The Return of User Replaceable Batteries in Mobile Devices

[SubLGT]

The European Council and European Parliament recently passed a law requiring (among many other things) user replaceable batteries on mobile devices, such as smartphones, tablets, etc. The law will take effect in 2027. I expect that manufacturers will sell compliant devices in 2027 not just in the EU, but also in all other markets like the USA. I'm looking forward to this change.

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/...-regulation-on-batteries-and-waste-batteries/

https://www.usmobile.com/blog/smartphone-batteries-eu-regulation/

 

[ctechbob]

I have yet to read the law, but I've got to wonder about their definition of 'easily'. If it is like my old original Samsung Galaxy, then absolutely. Bet the manufacturers come up with some other stumbling block though. You're talking billions of dollars at stake if they can't sell a new phone every 2 years when batteries start to degrade.

 

[billt460]

So..... Who here know the effective life of a average cell phone battery? How many charging cycles are they good for, before they get so bad a recharge doesn't last but a few hours?

 

[Trav]

Good thing IMO. Apple has been getting away with this for years.

 

[ragtoplvr]

new screens too

 

[captainbeandip]

Not necessarily a good thing. This could make new phones thicker, clunkier, and less water proof.

 

[Jetronic]

good, since they aren't waterproof anymore they can include a headphone jack and card slot again

 

[Cujet]

So..... Who here know the effective life of a average cell phone battery? How many charging cycles are they good for, before they get so bad a recharge doesn't last but a few hours?

My iPhone 12 max pro was having battery issues, so of course, I looked at the battery health, which said 85%, maximum performance. Seemed way off, as by 3PM, the phone was dead. So, YouTube to the rescue, I found the way to use an app to review the analytics file and read the actual battery capacity in MAh, and the number of cycles it has undergone.

The actual battery capacity worked out to about 80% of new capacity and just under 500 cycles if I remember correctly.

I then erased the phone and started again as a "new phone". Which solved the battery life problem.

 

[bunnspecial]

Apple has had a program in place for a few years now for repairs-not just batteries but other components-where they will sell you the part and loan you the tools to properly perform the replacement

https://support.apple.com/self-service-repair

I'd be curious to know if this system will satisfy the requirements.

At least as laptops go(which presumably would fall under this also) Apple has actually made some improvements in recent years. They started using batteries that officially were non-replaceable in the MacBook Air in 2008, MacBook and MacBook Pro in 2009. Those batteries are very simple to replace-once you remove the bottom plate(8-10 screws) the battery is held in place with a few additional screws and plugs into the computer's logic board. The only small twist was that some use a tri-wing screw to hold the battery down.

Starting in 2012 with the Retina MacBook Pro, then in 2015 with the new MacBook and after that whenever they release the revised MacBook Air, they went to multi-piece glued in batteries. For someone buying the computer new and replacing it every few years, they could be considered a good thing because those computers quite literally use every available corner of space for battery and can have more battery capacity than an otherwise similar unit with a single piece battery. For users who keep them a while, DIY replacement is possible but not something that even more advanced users necessarily will want to do because you have to deal with dissolving the old glue and then gluing the new back in correctly. IIRC, Apple doesn't even replace them in stores-they just swap the entire top case assembly and then refurbish at a central facility.

The newest designs of the last ~2 years have gone back to single piece, screwed in place batteries, which of course is a good thing for DIY repair. Part of me wonders if they've seen the writing on the wall with legislation like this.

Also, reportedly(I've not tried it myself especially since Verizon bascially makes it a no-brainer to upgrade every 2-3 years) the current iPhones are much easier not just for battery replacement but for tasks like screen replacement than iPhone 6/7/8 era phones. I had both a replacement screen and replacement battery at Apple stores on my iPhone 6, and both times I had to sign off acknowledging the potential for data loss when they opened the phone and confirming that I had a backup.

 

[thastinger]

So..... Who here know the effective life of a average cell phone battery? How many charging cycles are they good for, before they get so bad a recharge doesn't last but a few hours?

1000-1200 charge cycles is the general life of a battery...and most people charge their phone daily.

 

[bunnspecial]

1000-1200 charge cycles is the general life of a battery...and most people charge their phone daily.

Li-ion battery chemistry has a lot of nuances and I won't pretend to understand them(even if on paper my masters degree is in electrochemistry, I don't know as much about battery chemistry as I should) but the way a "cycle" is counted for lifetime purposes isn't totally straight forward.

Also, Li-ion can manage a much, much longer service life if it consistently "lives" between 20% and 80% charge. Apple devices sort of try to do this, but unfortunately their built in management doesn't work quite like some 3rd party solutions I use to use on computers. I'd be content most days with my phone charging to 80% and stopping, and then only going to 100% when I tell it to(such as if I know I'm going to be on the road all day, vs. at work and not using it much) but that's not currently an option. Their solution learns your habits and will, for example, charge up to 80% when you plug it in at night and go to 100% shortly before you normally unplug it in the morning so at least it's not spending all night all the way up.

I would think that other makers would do this too.

Also, heat absolutely kills Li-ion batteries. That's why EVs(which I know are a separate topic) generally have active cooling through their battery packs. One thing I have noticed is that the current ARM-based Macs, which generally run MUCH cooler than Intel models, seem to have better battery longevity.

