When seconds count the police are minutes away. Maybe if someone besides the shooters were armed at the school they could have stopped this tradgedy or kept the number of dead to a lower number. The answer is not to take away the guns of law abiding people.
Shooting at Connecticut Elementary School
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Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: oilmaven
blah blah blah
Wow. It is folks such as yourself who claim not to be anti gun who will help to bring about the end of gun ownership.
Agreed 15,000%. Be aware of people like that.
Originally Posted By: oilmaven
blah blah blah
Wow. It is folks such as yourself who claim not to be anti gun who will help to bring about the end of gun ownership.
Agreed 15,000%. Be aware of people like that.
Originally Posted By: oilmaven
We inevitably compare guns to "pencils and bats" to make ANY opposition to guns seem silly and "unimformed". I'm NOT against guns for sport...their intended use is obvious (although I don't know a lot of hunters who bagged their kill with a handgun). I also don't claim to be a gun expert so those of you who are can flame me all you want. I guess I need to understand why ALL guns should be allowed with NO controls whatsoever. Most people I know are not opposed to responsible gun ownership. We're talking about measures to make access to guns and types of weapons that noone would ever use for sport (especially by the deranged) more difficult.
I expected a reaction...and got it. I don't have to come here for it...just have to mention gun control at a family dinner or public venue around here and I'm besieged in the same way (don't know what you're talking about...only criminals will have guns, etc.). I repeat...I'm not opposed to guns or gun ownership. I'm opposed to the a system that permits gun proliferation where is isn't warranted so easy.
I agree about control. There are differences between control and banning them. Taking away all guns, or attempting to, won't help anything. Criminals don't follow the laws, so what makes people think they will follow gun control laws. There SHOULD be stricter rules to purchasing one though, such as a background check and psych evaluation.
We inevitably compare guns to "pencils and bats" to make ANY opposition to guns seem silly and "unimformed". I'm NOT against guns for sport...their intended use is obvious (although I don't know a lot of hunters who bagged their kill with a handgun). I also don't claim to be a gun expert so those of you who are can flame me all you want. I guess I need to understand why ALL guns should be allowed with NO controls whatsoever. Most people I know are not opposed to responsible gun ownership. We're talking about measures to make access to guns and types of weapons that noone would ever use for sport (especially by the deranged) more difficult.
I expected a reaction...and got it. I don't have to come here for it...just have to mention gun control at a family dinner or public venue around here and I'm besieged in the same way (don't know what you're talking about...only criminals will have guns, etc.). I repeat...I'm not opposed to guns or gun ownership. I'm opposed to the a system that permits gun proliferation where is isn't warranted so easy.
I agree about control. There are differences between control and banning them. Taking away all guns, or attempting to, won't help anything. Criminals don't follow the laws, so what makes people think they will follow gun control laws. There SHOULD be stricter rules to purchasing one though, such as a background check and psych evaluation.
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
I AM for bannning assault weapons, multi-round magazines and clips and weapons not intended for legitimate sport or "self-defense" (the latter accounting for an extremely small percentage of gun use...despite the claims otherwise...additional statistics indicate that many weapons intended for self-defense end up being used for suicide and/or homicide by the purchaser or someone else).
Thank you so much for politicizing this tradgedy.
So you are for banning guns. Just another back door gun banning comment.
There are no assault weapons that you and I can buy at Cabela's. These are all anti-gun media terms meant to incite feelings, not facts.
Quote:
additional statistics indicate that many weapons intended for self-defense end up being used for suicide and/or homicide by the purchaser or someone else).
Where, from the Brady bunch vault of falsified statistics?
I AM for bannning assault weapons, multi-round magazines and clips and weapons not intended for legitimate sport or "self-defense" (the latter accounting for an extremely small percentage of gun use...despite the claims otherwise...additional statistics indicate that many weapons intended for self-defense end up being used for suicide and/or homicide by the purchaser or someone else).
Thank you so much for politicizing this tradgedy.
So you are for banning guns. Just another back door gun banning comment.
There are no assault weapons that you and I can buy at Cabela's. These are all anti-gun media terms meant to incite feelings, not facts.
