Roughly, in what order is oil formulated? Add pack

[ZZBottom]

Starting with plain oil basestocks, sure.
Yet how are oil add packs formulated? SN 20 or 30 oils here.
I'd guess (most steps need verification tests in the lab):
1. Put in the SN amount of ZDDP or slightly less.
2. Add VI until you get your cold/hot viscs.
3. Add detergents in the amount it worked last time, maybe more if the new standards are tougher.
4. Add silicon until foaming is reduced enough.
5. Add AW/AFriction additives until GF-5 is met and wear targets, use quick lab tests to check for films.
a. moly to meet low friction requirements
b. titanium or sodium and/or boron to reduce wear, try one at a time to check.
6. Add seal swellers like you did on the last oil you certified, maybe adjust for new requirements slightly.
7. Or skip all the above and buy an Afton or Lubrizol add package in big tanks and blend.

 

[MolaKule]

If you are a large blender, you purchase the performance Improver package (PI additive package) from a supplier.

The PI package usually contains all of the components necessary for AW, anti-oxidation, dispersant/detergent, anti-foam, etc, minus the VII.

Depending on the base oil quality and the tested base oil viscosity, the proper amount of VII is added to bring the final mix to the targeted VI.

Now specialized applications such as racing, I may make my own additive package from chemistries purchased separately.

 

[ZZBottom]

Interesting answer. Thanks for a sane answer unlike the mental stuff you just put in the Schaeffer's thread. The VII should come last because all the other ingredients affect the VI of the basestock and additives too much. Makes sense.

 

[MolaKule]

A lot of intermediate viscosity and elemental testing is done to make sure you don't undertreat or overtreat the final mix. The VII polymer is expensive so you don't want extra costs associated with overtreating.

Quote:
Thanks for a sane answer unlike the mental stuff you just put in the Schaeffer's thread.


That statement was totally unnecessary so tread lightly.

 

[ZZBottom]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
A lot of intermediate viscosity and elemental testing is done to make sure you don't undertreat or overtreat the final mix. The VII polymer is expensive so you don't want extra costs associated with overtreating.

Quote:
Thanks for a sane answer unlike the mental stuff you just put in the Schaeffer's thread.


That statement was totally unnecessary so tread lightly.


You've gone bananas in the other threads. In this one you're ordering me to tread lightly.
I'll sure obey all your orders. All of them. Any more orders? I'd better write them down. Really, bitog isn't a good place for mentally ill people like you that need help.

 

[HerrStig]

"NO good deed", "OM", eh?

 

[xtell]

From what I have learned over the years reading posts on BITOG and related white papers, a lot of the additive formulators products are used by the big oil product refiners / blendders. Companies like Lubrizol like you mentioned. I would think that both additive and oil refining / blending companies work hand in hand so the finished product is up to the oil refiners specifications. As far as MolaKule goes, I've always appreciated his input and technical knowledge on a variety of topics. He definitely knows his stuff.

Nuff said,

xtell

 

[147_Grain]

Originally Posted By: xtell
As far as MolaKule goes, I've always appreciated his input and technical knowledge on a variety of topics. He definitely knows his stuff.

+1

 

[ZZBottom]

xtell, yeah MolaKule has many good posts I've googled. I guess we can understand why some threads of his seem to go crazy since he has posted all his adult life it seems, must wear on him. He makes up for it with good info in other threads.

I guess titanium additives were the last game changers in formulation, about 6 years ago. Otherwise every oil package company slowly evolves and tweaks its oil. It would be nice to hear from anybody actually involved in the industry.

 

[MolaKule]

Quote:
It would be nice to hear from anybody actually involved in the industry.


Good luck, unless you are retired from the oil industry or an independent formulator. even if you are retired from the oil industry then you may not be able to make any detailed comments because of ND agreements, etc.

Titanium was just another AW/friction modifier.

Then the trend was toward nano-stuff.

The future trend is polymer esters, PAGs, and Ionic Liquids.

But we know the real reason you are here ZZBottom (Crawlfish) and it is not to gain knowledge.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
That statement was totally unnecessary so tread lightly.

Forgive him, Mola. Typing while wearing a sockpuppet isn't terribly easy.