sulfated ash (SA) content

Messages
578
Location
israel
hi all,
is sulfated ash (SA) content of a 1.22 is to high for a gdi engine that require an api sn oil?
can it damage the converters?
tnx.
 
Messages
3,751
Location
Nashville, TN via Memphis
I can't see it being a problem as long as the engine does not burn oil.
I thought the reason to stay away from high SAPS oils in GDI engines was because it gets vaporized and enters the intake tract via the PCV system and potentially causes LSPI and intake valve deposits.

Any engine can have its catalytic converter poisoned by SAPS products if oil is getting burned.
 
Messages
3,341
Location
BC, Canada
I thought the reason to stay away from high SAPS oils in GDI engines was because it gets vaporized and enters the intake tract via the PCV system and potentially causes LSPI and intake valve deposits.

Any engine can have its catalytic converter poisoned by SAPS products if oil is getting burned.
LPSI, for those who don't know is low speed (rpm) pre ignition. In other words, it has the same affect as having the spark timing too far advanced. The peak cylinder pressure will occure too soon and likely be too high in this case.
The subject was discussed before, but was anything agreed upon?
cause & cure
 
Messages
5,606
Location
Atlanta,GA
hi all,
is sulfated ash (SA) content of a 1.22 is to high for a gdi engine that require an api sn oil?
can it damage the converters?
tnx.
API SN max ash is 1.00%. Since your converter question was answered the other thing you didn't mention is buildup within the intake tract/valves.

It will increase the rate of buildup within the intake tract/valves, but by how much depends upon how long you choose to use this particular oil. Nobody knows the answer to that.
 

avi1777

Thread starter
Messages
578
Location
israel
i will tell u whats my concern.
i own a gdi(non turbo) 16.5 mazda cx5.
i do 7500k miles a year of mostly very short trips,i wanted a robust oil that will handle once a year oci under those circumstances so i went with the ss by amsoil,now 7months later i discovered that the s.a is very high.
is it safe mostly converter wise?
had to replace 2 of them in my previous car(09 cts) so have a slight trauma.
tnx to all.
 
Messages
5,606
Location
Atlanta,GA
i will tell u whats my concern.
i own a gdi(non turbo) 16.5 mazda cx5.
i do 7500k miles a year of mostly very short trips,i wanted a robust oil that will handle once a year oci under those circumstances so i went with the ss by amsoil,now 7months later i discovered that the s.a is very high.
is it safe mostly converter wise?
had to replace 2 of them in my previous car(09 cts) so have a slight trauma.
tnx to all.
I would ask Amsoil.
 
Messages
17,230
Location
Upper Midwest
i will tell u whats my concern.
i own a gdi(non turbo) 16.5 mazda cx5.
i do 7500k miles a year of mostly very short trips,i wanted a robust oil that will handle once a year oci under those circumstances so i went with the ss by amsoil,now 7months later i discovered that the s.a is very high.
is it safe mostly converter wise?
had to replace 2 of them in my previous car(09 cts) so have a slight trauma.
tnx to all.
Just to be clear, the ash in motor oil is not "sulfated" ash, the sulfated part comes from the analysis method used by the ASTM test. The problem with catalytic converters comes from the phosphorus in oil but only if the oil makes it to the converter in the first place. If you're not burning a lot of oil then it does not matter.
 
Messages
12,310
Location
Colorado Springs
I thought the reason to stay away from high SAPS oils in GDI engines was because it gets vaporized and enters the intake tract via the PCV system and potentially causes LSPI and intake valve deposits.

Any engine can have its catalytic converter poisoned by SAPS products if oil is getting burned.
LSPI event is limited to turbo engines not naturally aspirated engines. And not all turbo engines are susceptible to it. European turbo engines are best when it comes to resistance to it. And it happens in small-displacement engines, mostly below 1.8ltr.
 

avi1777

Thread starter
Messages
578
Location
israel
btw im at 30k miles now and will sell the car in 3years at 60k miles give or take.not planing long term ownership.
 