Quote:
additional statistics indicate that many weapons intended for self-defense end up being used for suicide and/or homicide by the purchaser or someone else).
Where, from the Brady bunch vault of falsified statistics?
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Quote:
I repeat...I'm not opposed to guns or gun ownership. I'm opposed to the a system that permits gun proliferation where is isn't warranted so easy.
That is a very squishy and undefinable position.
Quote:
I'm NOT against guns for sport
Then you need to very specifically define what "sport" is and what guns are "needed" for those sports.
Quote:
We're talking about measures to make access to guns and types of weapons that noone would ever use for sport (especially by the deranged) more difficult.
What in the history of governments makes you believe they are qualified to do all of the things you would like?
I repeat...I'm not opposed to guns or gun ownership. I'm opposed to the a system that permits gun proliferation where is isn't warranted so easy.
That is a very squishy and undefinable position.
Quote:
I'm NOT against guns for sport
Then you need to very specifically define what "sport" is and what guns are "needed" for those sports.
Quote:
We're talking about measures to make access to guns and types of weapons that noone would ever use for sport (especially by the deranged) more difficult.
What in the history of governments makes you believe they are qualified to do all of the things you would like?
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
This once again smells like a "manchurian candidate".
That comment smells crazy and small. We're all looking for sense in a senseless thing; but let's not get silly in trying to find an easy explanation.
It looks now like he was autistic -
http://nation.foxnews.com/ct-school-shoo...nality-disorder
This once again smells like a "manchurian candidate".
That comment smells crazy and small. We're all looking for sense in a senseless thing; but let's not get silly in trying to find an easy explanation.
It looks now like he was autistic -
http://nation.foxnews.com/ct-school-shoo...nality-disorder
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
"Call of Duty" and other life-denegrating pastimes exists because there is a demand for it; and that tells a story as far as I am concerned. The mental sickness and the lack of empathy for human life, the enjoyment of pretend killing and these products cultivate one another.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: oilmaven
blah blah blah
Wow. It is folks such as yourself who claim not to be anti gun who will help to bring about the end of gun ownership.
Agreed 15,000%. Be aware of people like that.
The Onion agrees
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
"Call of Duty" and other life-denegrating pastimes exists because there is a demand for it; and that tells a story as far as I am concerned. The mental sickness and the lack of empathy for human life, the enjoyment of pretend killing and these products cultivate one another.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: oilmaven
blah blah blah
Wow. It is folks such as yourself who claim not to be anti gun who will help to bring about the end of gun ownership.
Agreed 15,000%. Be aware of people like that.
The Onion agrees
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
I play call of duty and I play grand theft auto. I certainly have done nothing of the sort lately ...
I think it boils down to a few , unlreated things.
Some people have mental issues and they pop when something happens. This may have been the case.
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
I play call of duty and I play grand theft auto. I certainly have done nothing of the sort lately ...
I think it boils down to a few , unlreated things.
Some people have mental issues and they pop when something happens. This may have been the case.
Quote:
There SHOULD be stricter rules to purchasing one though, such as a background check and psych evaluation.
Like reading tests for voting?
You are asking for arbitrary roadblocks to people practicing their 2nd Amendment rights. You don't think there is plenty of room for exclusion their?
Your assumption is that the people writing the rules are fair minded and rational.
There SHOULD be stricter rules to purchasing one though, such as a background check and psych evaluation.
Like reading tests for voting?
You are asking for arbitrary roadblocks to people practicing their 2nd Amendment rights. You don't think there is plenty of room for exclusion their?
Your assumption is that the people writing the rules are fair minded and rational.
Originally Posted By: Miller88
I play call of duty and I play grand theft auto. I certainly have done nothing of the sort lately ...
Lately?!
Originally Posted By: Tempest
You are asking for arbitrary roadblocks to people practicing their 2nd Amendment rights.
