So I was cruising the Ford lot today

oilpan49 · Oct 28, 2005

There I saw in the back row, brand new 2006 Super duties!! both 3/4 ton and 1 ton! Chrome frontend! They even come with a billet grill as factory! Chrome wheels, I think there either 17 or 18" ?

They had a black SD, dark blue 350 SD and a few others. I am very pleased with the looks of the new SD's! Now if I only had $38K to work with! lol

My problem is if I get one sometime in the not to distant future, I want a gas engine and not diesel. Reason being is, I don't drive enough to get the benefit of them. Now if I go gas, the V10 is a gas sucking monster but it has sufficient power to move a SD along just fine. the 250's come with the 5.4 engine. I think that's too small. Ford needs to bring back the Big Blocks again,,,,,,op

wander2039 · Oct 28, 2005

Drive the V10 and you won't think about the big blocks. Grandparents has a E450 motorhome 32ft with the V10 and compared to the 460's in their old ones.. major difference. Could be better gearing... don't know the specfics. The V10 is able to jump that heavy thing off the line, no corvette I know but quick enough for as heavy as it is. Doesn't slow down as much on hills either. It does have the previous version the 2-valve and the new version is a 3-valve. The 5.4 wouldn't be bad with the right gearing and depending on much you towed.

Steve S · Oct 28, 2005

Get a v10 the average gas mileage will be about the same if you drive them the same, and the v10 will be nicer to drive than the 5.4 .The company I used to work for used ford F350 vans as their service trucks ,they weighed about 9,000 pounds ready to work . I put many miles on the vans with the small and big engines .Is a F250 or 350 really needed?

JHZR2 · Oct 28, 2005

do like 1sttruck... anything else is borderline irresponsible for even yourself, if youre not super rich...

JMH

1sttruck · Oct 28, 2005

A former coworker towed a big boat with a big block Ford F250, and they got 10 mpg with no load, 2mpg when towing. A neigbor got a big block Ford F350 for use with his larger camper (their F250 gasser was shot with less than 100k miles on it), they didn't want a 'noisy, stinky diesel', and he said that going thru Colorado they sometimes didn't know if they'd make it to the next gas sttaion in time. A friend recently did a 'guys trip' to AZ from WA, driving straight thru while switching among three drivers, with a Dodge 3500 diesel loaded with firewood and pulling a 8k trailer. One of his friends has a warmed over Chevy big block truck, who said that a couple of years ago he would have bought a Dodge on the trip back, but with a kid and all now he needs to wait a few months :^)

Think carefully about gas vs diesel in a larger vehicle. I get 17 to 18 mpg in town, 19 to 20 mpg on the highway, and payload doesn't seem to affect mileage although towing does. Gas engines worked hard typically aren't as durable as diesels.

mechtech · Oct 30, 2005

Diesel is about a dollar a gallon more than regular gas [it shouldn't be, though].
Consider this when purchasing a new vehicle.

kenw · Oct 30, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by mechtech:
Diesel is about a dollar a gallon more than regular gas [it shouldn't be, though].
Consider this when purchasing a new vehicle.

why shouldn't it be? if people are willing to buy it at that price, so be it.

Steve S · Oct 30, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by 1sttruck:
A former coworker towed a big boat with a big block Ford F250, and they got 10 mpg with no load, 2mpg when towing. A neigbor got a big block Ford F350 for use with his larger camper (their F250 gasser was shot with less than 100k miles on it), they didn't want a 'noisy, stinky diesel', and he said that going thru Colorado they sometimes didn't know if they'd make it to the next gas sttaion in time. A friend recently did a 'guys trip' to AZ from WA, driving straight thru while switching among three drivers, with a Dodge 3500 diesel loaded with firewood and pulling a 8k trailer. One of his friends has a warmed over Chevy big block truck, who said that a couple of years ago he would have bought a Dodge on the trip back, but with a kid and all now he needs to wait a few months :^)

Think carefully about gas vs diesel in a larger vehicle. I get 17 to 18 mpg in town, 19 to 20 mpg on the highway, and payload doesn't seem to affect mileage although towing does. Gas engines worked hard typically aren't as durable as diesels.

