Tesla driver charged with manslaughter after Autopilot crash that killed two

Putting this tech in automobiles & expecting the buyers to use it in a reasonable & prudent manner is laughable.
Maybe we need lager dispensers too? But not in the Teslas optioned with autopilot.
That would be unreasonable.
 
Some of us were able to accurately articulate the types of problems likely to happen with such systems. An autopilot simply can’t process a situation like a human
Totally agree as IMBHO those that think AI will replace the human brain are just too ignorant/lazy to figure things out. I have never trusted even cruise control in any vehicle I've driven. My brain/feet never let me down...
 
I’ve had Tesla’s pass me with the “driver” fully engulfed in work (laptop, papers on dashboard, etc). However, I’ve also passed people with novels on the steering wheel. Both instances are people not focused on their vehicle and what it is doing.

Humans have a portion of the population that are flat out stupid, and technology will never fix it.
 
I'm still seeing that commercial with the no-hands-on-steering while two people are clapping to the music. Is it any wonder?
 
I'm still seeing that commercial with the no-hands-on-steering while two people are clapping to the music. Is it any wonder?
That is a bad commercial. If I were to get hit by a GMC, me and a copy of that commercial would be in court, "Judge I swear right before they hit me I saw them playing patty cake."
 
"Your Honor, the drivers of the car that hit me took that song "We Will Rock You" a little too literally."

That is a bad commercial. If I were to get hit by a GMC, me and a copy of that commercial would be in court, "Judge I swear right before they hit me I saw them playing patty cake."
 
I'm not defending Autopilot systems, but your comment seems to imply that humans don't make errors. I think we all know that just isn't the case.


Cujet can correct me or add to this if I am off on my thoughts here but my impression is that he is coming at this from a aviation point of view.

Case in point, Asiana 214. While the flight crew was trying to understand why the automated system was doing what it was doing they could have switched to manual and performed a go around. Instead the plane landed short and we know the rest.

The fight between trusting the automation and your inner sense that something is wrong is one we may never understand fully.
 
Totally agree as IMBHO those that think AI will replace the human brain are just too ignorant/lazy to figure things out. I have never trusted even cruise control in any vehicle I've driven. My brain/feet never let me down...
Can you see forward, backward, both sides, know the speed limit, know if there are changes in the road all at once? While changing the radio or yelling at the kids? Tesla can.

Again, a slight touch on the brake pedal disengages AP if something is wrong.
 
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I'm not defending Autopilot systems, but your comment seems to imply that humans don't make errors. I think we all know that just isn't the case.
My gripe is with drivers who think they can fully yield driving to the autopilot system. That is nothing less than negligent. Ultimately, the driver is responsible controlling a motor vehicle. The real fault lays in the driver, not in the autopilot system. The fact that charges are being brought against the driver says that the prosecution also feels that way.

I do feel that Tesla has some level of responsibility, if for no other reason, by what is implied in naming the system Autopilot. Of course that has been discussed here on BITOG more than once.
Ya. It's not all that different from cruise controls systems which can be used to set a fixed distance from the vehicle in front of it. They have been out for almost a decade.
 
I'm curious if you have any examples of tesla encouraging this?
It's fairly obvious. For starters we can look at their decision to use the term "autopilot" when describing the feature. This is on top of the plethora of advertisements, video demonstrations, etc which imply that the vehicle operates as if it were driverless.
 
I don't see that the problem is with the systems, my MB does some of that stuff too. I see the problem in what Elon, and his ego insisted on calling that system.
MB now has a "full self driving" system, not that they call it that, but it IS a level 4 system, and it cuts out at 37 MPH.
Tesla hasn't come up with level 4 abilities yet.
 
Putting this tech in automobiles & expecting the buyers to use it in a reasonable & prudent manner is laughable.
Maybe we need lager dispensers too? But not in the Teslas optioned with autopilot.
That would be unreasonable.
in the late 80’s I bought a new GM - sales guy kept going on and on about cruise control. I asked if there had been a lawsuit? He said a guy from the ME bought a custom van - set the speed and crawled in the back for a nap …
His family won the case …
 
It’s interesting, but most important is the loss of life. Everyone cares about the driver and the company. The family of the dead don’t. If I was Musk, I would take auto pilot off and figure I have enough money to survive. One last comment before the lock,and it should be locked given the comments, why can’t we buy hand grenades? They don’t kill sitting there. If that is the argument, why can’t we buy hand grenades. Because someone out there will start using them to kill people for whatever reason.
I’ve had Tesla’s pass me with the “driver” fully engulfed in work (laptop, papers on dashboard, etc). However, I’ve also passed people with novels on the steering wheel. Both instances are people not focused on their vehicle and what it is doing.

