Will that be any different and why?
Shifting degrades quickly after fluid change.
- Thread starter Huhwhye
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Maybe in your car for a left handed reason.
You may need a slightly heavier viscosity fluid, which the present fluid simulates when cold.
You may need a slightly heavier viscosity fluid, which the present fluid simulates when cold.
Yeah, I just don't want to make another $30 mistake. That Royal Purple wasn't cheap. But the alternative is changing the fluid every 8-10k which has gotten old.
I have heard iffy feedback about RP transmission fluids.
Maybe Amsoil in an appropriate grade would be best, at this point.
Maybe Amsoil in an appropriate grade would be best, at this point.
"appropriate grade" meaning ATF of MTL?
Earlier undummy quoted "Synchromesh" as being ~9 cst. From the context I think he meant "Synchromax". He was stating that RP is thicker than ATF. It is not. The datasheet indicates Synchromax is 7.7 cSt.
I ran RP SM for one round in my ZF 5-speed (1998 BMW). I wasn't impressed or disappointed, but it sure was thin. I've run MTF-LT-1 (factory), Redline D4ATF, RP SM, Redline MTL. I chose the MTL most recently to step up a grade from ATFs.
Redline's datasheets (like http://www.redlineoil.com/pdf/6.pdf) indicate that D4ATF is 7.5, and MTL is 10.6.
When I first put MTL in, I noticed no downside and an improvement in shifting in certain circumstances. In weather below freezing I noticed slightly more difficultly shifting until the fluid warmed a little but it was barely noticeable. Now I've noticed shift quality going downhill, but I'm not sure if I might be looking at shifter linkage play coming into the mix instead of just the fluid.
I do know that only with RL MTL did a cold-weather sticky 5th gear detent go away completely so that it is unnoticeable. This issue was documented in a Roundel magazine several years ago but I've lost a working reference to it. In sub-freezing weather if you press over to 5th one of the springs doesn't pop right back to center the stick in neutral unless you push over to the 1/2 gaiter. With MTL this never happened once this past winter.
I ran RP SM for one round in my ZF 5-speed (1998 BMW). I wasn't impressed or disappointed, but it sure was thin. I've run MTF-LT-1 (factory), Redline D4ATF, RP SM, Redline MTL. I chose the MTL most recently to step up a grade from ATFs.
Redline's datasheets (like http://www.redlineoil.com/pdf/6.pdf) indicate that D4ATF is 7.5, and MTL is 10.6.
When I first put MTL in, I noticed no downside and an improvement in shifting in certain circumstances. In weather below freezing I noticed slightly more difficultly shifting until the fluid warmed a little but it was barely noticeable. Now I've noticed shift quality going downhill, but I'm not sure if I might be looking at shifter linkage play coming into the mix instead of just the fluid.
I do know that only with RL MTL did a cold-weather sticky 5th gear detent go away completely so that it is unnoticeable. This issue was documented in a Roundel magazine several years ago but I've lost a working reference to it. In sub-freezing weather if you press over to 5th one of the springs doesn't pop right back to center the stick in neutral unless you push over to the 1/2 gaiter. With MTL this never happened once this past winter.
That's interesting that RP SM is the same as ATF. It seemed a lot thicker going in and the little bit a spilled on the garage floor
Maybe you were draining sheared (and warm?) ATF and replacing with ambient, fresh RP?
Last time I helped a friend change the ATF in his ford manual trans, the new ATF we put in seemed a lot thicker than what came out. The old stuff was blackened, and poured like water. Trans wasn't even that hot at the time.
Nope Craig, synchromesh is 9cst.
Synchromax is the fluid for ATF replacement. I did not say it was any thicker then ATF.
IMO, it is a similar thickness when compared to Dexron/Mercon ATF. And, it has a excellent cst range across the colder temps and decent low pour point.
For comparison, ATFs on the market run from 5.5-10cst.
If the SynchroMAX level is correct, and the previous fluid is an ATF, you shouldn't really notice a difference. If anything, when cold, you should have easier shifting and better MPG/HP from the easier move-ability of the fluid.
Looking at a fluid for thickness comparison is meaningless. Even a few degrees will make a difference. And, a few miles on a fluid can shear it. Even barely warm sheared fluid will pour and look way thinner then room temperature bottle fluid. If you want numbers, practice some UOA/VOAs on your fluids.
Synchromax is the fluid for ATF replacement. I did not say it was any thicker then ATF.
IMO, it is a similar thickness when compared to Dexron/Mercon ATF. And, it has a excellent cst range across the colder temps and decent low pour point.
For comparison, ATFs on the market run from 5.5-10cst.
If the SynchroMAX level is correct, and the previous fluid is an ATF, you shouldn't really notice a difference. If anything, when cold, you should have easier shifting and better MPG/HP from the easier move-ability of the fluid.