The guy must really run wot to get 2mpg the vans would get 6 to 8 around town and 8 to 10 mpg on the freeway. My wife has a f 250 with a diesel engine with a manual and gets 16 around town and 21 mpg on the freeway.I think the $4,000 spent for the better mpg makes the truck nicer to drive. If you drive the truck properly the v 10 will get the same mpg as the v8 and last way over 100,000 miles.

Schmoe · Oct 30, 2005

I disagree. We had an Excursion here at work with the V10. Couldn't keep it full enough. I drove it for a while and I thought it was a dog. Hopefully they got the spark plug issue resolved on the 5.4 and V10's.

ekpolk · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by kenw:

quote:

Originally posted by mechtech:
Diesel is about a dollar a gallon more than regular gas [it shouldn't be, though].
Consider this when purchasing a new vehicle.

Click to expand...

why shouldn't it be? if people are willing to buy it at that price, so be it.

Supply and demand works nicely when there's a balance between the buyer and seller. When it's not a matter of "willing to pay" but instead, is a "must pay" (as fuel is for most folks) the complexion changes. How would you feel if you took your gravely sick child to the ER, had the doctor look you up and down, and then say, "sure we can help, that will be $1 million, up front. . ."??? No problem with that, I suppose.

But back to this thread, it really depends upon how much he drives (and whether he's willing to pay up front for the oil burner -- this would, of course, be an arm's length transaction). A friend of mine is driving a 6.0L gasser Silverado 2500HD because he calculated he'd have to drive the diesel for about seven years to recoup the added cost -- longer than he plans to own the truck. And then, of course, there's the testosterone factor -- no gasser, regarldless of how many cylinders it packs, matches the diesel in this category.

kenw · Oct 31, 2005

hospitals are rarely located on every corner with prices posted for all to see....

"And then, of course, there's the testosterone factor --"

an actual overheard quote from a certifiable mullet one evening who, when asked by the attendant to please turn off the vehicle while filling (state law):

"There's no spark plugs, so it won't cause a fire..."

ekpolk · Oct 31, 2005

hospitals are rarely located on every corner with prices posted for all to see....

True enough, but I bet that when either you or someone you care about is about to suffer a permanent personal vaporlock, it won't take you long to find one..... And you won't be in a very good bargaining position when you get there either. My point is simply that while market forces generally work to achieve desirable, efficient ends, there is still a boundary beyond which market force alone leads to unacceptable results. Obviously, reasonable people can disagree about where that boundary lies. Price gouging for fuel? A million dollars to save your child (or you)? These are the questions we fume about and send folks to DC to answer on our behalf.

And as to the rest, hey, who ever said an abundance of testosterone enhanced intelligence??? Certainly not the guy who's been leading Marines for over 20 years. . .

brianl703 · Oct 31, 2005

If there were any similarity between gas stations and hospitals:

1)You could move really far from work or drive a gas-guzzler but only pay the same amount for gasoline as the person who lives an average distance from work or drives a normal car because the gasoline expenditure insurance company would make up the difference. Those who don't have gasoline expenditure insurance would pay more for a gallon of gasoline than the insurance company pays to the gas station for a gallon of gas.

2)If you ran out of gasoline on the side of the road, and you had no money to buy some, the gas station would still be required by law to bring you some.

ekpolk · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by brianl703:
If there were any similarity between gas stations and hospitals:

1)You could move really far from work or drive a gas-guzzler but only pay the same amount for gasoline as the person who lives an average distance from work or drives a normal car because the gasoline expenditure insurance company would make up the difference. Those who don't have gasoline expenditure insurance would pay more for a gallon of gasoline than the insurance company pays to the gas station for a gallon of gas.

2)If you ran out of gasoline on the side of the road, and you had no money to buy some, the gas station would still be required by law to bring you some.

Sorry, but you totally missed the point of my off-topic post.

It's not about whether the two are similar, obviously, they're quite different. I set the example up that way. My point was that economic forces keep things working well when there's a balance between parties to a transaction. But in situations where there's great imbalance, unacceptable or unjust results often occur. In fact the law recognizes this, thus the existence of the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (or EMTALA, the original federal anti-patient-dumping law). Thankfully, EMTALA keeps my "a million to save you child" hypothetical a hypothetical. So yes, of course the situations are different.

