Thinking of going to a thinner oil

[c3po]

Originally Posted By: KW
Black RTV. This next time I'm going to try the gray stuff GM sells for aluminum. I never had a problem before with the black stuff but I sure am tired of having a leaky engine.


Have you thought about a product called, Permatex The Right Stuff.

 

[KW]

Originally Posted By: c3po
I know this may be off topic, but what is the duration of this camshaft and was this engine put together by yourself or did somebody build this.

I am sorry my suggestions did not help.


It's an old flat tappet Erson grind they cut for me a long time ago. It's 258/264 @ .050 with .570 lift with a 106 lobe separation. I'm hanging on to the Reed Cams solid roller 264/268 @ .050 with .666 lift that was cut for the 388 to use in a small journal 368 I'm building with a 4.100 bore 3.48 stroke. Building motors is an expensive hobby of mine and all the work is done in house right here in the shop.

No, thank you for the suggestions! I was hoping the thin oil guys would have been all over this.

I think I might try 5W20 in a Castrol or Motorcraft brand to see if it helps. It should since the motor never sees the high side of 140 degrees. It can make a pass then you could walk over and tighten the header bolts and the headers would only be warm to the touch.

 

[BuickGN]

I think the best thing to do is to install a stock pump or find a way to get the oil up to temp.

Redline 5w-20 (straight 20) would be an alternative since it will be thinner when cold but is very robust. I would be terrified of running something that thin in an engine like yours if it ever did hit a full 200F but you say it stays cool all the time.

With the amount of fuel you say it consumes, this thing must be on the high side of 1,000hp. What does it run?

 

[c3po]

If this engine only gets to 140 degrees and you have a 180 degree thermostat, I can throw you 2 scenarios:

1) Thermostat stuck open
2) You have A Stewart thermostat with the holes drilled into the thermostat.

The other thought is, where is your temperature sensor, is it in the cylinder head or in the intake manifold.

It might also be wise too get yourself an infrared gun, and aim it around the engine to get different temperatures.

Have you checked your coolant gauge, is it mechanical or electrical.

 

[BuickGN]

It's run on E85, much harder to get to operating temp. Whatever bypass there is at the waterpump is probably keeping the engine cool. If the water won't get fully warm, I can only imagine how cool the oil is.

 

[c3po]

Originally Posted By: BuickGN
It's run on E85, much harder to get to operating temp. Whatever bypass there is at the waterpump is probably keeping the engine cool. If the water won't get fully warm, I can only imagine how cool the oil is.



How is that so, I mean how can that E85 be making it run cooler, something with the ethanol.

 

[Johnny]

Yes, ethanol runs a lot cooler that gasoline. That's why IRL and sprint cars use it.

 

[Johnny]

I would not use either one of these oils in that engine. If your going to try a 5W oil, I would at least use something that had a lot of ZDDP in it, like maybe Valvoline Maxlife (can't believe I said that). I also like the suggestion of using Red Line products in that engine. Call Dave at Red Line and tell him your situation. The man is pretty sharp when it come to things like this.

I also would not jump from a 15W-40 to a 5W-20 on that engine.

 

[SteveSRT8]

it's an alky motor, if it's breathing well it may NEVER warm up!

All you need is thinner oil. We recently mirrored a Hot Rod build up of an old 428 CJ Ford and the very well known builder ran it on 10w Royal Purple!

RP has some real high zddp numbers in their oils. Also, GM sells a great zddp additive over the counter. It's very concentrated, just a cup of it will protect them old school flat tappets.

 

[ZZman]

Why not try Royal Purple?: http://www.royalpurple.com/rp-whichoil-wu.html

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
I was hoping the thin oil guys would have been all over this.


Sure, if this was a commuter engine at normal specific output traveling on the mundane cow path. I run 0w-10 without a worry in the world. If your coolant temp is any indicator of the btu throughput, you're probably no where near spec viscosity anyway.

A 20 grade probably doesn't see too much below a 40 grade. I think you would choke the bypass a bit to assure that both get into the 180F range. I'm not sure what the threshold is for additives to do their mojo in a timely manner.

 

[rclint]

I read over the post pretty well, and seen no mention of Shell Rotella T (synthetic) I can't remember if it's 0w-40 or 5w-40, however I have ran this oil in a Cummins diesel seeing a difference in startup oil pressure. It would be worth a try at the least, other than that looks like the two options you have are finding a way to reduce cold oil pressure via pump, or finding a way to increase the temperature via thermostat change, or bypass blocking (if that is a option?)

 

[Max_Wander]

Hey KW your static CR may be 12:5, but you may be running the same cam as you did on the gas which means your dynamic compression ratio may be still low, and thus not burning the E85 quite as nicely as it could. That could account for the struggle to warm up and stay warm, without running it for hours. A colder combustion chamber can also slow down the combustion process on E85, so still a cooler engine is not helping things. Otherwise, if not much can be done about the operating temp, then add one more vote for a nice straight 20W ie Redline racing 20W. With the thinner oil, high volume pump, you can be sure you have the capacity to FLOW enough VOLUME when the going get's thin.

 

[KW]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Quote:
Shouldn't there be a relief valve on his oil pump.


Sure there is. He just needs to re-enable his in block bypass valve. This is the most widely done mod ..and, while people feel the need for it, no one can trace where the practice started (AFAIK). I imagine that it's (somewhere in there) some "trick" thing that Ford and Mopar cannot do ..but I don't think anyone will point to Fords and Mopars having bypass valves installed in their filters, eliminating the option, having lost any races that they deserved to win ..or destroyed any engines for the alleged vulnerability that it allegedly allows.

"If only I had used a 51410 WIX filter ..without a bypass valve, I may have won ..or not lost my engine

"

It's a mistake.


Just to make sure Gary Allan understands. The by-pass in the block has NEVER BEEN PLUGGED. I normally hold what Gary has to say in high standing. But playing me for a fool when I posted only a few posts above his that the by-pass was not plugged is not very nice.

 

[Gary Allan]

No - no - no, pal!!

I read that you said that you didn't do it. The extended commentary was more to petition for someone who may be doing this to justify it

I'm sure there's more than a few that read this that HAVE done it ..but not one (in all the time that I've been questioning the sensibility of it) NOT ONE has spanked me and pointed to any potential benefit that isn't way trumped in incredible liability.

Consider an offending elements of my post as unintended.

Go in peace

 

[lazaro]

what are the closed and open pressure for this solid lifter cam?
if you have tight clearence rod and mains you should use a standard volume pump and 20 weight racing oil would be worth trying.