to PP 5-30. With 5-30, the engine was very quiet, and harder to tell when the engine was kicking off and on while driving. Was a little scary actually how quiet it was at times. Hitting the gas I got the sense there was more pressure in the engine... sounded stuffy, but if there was more drag, it didn't affect the MPG's.
MPG's were the same most likely with all oils. It was warm out when I had the 5-30 in there, and I got well over 60 mpg on a few 15 mile trips on paved backroads going 55 and under. This car likes to default to the lowest RPMs whenever possible. Cruising steady at 55mph, it is around 1000. At 80mph, if the highway is flat and I'm just maintaining that speed, it runs at about 1400 RPM. Is there anything to think about in regards to low RPMs and oil weight?
Crazy experiment I guess, but I like the way it sounds and drives with the 0-30. So I went back to 0-30 and now will run it around 4000 miles before changing again. Was just trying to see what she liked to drink.
First 1600 miles I had the factory 0W-8 in it, and then swapped it out for 0W-20. Then I tried 0-30, and finally 5-30. Conclusion: 0-8 is never going in it again - had metallic engine sounds and was fairly loud. 0-20 was a bit quieter and less harsh, but not by a lot. 0-30 seemed quieter once again and no harsh sounds. And the biggest change I thought was going from the M1 AFE 0-30 to PP 5-30. With 5-30, the engine was very quiet, and harder to tell when the engine was kicking off and on while driving. Was a little scary actually how quiet it was at times. Hitting the gas I got the sense there was more pressure in the engine... sounded stuffy, but if there was more drag, it didn't affect the MPG's.
MPG's were the same most likely with all oils. It was warm out when I had the 5-30 in there, and I got well over 60 mpg on a few 15 mile trips on paved backroads going 55 and under. This car likes to default to the lowest RPMs whenever possible. Cruising steady at 55mph, it is around 1000. At 80mph, if the highway is flat and I'm just maintaining that speed, it runs at about 1400 RPM. Is there anything to think about in regards to low RPMs and oil weight?
Crazy experiment I guess, but I like the way it sounds and drives with the 0-30. So I went back to 0-30 and now will run it around 4000 miles before changing again. Was just trying to see what she liked to drink.
Very low RPMs provide the least centering force in bearings and provide the least hydrodynamic lift in the valvetrain. I like your experiments and what you observed is what I would expect. Break-in was occurring all during that time, so some of the sound improvements may have come from that too.
Go review some HPL VOA/UOAs and get back to us…
Yeah , that free oil change crap, is just that crap, and really they do this just to sell you more stuff while there. So yeah they arent changing your oil any more that max requirement.
The smart will change their own, and forget about that time consuming free stuff.
I change my own oil on my 2025 Camry. Only things I'm thinking on getting"free" are tire rotations and cabin filters, and an engine filter whenever they will do that. I might just go to Belle Tire and get a free rotation there, and buy my own filters. I try to stay away from dealers as much as possible. When I bought the car new with 1 mile on it, the oil was overfilled from the factory by about a half quart. I'm putting Mobil 1 AFE 0W-30 in it now. Engine sounds smoother, quieter with this oil. Better protection, same MPGs.
Funniest thing about this thread is the uoa shows no wear on a FF.
0w30? That's weak sauce. GTX 20w50 is what you need.
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