Looking at a fluid for thickness comparison is meaningless. Even a few degrees will make a difference. And, a few miles on a fluid can shear it. Even barely warm sheared fluid will pour and look way thinner then room temperature bottle fluid. If you want numbers, practice some UOA/VOAs on your fluids.
I guess what I am most concerned with at this time is the difference in how the truck drives. It is significantly slower and feels like it is laboring. Otherwise the truck is tip top and all maintenance has been done. Longer drives makes no difference.
Something isn't right,
I took a sample of the drained ford ATF but you don't need analysis to tell you its wasted. At 8000 miles its very dark and water thin.
The way you set level is to fill until it dribbles out the fill hole. So I know its where it needs to be.
Something isn't right,
I took a sample of the drained ford ATF but you don't need analysis to tell you its wasted. At 8000 miles its very dark and water thin.
The way you set level is to fill until it dribbles out the fill hole. So I know its where it needs to be.
try a TES295 ATF such as Citgo's QuatraSyn
http://www.docs.citgo.com/msds_pi/10148.pdf
CITGO QuatraSyn Synthetic Transmission Fluid is engineered with a proprietary combination of
synthetic base stocks and additives. This synergistic combination of components is designed to work in
harmony with the transmission components while offering the very best in fluid life and performance.
CITGO QuatraSyn Synthetic Transmission Fluid provides:
• Extended drain and filter change intervals resulting in reduced oil disposal cost.
• Outstanding low temperature performance.
• Excellent thermal and oxidation stability resulting in better transmission performance through a
reduction in sludge and deposit formation.
• Shear stability since it contains NO viscosity modifiers.
• Low traction coefficients which can provide increased fuel economy.
QuatraSyn is recommended for use in all GM and Ford Transmissions
if this won't hold up and not shear, nothing will
try your local truck/hvy equip. service company or tractor/farm equip service comp. for TES295 rated ATF
http://www.docs.citgo.com/msds_pi/10148.pdf
CITGO QuatraSyn Synthetic Transmission Fluid is engineered with a proprietary combination of
synthetic base stocks and additives. This synergistic combination of components is designed to work in
harmony with the transmission components while offering the very best in fluid life and performance.
CITGO QuatraSyn Synthetic Transmission Fluid provides:
• Extended drain and filter change intervals resulting in reduced oil disposal cost.
• Outstanding low temperature performance.
• Excellent thermal and oxidation stability resulting in better transmission performance through a
reduction in sludge and deposit formation.
• Shear stability since it contains NO viscosity modifiers.
• Low traction coefficients which can provide increased fuel economy.
QuatraSyn is recommended for use in all GM and Ford Transmissions
if this won't hold up and not shear, nothing will
try your local truck/hvy equip. service company or tractor/farm equip service comp. for TES295 rated ATF
this is in a light duty 5 speed manual built by Mazda/Ford and used across their product line
no cooler, no filter, small sump
no cooler, no filter, small sump
I ran a few years back the redline d4 atf and in 8000 miles the oil turned black and I had to dump it cause when cold my taurus would not come out very easily out of first gear or go into second, after 2 weeks of this I dumped it out and couldn't believe how the pretty red fluid I put in a few months back was as dirty as SA rated engine oil in a scap metal truck
Well, I'm curious where this goes, just bought a B2300 5sp and the shifting is horrible; I bought some RL D4 but now I'm not sure if I'll be pouring it in.
-T
-T
I am open to suggestions and appreciate everything posted. If I stay on this course I have to change my transmission fluid more often than my engine oil. On a side note, my engine has been great on extended drains per analysis.
This might be headache that seals the deal for me to sell this truck. I already am worried about the cam synchro failures that some have experienced with this engine. Not to mention I need something bigger these days anyway.
This might be headache that seals the deal for me to sell this truck. I already am worried about the cam synchro failures that some have experienced with this engine. Not to mention I need something bigger these days anyway.
Go with the Amsoil MTF Syncromesh.
Just to report.
Have 700 miles on the Royal Purple. Fuel economy is down 10%+
Also people keep recomending fluids with no additional comment. What are these reccomendations based on? How do you know its going to work well in this application. Have you run this fluid in a Ford manual that uses ATF as a lube? Made this mistake once, not again.
Sure the royal purple makes it shift nice but I'm down on power and MPG.
I want to dump this Royal Purple but want to make the right decision since its going to cost another $30
Have 700 miles on the Royal Purple. Fuel economy is down 10%+
Also people keep recomending fluids with no additional comment. What are these reccomendations based on? How do you know its going to work well in this application. Have you run this fluid in a Ford manual that uses ATF as a lube? Made this mistake once, not again.
Sure the royal purple makes it shift nice but I'm down on power and MPG.
I want to dump this Royal Purple but want to make the right decision since its going to cost another $30
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