Shopping for new riding mower, John Deere?

[Throckmorton]

Originally Posted By: Rock_Hudstone
Originally Posted By: Throckmorton
In the D160 you have to push the RIO button each and every time you choose to mow in reverse. As soon as you go forward again or lift of the accelerator you will required to depress the RIO button again if you choose to mow in reverse at some later time.


Ugh, that would be a deal killer for me right there. Constantly mucking around with a RIO button.

There's an easy "fix" for that. Of course one should never disable safety equipment, but JD have made it very easy to jury-rig a solution.

 

[NH73]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
I agree the craftsman mower looks pretty good, but will you be able to get parts in 3-5 years when sears is gone?
Sears sold Craftsman off.

 

[AMC]

Originally Posted By: Rock_Hudstone
Yes, it is a Cub Cadet platform, thats why its not the right choice for your hilly terrain. Oversize engine/mower deck with an undersized hydro K46 trans. Also, the deck doesn't work well on rough uneven terrain, mows best on nice flat laws.

If going big step up to a real Pro Series tractor like the Craftsman 50" 26 HP:

http://www.sears.com/craftsman-pro-serie...pe=G8#Imagezoom

However, both are probably overkill for your lawn size.

Should be some sales coming up for Memorial day. Also, check out the local Sears Outlet if you have one nearby.


Every time I think I am on to something, rock comes in and crushes my dreams!
lol
The advice is appreciated. About the only thing I can find used around here are the x300 series and they don't really seem like that good of deal. I am going to visit some stores over the next few days and check some of these machines out in person. That should give me a better idea of which direction I want to go.

Here is what the local dealer has used:
http://www.nepeinc.com/s/search/inventory/usage/Used/brand/John Deere/sort/best-match

 

[dwendt44]

Those prices seem high for the age.
300 series JDs are in the $3000 range new.
Does the dealer 'bargain'?
Snowblower would, of course, add value.

 

[jeepman3071]

I wouldn't buy a used machine from a dealer. Waste of money. They take it in on trade, usually don't even change the oil or service it, then put it on the lot for $1000-2000 more than it is worth.

Search craigslist for used X-series Deeres and you will find one.

 

[Tdbo]

Originally Posted By: dwendt44
Those prices seem high for the age.
300 series JDs are in the $3000 range new.
Does the dealer 'bargain'?
Snowblower would, of course, add value.


+1.
The 2007 X300 pictured is exactly like mine.
It is priced at almost what I paid for mine new in 2007.
Even, factoring in the blower, those prices appear high.
The X350 new is a 3K tractor, and usually in the winter, factory rebates of 3-5 hundred dollars are available.

 

[AMC]

I can't find almost any used John Deere around here at all. Even the deere dealerships have almost no used on hand and what they do have is over priced. John deere is not a very popular brand around here. For zero turns, everything around here is Exmark or Scag. Tractors are almost all Kubota with some Case or New Holland thrown in. Residential grade stuff is all cub cadet or craftsman.

Anyways, I went and check out some mowers today. I looked at John Deere, Husky, Cub Cadet, Craftsman, Poulan and Troy bilt. Here are some of my impressions based on my experience with mowers and wrenching:

Husky- These machines looked and felt the most like my older craftsman that I am using now. The overall feel and quality of everything seemed just OK and the bright orange paint was irritating. They were OK, but I was not particularly impressed.

Troy- bilt- Easily the lowest quality besides maybe Poulan. Thin, flimsy sheet metal on the fender deck and mowing deck, week looking front axle and frame, poor fit and finish yuck, no way.

Poulan- The model I looked at had the 6 speed manual transmission and that was it's only re-deeming feature. Same as the Troy, thin flimsy, under built, poor fit and finish. The deck had no scalp wheels or wash port. Everything about this felt economy and I am pretty sure I permanently dented the fender deck just climbing on it.

Craftsman- I looked at the pro model I was considering, the base model with the CVT and a few others. Overall Craftsman was OK. Better overall feel and finish than the troy and poulan, about on par with the husky, minus the orange paint. The steering linkage on the base models looked extremely weak and under sized. The 46" pro model was very nice. It had a larger frame, deck and front end which looked like good quality. The only thing I didn't like about the pro model was the fact that the hood only opened about half way and didn't give good access to work on it. Other than that, it seemed to be well built and sturdy.