Tempest, et al... I read an interesting comment on a post elsewhere on the interweb an hour or so ago. I'd like your take on it: Regarding this story, and the inevitable cacophony of gun control debate in the comments that followed it, someone said - and I will heavily paraphrase - "the framers of the 2nd amendment conceived of it at a time when a muzzle-loader took a minute and a half to load and was accurate to within a broad side of a barn at 50 paces". His point being, I believe, that the cultural landscape and circumstances have changed and that any respectable system of law ought to reflect the nature of its' society rather than dictate it. You guys seem to regard your constitution as a holy document that you must abide by, rather than something that should reflect that society is some 200 years on. It seems like something is broken, badly broken, and you guys are still bowing to documents and ideas from hundreds of years ago - which were drafted and implemented when they were *entirely relevant and practical*
Your thoughts?
I play call of duty and I play grand theft auto. I certainly have done nothing of the sort lately ...
Lately?!
Originally Posted By: Tempest
You are asking for arbitrary roadblocks to people practicing their 2nd Amendment rights.
Tempest, et al... I read an interesting comment on a post elsewhere on the interweb an hour or so ago. I'd like your take on it: Regarding this story, and the inevitable cacophony of gun control debate in the comments that followed it, someone said - and I will heavily paraphrase - "the framers of the 2nd amendment conceived of it at a time when a muzzle-loader took a minute and a half to load and was accurate to within a broad side of a barn at 50 paces". His point being, I believe, that the cultural landscape and circumstances have changed and that any respectable system of law ought to reflect the nature of its' society rather than dictate it. You guys seem to regard your constitution as a holy document that you must abide by, rather than something that should reflect that society is some 200 years on. It seems like something is broken, badly broken, and you guys are still bowing to documents and ideas from hundreds of years ago - which were drafted and implemented when they were *entirely relevant and practical*
Your thoughts?
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
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Was the shooter on "psychotropic" drugs...?
One thing that most of these shooters have in common is that they are on them in some form or another. One of the side effects is suicidal thoughts....just saying.
One thing that most of these shooters have in common is that they are on them in some form or another. One of the side effects is suicidal thoughts....just saying.
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Was the shooter on "psychotropic" drugs...?
One thing that most of these shooters have in common is that they are on them in some form or another. One of the side effects is suicidal thoughts....just saying.
I posted earlier from Fox indicating that his older brother said the shooter was autistic.
http://nation.foxnews.com/ct-school-shoo...nality-disorder
Was the shooter on "psychotropic" drugs...?
One thing that most of these shooters have in common is that they are on them in some form or another. One of the side effects is suicidal thoughts....just saying.
I posted earlier from Fox indicating that his older brother said the shooter was autistic.
http://nation.foxnews.com/ct-school-shoo...nality-disorder
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
You guys seem to regard your constitution as a holy document that you must abide by, rather than something that should reflect that society is some 200 years on.
You bet we do. We also go back to the intent and purpose of the Constitution by reading the papers and documents of the framers and authors of the Constitution.
Our Constitution should be respected and not be viewed as a document that is irrelevant or out of date (as Progressives would have you believe).
Otherwise, any administration could make it capricious and then we would have a dictatorship.
Quote:
Was the shooter on "psychotropic" drugs...?
It appears so. We don't confront the problem, we drug our kids and then tell them to go play their video games.
You guys seem to regard your constitution as a holy document that you must abide by, rather than something that should reflect that society is some 200 years on.
You bet we do. We also go back to the intent and purpose of the Constitution by reading the papers and documents of the framers and authors of the Constitution.
Our Constitution should be respected and not be viewed as a document that is irrelevant or out of date (as Progressives would have you believe).
Otherwise, any administration could make it capricious and then we would have a dictatorship.
Quote:
Was the shooter on "psychotropic" drugs...?
It appears so. We don't confront the problem, we drug our kids and then tell them to go play their video games.
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Originally Posted By: buster
Some people are just defective and don't belong in society.
I am not sure what you are proposing as a solution??
Some people are just defective and don't belong in society.
I am not sure what you are proposing as a solution??
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
If you or anyone else needs to believe a sky wizard crafted existence *in order for you to revere human life*, there is still a major problem. This is no time for fairy tales, as simple and comforting as they may be. If we are all adrift in a mindless cosmos, shouldn't that be MORE of an impetus for us to pull together and make compassion the cornerstone? Either way, scientists are far far away from understanding the world below the Planck constant, and you and I are far too stupid to understand the mind of you-know-who. A bunch of clueless morons arguing over things far above their heads won't get us anywhere. It's about our behaviour towards one another, regardless of faith or lack thereof.