By the way, the transaction contemplated by the originator of the thread, a truck purchase, is a great example of a transaction where pure economic force works well and delivers good results. Several makers compete to sell big trucks. Dealers struggle to beat each other's sales figures. And few consumers have an economic (or real) gun to their head forcing them to buy today. Struggling back to the topic, I again encourage anyone making the gasser vs. diesel decision to realistically evaluate how much driving they will be doing, as it will take many miles to overcome the $6-8 thousand price of the diesel drivetrain over the gas. On the other hand, it is a free country (mostly...), so if one simply MUST have the oil burner regardless of what the numbers say, fine, but you're gonna pay for the privilege.

brianl703 · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by ekpolk:
Sorry, but you totally missed the point of my off-topic post.

I got your point. People do have a bit of control over how much gas they use..just as they have a bit of control over whether they'll need to visit the emergency room or not.

I can cut my gasoline consumption quite literally in half by arriving at work later and leaving later.

ekpolk · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by brianl703:
{snip} I got your point. People do have a bit of control over how much gas they use..just as they have a bit of control over whether they'll need to visit the emergency room or not.

I can cut my gasoline consumption quite literally in half by arriving at work later and leaving later.

If adjusting your schedule works for you, then obviously, it's a no brainer. Taking it a step further, you can just give up the job all together and then you won't need either gas or diesel. Likewise, when you've got your gravely ill child at the hospital, and you're being quoted an astronomically inflated price for critical care, that's OK, since they control the supply and your demand is very high. You can, of course, just walk away and say, "no thanks."

joatmon · Oct 31, 2005

I don't care if you buy a HD truck or not. It's totally up to you. If looking at so called 3/4 ton trucks, consider resale. As an example, an 8 year old 1/2 ton Dodge pickup with a 318 v-8 is almost unsalable in my neck of the woods. Oh, maybe $3-4 k if you find the right buyer. The 3/4 ton version with the Cummins will bring $10 easy if its in decent shape and miles under 150k.

Again, I'm not trying to sway you, just giving another point to ponder.

Best of luck,

Jack

1sttruck · Oct 31, 2005

"Struggling back to the topic, I again encourage anyone making the gasser vs. diesel decision to realistically evaluate how much driving they will be doing, as it will take many miles to overcome the $6-8 thousand price of the diesel drivetrain over the gas."

Options seem to make a much bigger difference than type of engine. I paid less for a 3/4 ton 4x4 quad cab diesel than some are paying for minivans, and much, much less than for the gasser mentioned at the start of the thread..

brianl703 · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by ekpolk:
If adjusting your schedule works for you, then obviously, it's a no brainer. Taking it a step further, you can just give up the job all together and then you won't need either gas or diesel.

I think you missed my point

Adjusting one's work schedule is one of MANY ways that one could save gas.

The endless moaning about how EPA fuel economy estimates don't meet "reality" is evidence of how some people cannot and will not accept the fact that their driving habits and maintenance habits are the main factors determining what sort of fuel economy they'll get.

ekpolk · Oct 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by 1sttruck:
"Struggling back to the topic, I again encourage anyone making the gasser vs. diesel decision to realistically evaluate how much driving they will be doing, as it will take many miles to overcome the $6-8 thousand price of the diesel drivetrain over the gas."

Options seem to make a much bigger difference than type of engine. I paid less for a 3/4 ton 4x4 quad cab diesel than some are paying for minivans, and much, much less than for the gasser mentioned at the start of the thread..

For sure, there's a big difference between the price of a bare work truck and a decked out lux-o-truck. On the other hand, on the Chevy side for example, the Duramax diesel all by itself, costs almost $5,500! If you want the Allison 6-spd automatic trans, that's another $2500 or so. With those figures in mind, it's not hard to see why guys like the friend I mentioned above opt for the 6.0L gas engine and perfectly good GM trans. Again, it all comes around to whether the buyer will drive it enough to recoup (and of course, there's the emotion/preference side of it too).

So I was cruising the Ford lot today

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