I can accept that goteegoat. I doubt that anybody on the board will need to worry about it except on a used car. Thanks
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Tire for mileage
- Thread starter LarryL
- Start date
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
Put the tires with the least tread on the wheels that both *drive* and *steer* the car, where 60-65% of the weight resides when it's sitting, and where 80-90% of the weight hits the pavement under hard braking.quote:
goteegoat:
I am not sure why this is even being argued. If only 2 tires are being installed, new tires always go on the rear regardless of what wheels move the vehicle. ....
That makes complete sense.
Of course, physics be d*rned if everybody repeats it often enough.
.
Did you even read any of the links i provided? I am so glad your experise is ahead of two tire manufactures, a huge tire dealer and motor trend magazine. Please...quote:
Originally posted by Mickey_M:
Put the tires with the least tread on the wheels that both *drive* and *steer* the car, where 60-65% of the weight resides when it's sitting, and where 80-90% of the weight hits the pavement under hard braking.quote:
goteegoat:
I am not sure why this is even being argued. If only 2 tires are being installed, new tires always go on the rear regardless of what wheels move the vehicle. ....
That makes complete sense.
Of course, physics be d*rned if everybody repeats it often enough.
.
Motor Trend magazine?quote:
goteegoat:
Did you even read any of the links i provided? I am so glad your experise is ahead of two tire manufactures, a huge tire dealer and motor trend magazine. Please...
A huge tire dealer? Does this dealer have a research staff and have they tried both front and rear mountings under test conditions? No?
If you read a recent Car & Driver you'll see Pontiac introducing a FWD with the bigger tires in front. They went to Bridgestone and Bridgestone laughed.
Then they actually tried it and tested it.
All you provided was evidence that if A says it and B says it, C will probably say it.
I admit, stipulate, and certify that the common wisdom is passed on from person to person, company to company, ad infinitum.
Where I disagree is that, like yourself, I don't believe they've done anything whatsoever to confirm it.
.
It's pretty basic. When you make a hard stop and wheels on one end of the car lose traction. They will end up in the front. That's a major inconvenience if it's the rear wheels that lose traction.quote:
Originally posted by Mickey_M:
Motor Trend magazine?quote:
goteegoat:
Did you even read any of the links i provided? I am so glad your experise is ahead of two tire manufactures, a huge tire dealer and motor trend magazine. Please...
When you make a hard stop in a FWD car, the rear wheels are just along for the ride.quote:
XS650:
It's pretty basic. When you make a hard stop and wheels on one end of the car lose traction. They will end up in the front. That's a major inconvenience if it's the rear wheels that lose traction.
The static distribution is about 60-65/40-35.
The dynamic (shifting to the front under hard braking) is 90-95/10-05 under hard braking.
Not only are you not worried about the rear wheels losing traction, if the front tires lose traction you're on a hockey puck to h*ll.
Have any of you fellas actually tried driving a FWD car with the better tires on the front?
.
"When you make a hard stop, the rear wheels are just along for the ride"
Wrong, they maintain the direction (hence the force vector) balanced and behind the front wheels.
Displace the tracking front to rear - and you are into a spin.
Ever race a road course with a braking bias control inside the driver's cabin? Rear breaking is used to balance the turn in before the apex - power takes over after apex.
PS - being up here in Canada - I never change just a pair of tires - just not worth the hip replacement surgery after a tangle with transport truck - or worst.
IMO
MAT
Wrong, they maintain the direction (hence the force vector) balanced and behind the front wheels.
Displace the tracking front to rear - and you are into a spin.
Ever race a road course with a braking bias control inside the driver's cabin? Rear breaking is used to balance the turn in before the apex - power takes over after apex.
PS - being up here in Canada - I never change just a pair of tires - just not worth the hip replacement surgery after a tangle with transport truck - or worst.
IMO
MAT
If 90% of the weight is on the front tires (and it is in a hard stop with a FWD vehicle), how much traction do the rear tires require to maintain the direction?quote:
bbcmat:
"When you make a hard stop, the rear wheels are just along for the ride"
Wrong, they maintain the direction (hence the force vector) balanced and behind the front wheels. ....