Messages
2,856
Location
pa
many owners trade often for newer vehicles to avoid issues that come with higher mileage, fine if you got the $$$! todays vehicles are more complicated especially with the unnecessary trinkets most owners want so i opt for long term cheaper ownership!
 

avi1777

Thread starter
Messages
578
Location
israel
thats why i bought a mazda,had German and American cars all my life,wanted a low mileage Japanese car for some peace of mind and the cx5 is as simple as it gets in today's terms.
 

avi1777

Thread starter
Messages
578
Location
israel
btw,what is considered a abnormal oil consumption?
i believe my car will use a third/quarter of a quart in 7500k miles tops.
by now i did 4k miles on the ss and have zero oil consumption.
 
Messages
3,098
Location
GA.
hi all,
is sulfated ash (SA) content of a 1.22 is to high for a gdi engine that require an api sn oil?
can it damage the converters?
tnx.
Preferably - you want to be under 1.0 in SA content for GDI engines as well as select a synthetic oil that uses less Viscosity Index Improvers (VII's) .
Two of the better choices are Valvoline Advance Synthetic and next would be Pennzoil Platinum. Both are less than 3% VII content however the Valvoline Advance is near 1.0 in SA while the PP is lower at approx. .08 SA A 3rd choice (although slightly higher at 5% VII) is Quaker State Full Synthetic .
 
Messages
1,030
Location
California
Preferably - you want to be under 1.0 in SA content for GDI engines as well as select a synthetic oil that uses less Viscosity Index Improvers (VII's) .
Two of the better choices are Valvoline Advance Synthetic and next would be Pennzoil Platinum. Both are less than 3% VII content however the Valvoline Advance is near 1.0 in SA while the PP is lower at approx. .08 SA A 3rd choice (although slightly higher at 5% VII) is Quaker State Full Synthetic .
How did you ascertain the % of VII?

Ed
 
Messages
14
Location
IL
Preferably - you want to be under 1.0 in SA content for GDI engines as well as select a synthetic oil that uses less Viscosity Index Improvers (VII's) .
Two of the better choices are Valvoline Advance Synthetic and next would be Pennzoil Platinum. Both are less than 3% VII content however the Valvoline Advance is near 1.0 in SA while the PP is lower at approx. .08 SA A 3rd choice (although slightly higher at 5% VII) is Quaker State Full Synthetic .
Any idea on Mobil product specs? Sorry new to this stuff if already discussed.
 
Messages
2,358
Location
Paradise of Florida
Severe service

I wouldn't go an entire year/7500 on ANY oil for 100% city driving. I would install an engine timer and change out the full synthetic oil every 200hrs. The other option is a 6 month 3750 interval, regardless oil marketing.

You need a UOA with TBN/TAN/oxidation and particle count to see if ANY oil/filter combo is capable of your chosen interval. Otherwise, you are driving blind with marketing.

Your replaced catalytics weren't caused by the oil. So, don't have trauma. Just don't buy another product from the company that manufactured your CTS, or use generic catalytic converters.

I liked the CX-5. Got a bit expensive with some options. Didn't think we'd get use to the center console radio controls stuff. But, the 6-speed 2.5 city commuter combo was perfect driver, IMO. We avoided turbos and CVTs, and it was a tough call among the 2.4/6peed Sportage and CX5. She took the Sportage since she didn't care for silly gimmick screens used by most now.

Keep it clean with top tier fuel, if available or equivalent high quality name brand fuel. LSPI in a non-turbo an issue? Regardless, 13:1 compression ratio on a non-turbo... would make me use premium always. A spraycan or bottle a year of IVD cleaner is something you should consider, along with a quality name brand or PEA based FI cleaner added to the tank.

I don't worry about sulfated ash in my oil. And, I'd rather replace a catalytic vs an engine!
 
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