Smokers, we're getting $crewed again......

[Schmoe]

Well, if this is any future indication of the new president and his "no more taxes for those earning 250K or less," we're all screwed. For make-your-own, this new tax jumps up to around 2000%, and it raises pretty much all taxes on tobacco period. Don't give me the anti-smoker B.S., it's about what's right and fair and we've already been taxed to death higher than any other genre or social class or anything, period. He has said on record that he will sign it. Here's a quick comparitive analysis of the "TITLE VII--REVENUE PROVISIONS" especially SEC. 701. INCREASE IN EXCISE TAX RATE ON TOBACCO PRODUCTS..http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s111-275&version=pcs&nid=t0%3Apcs%3A1425

Comparison between H.R.2 and S.275:
Every single number in Section 701 has been tweaked slightly upward in the Senate version. Here are the most glaring changes and those we are most concerned with.

It looks like they've eliminated the "Small Cigar" category and the graduated tax increases from $12.50 to $50 in 4 steps over 6 years in HR 2. In S. 275, Tax on cigars would increase from $1.828 per thousand to $50.33 per thousand.

RYO jumps from $1.0969 per pound to $24.62 in HR 2, changed to $24.78 in the Senate bill.

Cigarette Papers: From 1.22 cents to 3.13 cents in HR 2, changed to 3.15 cents in S 275.

Cigarette Tubes: From 2.44 cents to 6.26 cents in HR 2, changed to 6.30 cents in S 275.

 

[javacontour]

You don't have to pay the tax. It's purely optional.

I wish more taxes could be opted out of.

 

[Schmoe]

Enlighten me, how is that possible if I want to smoke? It's either don't smoke and don't pay the taxes, or vice versa. I fail to get you meaning.

 

[chevrofreak]

100% against these new taxes

100% against smoking as well

 

[Oldmoparguy1]

Originally Posted By: Schmoe
Enlighten me, how is that possible if I want to smoke? It's either don't smoke and don't pay the taxes, or vice versa. I fail to get you meaning.


That was his point... As an ex-smoker I feel for you. It's not fair, also It will increase the black market in tobacco products to be pretty much like j....

Still, tobacco is easy to grow, just takes time cure and process.

 

[rshaw125]

I am not a smoker but this is just another tax on working people. Spin it any way you want.

 

[IndyIan]

How hard is it to make your own cigarettes? From your own tobacco? In Canada tobacco is like $100/lb in taxed death stick format... It seems like the most profitable gardening venture second only to pot.
I suspect most smokers aren't the gardening type but if I was going to spend $2000-$4000 a year on it I might want to learn.
Is tobacco illegal to grow? I can't say I've ever heard of a tobacco bust.
Ian

 

[drivewaytech]

Tobacco now, gasoline soon to come. It's all for our own good. Calm down and just sing praises of the wonderful decisions that are being made for you. If you get that worked up, smoke a cigarette or go for a drive to cool off, if you can afford it.

 

[Zaedock]

I smoke a pipe and cigars. A lot of people I know who smoke cigs roll their own. Better stock up.

 

[rszappa1]

And nonsmokers we are getting screwed again with all the high cost of health insurance because of the smokers...

 

[CivicFan]

Originally Posted By: rszappa1
And nonsmokers we are getting screwed again with all the high cost of health insurance because of the smokers...


Exactly. But you don't hear us complaining that we have been getting screwed for a long-long time.

 

[opus1]

Originally Posted By: rszappa1
And nonsmokers we are getting screwed again with all the high cost of health insurance because of the smokers...
You mean your company doesn't charge a smoker-surcharge on insurance? Mine does.

As for the original topic, I'm not a smoker but agree with the complaint.

Maybe the government should stop subsidizing growing of tobacco instead?

 

[d00df00d]

Smoking isn't a need, nor can it reasonably be considered a need (unlike things like cars and gasoline and food). That's what people mean by this tax being "optional".

Moreover, smoking carries direct, demonstrable harm to others. Taxes are, among many things, a way to mitigate the costs associated with such harm.

As far as what's right, frankly, there never should have been a right to smoke in the first place.

 

[opus1]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Smoking isn't a need, nor can it reasonably be considered a need (unlike things like cars and gasoline and food). That's what people mean by this tax being "optional".

Moreover, smoking carries direct, demonstrable harm to others. Taxes are, among many things, a way to mitigate the costs associated with such harm.

As far as what's right, frankly, there never should have been a right to smoke in the first place.


So, again, if it's not a "need", why is the government subsidizing the growing of something it thinks we shouldn't be using?

 

[Kestas]

Grow your own. It's legal in all 50 states. You have to grow a ridulous amount before you catch the attention of anybody from government.

http://www.howtogrowtobacco.com/forums/index.php

I'm only book smart for now. I have yet to grow any. I've read it's easy to grow, harvest, and dry. The curing process is difficult and is what really makes the product palatable.

$15 will get you a cigarette making machine. Kind of weird that cigarette papers are taxed.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: drivewaytech
It's all for our own good. Calm down and just sing praises of the wonderful decisions that are being made for you.

I think it's funny you're taking that tack, because that is exactly the basis for anti-smoking measures. Smokers are the ones deciding what's good for the rest of us by spewing smoke that is demonstrably harmful and diffuses at random.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: opus1
So, again, if it's not a "need", why is the government subsidizing the growing of something it thinks we shouldn't be using?

Good question.

What I meant was that it's not a personal need.

If I had to guess about the government subsidies, I'd say the government is probably just helping farmers out to keep them from getting squeezed by the rest of the industry if sales fall, and to keep the industry alive as they tax the [censored] out of it.

 

[PandaBear]

The government spending has to come from somewhere. Is it fair that almost every other nation on earth has high Tobacco tax but we don't, and have to ask the non-smoker to pay for the supposed income somewhere else?

Like others said, smoking is an option, not a necessity. Just like alcohol and any other stuff that's bad for you in general.

 

[cven]

How about that pizza,coffee,chips,bacon,pancake,cholesterol...ect tax?

These are not needs and YOU are costing ME $ on my insurance!!!!

 

[ViragoBry]

They subsidize it because, like it or not, the sale of tobacco products is a genuine economic stimulant. They've created a viscious circle by encouraging it's growth and sale, getting people hooked, and reaping the benefits through taxes. They'd be stupid NOT to subsidize it. Before too many more tax hikes on tobacco, they'll be breaking even between investment and return...if they aren't already.

As for consumers 'suffering' due to tax hikes....smoking is not a mandatory activity. If you hate the tax, kick the habit...we'll all breathe easier.

And before you even attempt to make an argument FOR smoking, consider that I've got asthma and have lost 4 family members to lung cancer. Yes, it's your right to smoke...and that's a tired and weak argument that we've already heard.

There are few things that make less sense than sticking something in your face and setting it on fire.