You put the traction where the work is being done.
There are darned few FWD racing cars, so that example really doesn't advance the conventional wisdom.
.
Look up "polar rotation" on the net, map out the true center of mass in your chassis, and think about it.
Also - FWD rally racing is very popular outside your fishbowl - WAKE UP.
MAT
Also - FWD rally racing is very popular outside your fishbowl - WAKE UP.
MAT
If you only have two good tires, buy two more!
I put the less worn ones on the front for FWD because they wear faster and it evens them out, unless I want to wear the other ones out to get rid of them. But, either way, all four tires will be in decent condition and not worth worrying about.
I put the less worn ones on the front for FWD because they wear faster and it evens them out, unless I want to wear the other ones out to get rid of them. But, either way, all four tires will be in decent condition and not worth worrying about.
It seems this topic (where to mount only a pair of new tires) comes up about once a year. Please just look at the video on the Michelin website, and then make up your own mind. It's not necessarily intuitive, but it can be reasonably explained why the unwashed masses should mount their new tires on the back. For those of us who are actually able to rotate our own tires, this should not be an issue, as we can keep the front to rear wear equal.
It's pretty intuitive to people with a reasonable grasp of physics.quote:
Originally posted by Tosh:
It seems this topic (where to mount only a pair of new tires) comes up about once a year. Please just look at the video on the Michelin website, and then make up your own mind. It's not necessarily intuitive, but it can be reasonably explained why the unwashed masses should mount their new tires on the back. For those of us who are actually able to rotate our own tires, this should not be an issue, as we can keep the front to rear wear equal.
.quote:
bbcmat:
Look up "polar rotation" on the net, map out the true center of mass in your chassis, and think about it.
Also - FWD rally racing is very popular outside your fishbowl - WAKE UP.
.
On the wake up front, have you actually put the two better tires on the front of a FWD car and driven it?
.
Yes - I have - Volvo S70 - using snow / ice driving as a test platform.
Initial acceleration bite is better - light turning is better - once turn exceeds grip then around comes the butt.
Braking is same, but multi-channel ABS helps out somewhat.
4 good tires or park it - IMO
MAT
Initial acceleration bite is better - light turning is better - once turn exceeds grip then around comes the butt.
Braking is same, but multi-channel ABS helps out somewhat.
4 good tires or park it - IMO
MAT
Michelin has it down, new tires in the back.
We aren't speaking about bigger tires on the front, and people are confusing the two.
I have driven a fwd and rwd with new tires on the front, it is fine until your rear loses grip/traction, especially on wet surfaces.
Tire for mileage, a touring tire, one with about a 60k mile plus warranty(harder rubber.) and not so agressive tread design.
We aren't speaking about bigger tires on the front, and people are confusing the two.
I have driven a fwd and rwd with new tires on the front, it is fine until your rear loses grip/traction, especially on wet surfaces.
Tire for mileage, a touring tire, one with about a 60k mile plus warranty(harder rubber.) and not so agressive tread design.
How do you like it when the front loses grip/traction?quote:
Schism:
.... I have driven a fwd and rwd with new tires on the front, it is fine until your rear loses grip/traction, especially on wet surfaces. ....
.
I'll take losing the fron to losing the rear any day. If you lose the front, the cars tends to continue going straight. If you lose the rea it tends to spin.quote:
Originally posted by Mickey_M:
How do you like it when the front loses grip/traction?quote:
Schism:
.... I have driven a fwd and rwd with new tires on the front, it is fine until your rear loses grip/traction, especially on wet surfaces. ....
.
That's the reason 99% of cars on the market are designed to understeer.
quote:
XS650:
I'll take losing the fron to losing the rear any day. If you lose the front, the cars tends to continue going straight. If you lose the rea it tends to spin. ...May I have your license number so if I see you behind me in the rain I can pull over and let you pass?
When I have to slam on my brakes, you're going straight ....
.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
Similar threads
- Replies
- 62
- Views
- 3K
- Replies
- 22
- Views
- 607
- Replies
- 25
- Views
- 2K