Humans have a portion of the population that are flat out stupid, and technology will never fix it.
Rare and far between to see people reading at the wheel, plus it isn’t something the car company can control. This auto pilot is coming from the company, big difference.
 
Can you see forward, backward, both sides, know the speed limit, know if there are changes in the road all at once? While changing the radio or yelling at the kids? Tesla can.

Again, a slight touch on the brake pedal disengages AP if something is wrong.
Well my kids are grown and no radio these days due to profound hearing loss, lmao, but yes I'm quite in tune with my car, changing weather/traffic conditions down to the millisecond. I will NEVER rely on very much automation to get through life. Technology certainly has a place in daily life, but too many are far too dependent on it and it clearly shows.
 
Well my kids are grown and no radio these days due to profound hearing loss, lmao, but yes I'm quite in tune with my car, changing weather/traffic conditions down to the millisecond. I will NEVER rely on very much automation to get through life. Technology certainly has a place in daily life, but too many are far too dependent on it and it clearly shows.
The accident in this thread is due to human error. The vast majority of accidents are.
How many accidents have you been involved in? How many tickets? I betcha human error was at fault.

I had a '66 GTO back in the day. Who was responsible for the "60 in a 25" ? Me or the car?
 
It's fairly obvious. For starters we can look at their decision to use the term "autopilot" when describing the feature. This is on top of the plethora of advertisements, video demonstrations, etc which imply that the vehicle operates as if it were driverless.
Tesla clearly states who is responsible for driving the vehicle. To get into an accident while on AP, you have to be negligent. A simple tap on the brakes disables it.

By the way, there are many examples of Tesla preventing accidents, but they don't get headlines.
 
It's fairly obvious. For starters we can look at their decision to use the term "autopilot" when describing the feature. This is on top of the plethora of advertisements, video demonstrations, etc which imply that the vehicle operates as if it were driverless.

Ive not seen anything from Tesla that doenst preface using it properly. Love to see that if you can actually come up with one.

On the name... ok I guess if your dumb enough to believe that after reading and signing the user agreement.
They probably should have named it something like T cruise.

There are innumerable idiots trying to circumvent it, guys in back seats orange on the wheel on and on...
I dont think tesla condones that in any way Ive seen.

What company do you think has the best stats on its automation?
 
Ive not seen anything from Tesla that doenst preface using it properly. Love to see that if you can actually come up with one.

On the name... ok I guess if your dumb enough to believe that after reading and signing the user agreement.
They probably should have named it something like T cruise.

There are innumerable idiots trying to circumvent it, guys in back seats orange on the wheel on and on...
I dont think tesla condones that in any way Ive seen.

What company do you think has the best stats on its automation?
Well of course in some form the disclaimer will always be there at the insistence of legal, but lets be honest the majority of the time is spent talking about the features.

I couldn't care less about features such as autopilot so I don't know who's better or worse. In fact I hate the technology because it's nothing but a money grab under the guise of safety. The car is the only safe space where the individual cannot get bombarded by ads on their smartphones and Big Tech is looking to break that wall.
 
Ive not seen anything from Tesla that doenst preface using it properly. Love to see that if you can actually come up with one.

On the name... ok I guess if your dumb enough to believe that after reading and signing the user agreement.
They probably should have named it something like T cruise.

There are innumerable idiots trying to circumvent it, guys in back seats orange on the wheel on and on...
I dont think tesla condones that in any way Ive seen.

What company do you think has the best stats on its automation?
Maybe MB? They have the first, and only, Level 4 system and it is only good up to 60 km/hr. Everything else, like Tesla, is max Level 3. They should call Level 3 Cruise Control Plus or something similar.
 
No technology is perfect. The self-driving is really good at doing what it is programmed to do. There are downsides to both human driving, and automated driving. On the human side, there is distraction, which the automated side does not have. On the automated side, as good as it is, there is no way for a computer to use judgement to maneuver out of a situation it has not yet been programmed for. I'm not sure AI driving will ever be able to account for every possible situation, and this is where deciding liability can become difficult.

I do think autopilot is a misleading name for an assisted driving system.
 
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