Cub Cadet- I looked at the XT1 42 and 46 inch models. Overall these machines were pretty nice. All of the components seemed well built and put together. The steering system and front axles looked a little better built than others. The seat was comfortable and the only complaints I had were pretty minor. I didn't really like the electric PTO and the hood only opened to about a 50 degree angle and didn't give good access to the engine. The 42" model goes for $1499, minus the 10% off I get and it seems like probably the best bang for the buck.

John Deere- I checked out all of the D series from the 105 to the 170. I kind of liked JD before and after taking a closer look, I can see why I was feeling that way. I liked these the most. Everything seemed well built and sturdy. The front axles and steering system seemed very well built and well thought out. The deck suspension and leveling system also seemed very well built and easier to level the deck than the others. The seat and ergonomics were by far the most roomy and comfortable. One big thing I noticed was that the JD mowers were the only ones that have grease zerks on the blade spindles. Not even the craftsman pro or cub cadet had them, that I could find anyways. The model I am considering is the D110 and it is $1699 but the home depot gives me 10% military discount plus, HD is offering a $200 rebate right now. This should make it the best value. The only things I didn't like about the D110 was the fact that it only had 2 scalp wheels and the wiring harnesses were a mess. On every JD I looked at, the wiring was a rat's nest and I would probably take a few extra minutes with some zip ties to neaten it up. The RIO button was silly but 2 spade connectors and a short piece of wire should bypass it. The plastic hood and plastic hood hinge didn't bother me and it opened the widest for good engine access which I like. I can't see breaking the hood or the hinge as long as you don't slam the hood open or shut.

I am going to keep looking for a lightly used X300 or 500 series JD and consider it but just from my experience today, I am leaning back towards the John Deere D110. It seems like the best combination of quality and value for what I need. If the transaxle fails, new ones look like they are around $350 on Ebay. I would have to spend much more than $350 initially to get a mower with a much better transaxle anyways so I am not too worried about it.

Decisions, Decisions...... Good problems to have I guess!

 

[Throckmorton]

What do you make of the cubs with efi? They offer both single cylinder and v-twins with efi depending on whether you visit a big box or a dealer. These engines appear to be priced lower than the kohler or kawasaki engines, but I wonder if they might actually be better built.

 

[Eddie]

I am running a JD L111 with at 20 HP B&S Twin 42 inch that I really like. Jerk fitting on front axle and front wheels but, not on the blade spindles. Ed

 

[jeepman3071]

Of the consumer grade machines, the John Deere 100 series are hard to beat.

My 2005 G110 was bought at Home Depot. It is basically an in-between model that they sold for a few years. It is similar to the Craftsman Pro. It is a 100 series with a tougher hydro (K66) transmission and a wider 54" deck, bigger tires, etc. The rest of it is exactly like the entry level 100 series. It has over 700 hours now with very little problems. A few things have broken, namely the steering arms, but besides that just normal maintenance. I believe the cause of the steering arm failure was my dad being a little rough with the snowblower attachment, but that is up for debate still.

The tractor gets used year round for mowing, sucking up leaves with the bagger, the 42" snowblower attachment, and pulling things with the cart. It has been extremely reliable and comfortable to use. The few times I've needed parts they were very easy to find.

 

[Astro_Guy]

My in-laws have the John Deere D110 and I have the D140. There is a noticeable difference in power between the two, far more than the 3 HP difference would suggest. My lawn gets cut a lot quicker, and its not because of the extra 6 inches of cutting deck width. If you are going to go with John Deere, step up at least to the D125 with the 20 HP V-Twin. That would be an extra $100 well spent in my book.

 

[JTK]

AMC- it's the absolute worst time of year to buy a used machine being peak mowing season. Seller's market, not a buyer's. Like you say, you'll be lucky to find 1 JD for every 10 cheaper unit. It's all about the volumes of them out there, the market, etc. IMO, it's the way it's always been.

I agree with the above that even the big box style JDs are top of the mark in terms of the cheapies. Next being anything Husqvarna group built, then all the MTD flavors.