 

[racer12306]

Li-ion battery chemistry has a lot of nuances and I won't pretend to understand them(even if on paper my masters degree is in electrochemistry, I don't know as much about battery chemistry as I should) but the way a "cycle" is counted for lifetime purposes isn't totally straight forward.

Also, Li-ion can manage a much, much longer service life if it consistently "lives" between 20% and 80% charge. Apple devices sort of try to do this, but unfortunately their built in management doesn't work quite like some 3rd party solutions I use to use on computers. I'd be content most days with my phone charging to 80% and stopping, and then only going to 100% when I tell it to(such as if I know I'm going to be on the road all day, vs. at work and not using it much) but that's not currently an option. Their solution learns your habits and will, for example, charge up to 80% when you plug it in at night and go to 100% shortly before you normally unplug it in the morning so at least it's not spending all night all the way up.

I would think that other makers would do this too.

Also, heat absolutely kills Li-ion batteries. That's why EVs(which I know are a separate topic) generally have active cooling through their battery packs. One thing I have noticed is that the current ARM-based Macs, which generally run MUCH cooler than Intel models, seem to have better battery longevity.

I use this feature of the phone, and that, along with a couple other things is why my battery is at 94% capacity after 2 years.

I also don't use MagSafe or Qi charging regularly. The only place that I do is in the car, and it's right in front of a HVAC vent so it gets cooled in the summer easily. I use my MagSafe charger every day as a magnet, it's just unplugged unless I need it.

 

[zzyzzx]

Obligatory Louis Rossmann reference. I would expect manufactures to have separate EU versions with replacement batteries that are not available outside the EU.

 

[RooflessVW]

I would expect manufactures to have separate EU versions with replacement batteries that are not available outside the EU.

Same phone but glue that sucker shut outside of the EU.

 

[alarmguy]

I could care less, I don’t agree with a lot that goes on in the UK. People have choices. I don’t need government telling me when I must buy, they cannot even manage their own budget, which is always in the red.

I say this, because if replaceable means, loss of convenience, waterproofing, form factor.
I say no thank you and stop telling me what I can, and cannot buy.

 

[Vil_Riker]

I could care less, I don’t agree with a lot that goes on in the UK. People have choices. I don’t need government telling me when I must buy, they cannot even manage their own budget, which is always in the red.

I say this, because if replaceable means, loss of convenience, waterproofing, form factor.
I say no thank you and stop telling me what I can, and cannot buy.

You will still buy whatever you want.

 

[thastinger]

I could care less, I don’t agree with a lot that goes on in the UK. People have choices. I don’t need government telling me when I must buy, they cannot even manage their own budget, which is always in the red.

I say this, because if replaceable means, loss of convenience, waterproofing, form factor.
I say no thank you and stop telling me what I can, and cannot buy.

I'm generally a "less government" guy but we're at a point now to where your purchase options are only what has been government approved. Every appliance in your home has to be UL listed before it can even show up in a store and present itself to your for consideration of purchase. You can't build your house with lumber that you milled yourself, it has to be "graded" lumber. Your car meets CAFE standards of the year of manufacture, you can't buy a new HVAC unit that is less than 15 SEER now etc. Every aspect of your life today has government regulation in it.

 

[JohnnyG]

I've had three different phones with user replaceable batteries. The only thing wrong with the idea is that most of the replacement batteries you can buy don't provide power for the same usage as oem, or don't last long at all. Leads me to think that most are Chinese overrated junk batteries or have insufficient quality control.

I doubt that the EU will address issues like that.

 

[RooflessVW]

I've had three different phones with user replaceable batteries. The only thing wrong with the idea is that most of the replacement batteries you can buy don't provide power for the same usage as oem, or don't last long at all. Leads me to think that most are Chinese overrated junk batteries or have insufficient quality control.

I doubt that the EU will address issues like that.

I had no issues buying Samsung batteries for my Samsung phones, LG for my LG, etc.

If a manufacturer was to capture some of the money lost, they will surely offer replacement parts at a premium.

 

[alarmguy]

I'm generally a "less government" guy but we're at a point now to where your purchase options are only what has been government approved. Every appliance in your home has to be UL listed before it can even show up in a store and present itself to your for consideration of purchase. You can't build your house with lumber that you milled yourself, it has to be "graded" lumber. Your car meets CAFE standards of the year of manufacture, you can't buy a new HVAC unit that is less than 15 SEER now etc. Every aspect of your life today has government regulation in it.

Government does not dictate the design of products. I do understand your point but me personally will never agree to someone controlling my life. Does not mean it wont happen but I do not have to lay down and not be vocal. Either way, this is another country, not the USA though. I think one option and it very well may be, if the UK wants to force something why not give the public a choice? Meaning someone can buy a waterproof slim, stylish iPhone without a replaceable battery or another model with one. I can bet only a tiny minority would choose replaceable.
I hope the USA stays out of this and a company like Apple has the finances to offer two products as well as other companies. Let the USA lead with slim, waterproof devices and the UK live with government mandated design, oh sure that will work out great *LOL*

BTW- UL is a private testing company and not a requirement by US standards.
https://mondoro.com/is-ul-approval-required-on-all-items-sold-in-the-usa/?expand_article=1