Science reports findings and does not have to impact YOUR faith (presuming it is strong enough not to be threatened by information) not your spirituality. They can co-exist and support each other if the attitudes of those yapping about it permit it.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
So let's FORCE everyone to bow down and believe what - let me guess - *you* tell them to believe? Forceful coersion like that is for the Taliban.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
There is something I hope we can all agree ought to be re-enforced in every way and at every level of a young person's development into a member of our communities.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
I thought this issue went away. Killing doesn't stop killing, nor does it serve justice, nor does it bring anything positve to extremely negative phenomena: it only makes more killing; and the anger for (useless) retribution and the destruction that follows it, is no different from the anger of a cold-blooded murderer.
Quote:
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
If you or anyone else needs to believe a sky wizard crafted existence *in order for you to revere human life*, there is still a major problem. This is no time for fairy tales, as simple and comforting as they may be. If we are all adrift in a mindless cosmos, shouldn't that be MORE of an impetus for us to pull together and make compassion the cornerstone? Either way, scientists are far far away from understanding the world below the Planck constant, and you and I are far too stupid to understand the mind of you-know-who. A bunch of clueless morons arguing over things far above their heads won't get us anywhere. It's about our behaviour towards one another, regardless of faith or lack thereof.
Science reports findings and does not have to impact YOUR faith (presuming it is strong enough not to be threatened by information) not your spirituality. They can co-exist and support each other if the attitudes of those yapping about it permit it.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
So let's FORCE everyone to bow down and believe what - let me guess - *you* tell them to believe? Forceful coersion like that is for the Taliban.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
There is something I hope we can all agree ought to be re-enforced in every way and at every level of a young person's development into a member of our communities.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
I thought this issue went away. Killing doesn't stop killing, nor does it serve justice, nor does it bring anything positve to extremely negative phenomena: it only makes more killing; and the anger for (useless) retribution and the destruction that follows it, is no different from the anger of a cold-blooded murderer.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
I think its been proven that the death penalty costs more $$ because of endless appeals and does not deter murder. The death penalty has already put one innocent person do death. Probably more. I think we are the only Western culture with the death penalty still.
Quote:
the lack of empathy for human life
And I believe that is caused by a number of factors:
1. certain aspects of science telling you that you came from nothing, that you are nothing more than an organism adrift in a mindless universe with no rules
2. the drifting away from a belief in a higher power and an absolute morality
3. unnacountability of one's own actions and the lack of what effect your actions might be on others.
4. the watering down of laws for death penalties.
I think its been proven that the death penalty costs more $$ because of endless appeals and does not deter murder. The death penalty has already put one innocent person do death. Probably more. I think we are the only Western culture with the death penalty still.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
Are you kidding me? I'm serious, you must be joking. Video games don't make people violent, they don't create killers. I play plenty of violent video games, I've probably racked up a few thousand kills in games like FEAR, Crysis, and most recently, Planetside 2. I'm pretty sure i'm still sane and are absolutely disgusted by this. And so are a lot of people I know who play games.
And I notice it's never young people who actually play games or in this generation that are of this opinion, it's older people who dont' play video games, and think they are a waste of time and money. Well you are entitled to your opinion, but DO NOT try to force your anti-game attitude on those of us normal people who enjoy playing video games.
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
The violence is a symptom, guns or no guns. The problem is cultural.
You seem so angry and panicky and prone to violence. Take away the guns and you'll be stabbing yourselves.
I think it's all the violent video games that young kids are being raised on. I blame Call of Duty for this current generation of absolutely insane 20 somethings.
Are you kidding me? I'm serious, you must be joking. Video games don't make people violent, they don't create killers. I play plenty of violent video games, I've probably racked up a few thousand kills in games like FEAR, Crysis, and most recently, Planetside 2. I'm pretty sure i'm still sane and are absolutely disgusted by this. And so are a lot of people I know who play games.
And I notice it's never young people who actually play games or in this generation that are of this opinion, it's older people who dont' play video games, and think they are a waste of time and money. Well you are entitled to your opinion, but DO NOT try to force your anti-game attitude on those of us normal people who enjoy playing video games.
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