 

[Rock_Hudstone]

Originally Posted By: AMC
I The model I am considering is the D110 and it is $1699 but the home depot gives me 10% military discount plus, HD is offering a $200 rebate right now. This should make it the best value. The only things I didn't like about the D110 was the fact that it only had 2 scalp wheels and the wiring harnesses were a mess. On every JD I looked at, the wiring was a rat's nest and I would probably take a few extra minutes with some zip ties to neaten it up. The RIO button was silly but 2 spade connectors and a short piece of wire should bypass it. The plastic hood and plastic hood hinge didn't bother me and it opened the widest for good engine access which I like. I can't see breaking the hood or the hinge as long as you don't slam the hood open or shut.

If the transaxle fails, new ones look like they are around $350 on Ebay. I would have to spend much more than $350 initially to get a mower with a much better transaxle anyways so I am not too worried about it.

Its your money of course, but no way would I pay a premium price for machine that may or may not need: Transaxle replaced at some point, extra scalp wheels, bypass the RIO switch and hope the hood doesn't break if accidentally slammed, etc.
Plus a wide 18 turn radius and not to mention the K46 Hydro isn't good for hilly terrain.

In my humble opinion, the Craftsman Fast Auto 42 inch tractor or the 6 speed model are a far better buy and Sears will probably knock off another $100 or so for Memorial day.

For less money than the JD you get far stronger trans (CVT or manual), better high vent deck for rough terrain with 4 scalp wheels, 6 inch tight turn radius, B&S Platinum engine, steel hood (mostly) and no RIO switch.

 

[AMC]

Originally Posted By: Rock_Hudstone
Its your money of course, but no way would I pay a premium price for machine that may or may not need: Transaxle replaced at some point, extra scalp wheels, bypass the RIO switch and hope the hood doesn't break if accidentally slammed, etc.
Plus a wide 18 turn radius and not to mention the K46 Hydro isn't good for hilly terrain.

In my humble opinion, the Craftsman Fast Auto 42 inch tractor or the 6 speed model are a far better buy and Sears will probably knock off another $100 or so for Memorial day.

For less money than the JD you get far stronger trans (CVT or manual), better high vent deck for rough terrain with 4 scalp wheels, 6 inch tight turn radius, B&S Platinum engine, steel hood (mostly) and no RIO switch.


That is why I am conflicted..... The craftsman does have some big things going for it, especially the transaxle.

That being said, the Deere is still a few bucks cheaper (because of the rebate) than the Craftsman believe it or not and I do like the peace of mind with dealer/parts support the Deere has going for it. The more comfy seat was nice and If I do decide to upgrade later, the JD should hold its value a bit better.

I am still confused about a few things though. Between the JD and Craftsman, the deck looked better on the JD (minus the extra wheels). Why is the craftsman deck better? All its pulleys were exposed, it had no grease zerks and didn't have as fine of adjustments. The height of the deck looked to be about the same and I believe they are the same gauge sheet metal also?

The steering on the Craftsman was a bit of a worry for me. How long has the "Tight turn" steering been around with the Craftsman? I ask because the design of it looked really poor and I wonder how well that system holds up over time. It was basically an extra spacer between the tie rod and steering arm which allowed the front wheel to turn further at lock. It didn't look very robust and added a few extra bolts to the system. If it holds up well and there are no complaints about it, then I guess it is just another thing the craftsman has going for it but I wasn't sure just looking at it.

In other news, I did the brake job that my current machine needed but I still have the itch for something new.

 

[Rock_Hudstone]

Originally Posted By: AMC
[That is why I am conflicted..... The craftsman does have some big things going for it, especially the transaxle.

That being said, the Deere is still a few bucks cheaper (because of the rebate) than the Craftsman believe it or not and I do like the peace of mind with dealer/parts support the Deere has going for it. The more comfy seat was nice and If I do decide to upgrade later, the JD should hold its value a bit better.

I am still confused about a few things though. Between the JD and Craftsman, the deck looked better on the JD (minus the extra wheels). Why is the craftsman deck better? All its pulleys were exposed,

The steering on the Craftsman was a bit of a worry for me. How long has the "Tight turn" steering been around with the Craftsman?


I wouldn't base my decision on dealer support, warranty, etc, Get the best machine for the money thats right for your property. I think you had the right idea before of going with the 6 speed Craftsman its nice to be able to just put in gear and go.
If that JD hydro-trans blows up out of warranty a few years down the road any intial savings from rebates or discounts goes down the tubes, not to mention the hassle involved.

