Spinoff to my other 351w thread

[Rutwad01]

So I posted my vehicle is being restored. The 351w sat for about 8 years. It ran great.

It did not have oil in it when I took it to the restoration shop because I had just installed a new oil pan.

I'm certain he tried cranking the engine without prelubing it. I'm concerned he tried cranking it without oil. I went and picked up my unfinished vehicle yesterday. He said he replaced all lifters Friday along with 5 or 6 push rods. I told him I wanted everything kept. Monday morning he texted to say they got thrown own since Friday and the garbage had already been picked up (convenient for him). It had fresh oil and a new filter on it now.

If he did something that damaged my engine other than the lifters and push rods he replaced, he will be responsible.

What do i need to have checked at this point? Any way to prove it was started with no oil at this point? Do I try to start it and run it at this point? I don't want issues with my engine because of his screw up.

 

[crashz]

Hmmm. I don't know what vehicle this is in, but can you drop the pan and check the rod and main bearings? To me, these bearing and the cam bearings will be critical wear points, and if they are excessively worn, it might spell end-of-life for the whole thing. Otherwise a full tear-down.

Proving that they did this when you were in the engine too could be difficult.

 

[Rutwad01]

Hmmm. I don't know what vehicle this is in, but can you drop the pan and check the rod and main bearings? To me, these bearing and the cam bearings will be critical wear points, and if they are excessively worn, it might spell end-of-life for the whole thing. Otherwise a full tear-down.

Proving that they did this when you were in the engine too could be difficult.

1967 Bronco.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[D60]

I think you'd need to tear it down enough to get eyes on the cam. Crank's a little easier due to oil pan.

Decide how much this is worth to you. Do you wanna take the time, or just pre-oil it and try to run it?

You're not going to be able to hold the guy responsible. And even if you somehow convinced a court (filled with people who can't change a flat tire) this guy won't ever pay. Chock it up to life-ain't-fair and move on.

Were you gonna carb this? Because it sounds like LS swap time. I know people think the swap is unoriginal but having spent considerable time with an EFI 351 and several '02-06 5.3s, the 5.3 is vastly superior and more compact.

 

[Rutwad01]

Hmmm. I don't know what vehicle this is in, but can you drop the pan and check the rod and main bearings? To me, these bearing and the cam bearings will be critical wear points, and if they are excessively worn, it might spell end-of-life for the whole thing. Otherwise a full tear-down.

Proving that they did this when you were in the engine too could be difficult.

I think you'd need to tear it down enough to get eyes on the cam. Crank's a little easier due to oil pan.

Decide how much this is worth to you. Do you wanna take the time, or just pre-oil it and try to run it?

You're not going to be able to hold the guy responsible. And even if you somehow convinced a court (filled with people who can't change a flat tire) this guy won't ever pay. Chock it up to life-ain't-fair and move on.

Were you gonna carb this? Because it sounds like LS swap time. I know people think the swap is unoriginal but having spent considerable time with an EFI 351 and several '02-06 5.3s, the 5.3 is vastly superior and more compact.

I'm thinking it needs tore down. He did say he looked at the cam with a flashlight. Not saying it can't be done, but it's that any kind of real indicator to possible damage just looking down the push rods passages (whatever is called. I'm no mechanic)

 

[D60]

I'm thinking it needs tore down. He did say he looked at the cam with a flashlight. Not saying it can't be done, but it's that any kind of real indicator to possible damage just looking down the push rods passages (whatever is called. I'm no mechanic)

Could be. I suppose you could look down there with a borescope. Decent ones are ~$130 assuming a 1/4" head will fit? (I don't know). Otherwise there are 5/32" (3.9mm) heads for ~$200 and 3mm for more

 

[hemitom]

Next to impossible to prove the mechanic did any damage !
As stated in prior post cut your loses and move forward really how much more damage can really be done by firing it up.

 

[Rutwad01]

Next to impossible to prove the mechanic did any damage !
As stated in prior post cut your loses and move forward really how much more damage can really be done by firing it up.

You may be right. Damage is done. Make sure is properly started and address issues that arise. Idk. Lesson learned for sure

 

[Brons2]

Who would start it up after a long dormancy without doing basic checks like does the crankcase have oil in it?

I would go pick up the vehicle today, because they have lost my trust.

 

[PontiacHO]

Start with a disassembly and freshen this engine up. No matter what your shop did or didn’t do, having a fresh engine for your restoration is very satisfying and makes for a successful result. I’ve personally had something similar in that I purchased a semi restored 67 Chevelle with a “rebuilt” big block. Wanting to change out the valve covers and intake manifold I then discovered the camshaft was wiped out. Everything was new inside this engine (pistons, rings, bearings, cam bearings, oil pump, and off course the valvetrain components) but ruined due to the cam wear material pumped throughout. I pulled the engine to completely rebuild it and was glad I did. I had an engine I could trust.

 

[Rutwad01]

Who would start it up after a long dormancy without doing basic checks like does the crankcase have oil in it?

I would go pick up the vehicle today, because they have lost my trust.

I picked it up yesterday

 

[Rutwad01]

Start with a disassembly and freshen this engine up. No matter what your shop did or didn’t do, having a fresh engine for your restoration is very satisfying and makes for a successful result. I’ve personally had something similar in that I purchased a semi restored 67 Chevelle with a “rebuilt” big block. Wanting to change out the valve covers and intake manifold I then discovered the camshaft was wiped out. Everything was new inside this engine (pistons, rings, bearings, cam bearings, oil pump, and off course the valvetrain components) but ruined due to the cam wear material pumped throughout. I pulled the engine to completely rebuild it and was glad I did. I had an engine I could trust.

View attachment 341939

Well it's only about 5k miles on a rebuilt, but it's it may be best to go through it now to address any possible issues. Just aggravated with this while experience. This started as a 6 month estimated project according to him. Lots of disappointments along the way. And looking over what he has done this morning and taking pictures is making me feel worse. He talks a good game, but he hasn't delivered on much of what he said. Really disappointed.

 

[PontiacHO]

There’s more shops like you’ve experienced than really good ones unfortunately. Low miles since rebuild is now irrelevant. That engine has suffered damage that has to be addressed.

 

[Rutwad01]

There’s more shops like you’ve experienced than really good ones unfortunately. Low miles since rebuild is now irrelevant. That engine has suffered damage that has to be addressed.

Good point. I appreciate the replies

 

[D60]

Who would start it up after a long dormancy without doing basic checks like does the crankcase have oil in it?

I would go pick up the vehicle today, because they have lost my trust.

Man even when we put a low mileage used EFI 351W in my '90 Bronco we primed the pump with a drill down thru the dist hole.

It's SOP AFAIC.

Random note: also went to a '94+ engine so ya gotta swap the dist drive gear or the roller cam chews up the softer drive gear that came on the earlier motors.