Craftsman isn't gong anywhere and the platform now built by Husqvarna has been around a long time and parts are readily available. As for the deck, exposed is not necessarily a bad thing, easier to clean/service and the spindles usually last the lifetime of the mower unless you hit a stump or something.
Also, the left side pulley cover should swap over from your old Craftsman, the new decks still have the mounting point holes. The JD deck is fine but best suited for flat suburban lawns and may scalp on rough terrain.

As for the tight turn steering its been around since 2010 or 11 with no major issues. I agree about the seat however, the Craftsman low back seat leaves a lot to be desired. I would lean towards a model that had the high back seat stock or would upgrade it myself.

 

[cronk]

I honestly think the JD units are the best of the cheap home owner mowers.
The frame and steering is well designed. The decks are good quality and cut nice.
Very well ergonomics and comfort.
Much of the hydro transmission problems can be avoided with proper maintenance.
There is a cooling fan by the belt pulley, it should be periodically inspected for broken blades.
The Transmission should be cleaned of clippings and debris, blow it off with the air hose.
They run much cooler when kept clean.

The transmissions can also be removed and dump the oil out and replace with synthetic.

Many folks are getting good life out of these transaxles with good maintenance.

 

[AMC]

Originally Posted By: JTK
AMC- it's the absolute worst time of year to buy a used machine being peak mowing season. Seller's market, not a buyer's. Like you say, you'll be lucky to find 1 JD for every 10 cheaper unit. It's all about the volumes of them out there, the market, etc. IMO, it's the way it's always been.

I agree with the above that even the big box style JDs are top of the mark in terms of the cheapies. Next being anything Husqvarna group built, then all the MTD flavors.


What would be the best time to buy something like this, middle of winter?

I have considered either just waiting to get a new mower or buy the basic Craftsman or JD riding mower for now and then keep my eyes peeled for a deal on a more heavy duty, used garden tractor later. I could use a bigger machine like that to mow the main part of my yard and then plow or snow blow in the winter. The smaller parts of my property, I could just mow with a push mower. I am currently paying $50 a pop every time it snows more than 4 inches to get my driveway and parking lot done and I would love to be able to take care of it myself. Even with a decent sized snow blower, it takes too long and is a lot of work for me to do it myself.

I did find a JD LX277 with 4 wheel steering for $950, a GX 335 and similar sized tractors in good shape in my area. They are not real common but they are out there.

 

[NH73]

Originally Posted By: cronk
I honestly think the JD units are the best of the cheap home owner mowers.
The frame and steering is well designed. The decks are good quality and cut nice.
Very well ergonomics and comfort.
Much of the hydro transmission problems can be avoided with proper maintenance.
There is a cooling fan by the belt pulley, it should be periodically inspected for broken blades.
The Transmission should be cleaned of clippings and debris, blow it off with the air hose.
They run much cooler when kept clean.

The transmissions can also be removed and dump the oil out and replace with synthetic.

Many folks are getting good life out of these transaxles with good maintenance.


Agree here. Hydros are great, but like most things, the transmission tend to be the weakest link. So, yes, keep clean and change the oil and use synthetic.

 

[AMC]

Update: To make a long story shorter; So after some more research, soul searching and browsing craigslist, I found myself attracted to the G-Series John Deere lawn tractors. The G-series feature strong frames, reliable engines and usually K71 transaxles that are fully serviceable. I found a mint condition 2002 GT235 on craigslist about a half hour away. It had 250 hours, a power flow bagger and a fresh tune up. The seller was asking $2,000. I told him I would be there with cash in hand and a trailer in tow by noon today. I got a text at 9:30 am as I was leaving the bank, the machine just sold.......

Now that my current craftsman had gotten some TLC and I got the brakes working, I think I may really focus on finding that used unicorn G-series John Deere I am looking for.....

 

[JTK]

Keep looking. You'll find one eventually. A guy near me just sold an 18yr/old Craftsman garden tractor with the between the knees dual range gear shift, Kohler V-twin, kind of sloppy steering and a 50" cutting deck a bit on the beat side. He got $600 for it and only paid $2000 for it 18yrs ago. Point being, these things sell quick this time of year.