RIP Lindsey Graham

[Astro14]

Please allow me to add that being in the Guard and Reserve isn’t easy - you’re holding down two jobs while you serve in the guard and reserve. Both a boss and a CO to keep happy. Training and requirements in both worlds. You give up your time and work every month. It’s a commitment that many people are unable to sustain.

Active Duty, who get weekends off, and 30 days of leave, look down on those who give up their time off to remain ready for the call.

They shouldn’t.

 

[Al]

I find this kind of characterization of service distasteful.

All of us served.

I did not serve but anyone that did in ANY capacity has MY respect. Every person wearing a past military hat always gets my thank-you out loud...period!!!!

 

[Astro14]

No one is saying someone who served in a support role "didn't serve." They absolutely did, and they deserve respect for raising their right hand and fulfilling their obligation.

The criticism isn't about whether someone served. It's about whether their public rhetoric about war is consistent with the level of personal risk and experience they had. Those are separate questions, and it's possible to respect someone's service while still questioning their judgment or views on military intervention.

I agree that level of personal risk and judgement on military matters are separate issues.

However, I was responding to the “let’s temper” post that made it seem like some service is different than others.

It isn’t.

Some are warfighters, some aren’t. But being a warfighter, or not, has no bearing on whether you served and it has no bearing on this thread, which is to recognize that a national figure has passed away.

Denigrating that figure’s service by characterizing it, is inappropriate.

 

[4wd]

I’m not even sure theories on proportionality would always go well. We put civilians in certain leadership positions for a reason

 

[PWMDMD]

I did not serve but anyone that did in ANY capacity has MY respect. Every person wearing a past military hat always gets my thank-you out loud...period!!!!

Respecting someone's military service doesn't mean every aspect of their career or every position they later take is beyond criticism. This is America. We should be able to honor someone's willingness to serve while still being free to question their decisions, judgment, or record. Respect isn't the same thing as immunity from criticism.

 

[alarmguy]

I liked him, may he RIP.

I was very proud to live in his home state for 16 years. Very proud of my state for his representation. Im quite shocked and I am darn close to his age. We suffered a great loss is my feeling. Agree or not, he was a straight shooter. His positions always clear.

 

[demarpaint]

I was very proud to live in his home state for 16 years. Very proud of my state for his representation. Im quite shocked and I am darn close to his age. We suffered a great loss is my feeling. Agree or not, he was a straight shooter. His positions always clear.

I agree! We lost a great American.

 

[DCDG]

That was a surprise. RIP senator Graham

 

[gman2304]

He was the first in his family to attend college and both his parents died while he was attending college. He adopted and raised his 13 year old sister while in college and later the military. He juggled his allegiance between his U.S.C. Gamecocks and the Clemson Tigers which didn’t raise an eyebrow among his constituents in S.C. which is an amazing feat in itself. RIP Senator Lindsey Graham!

 

[Drifter]

RIP

 

[VQ35DE]

RIP

 

[fdcg27]

Whether one agrees with all of his policy positions or not, he was a large presence in the Senate and his loss will be felt there.
RIP to Senator Graham.

 

[The_Jeff]

So, if one didn’t see anything “up close” - they didn’t serve?

I find this kind of characterization of service distasteful.

All of us served.

Exactly, you never know when things change and you get ordered off somewhere awful to do something even worse and you can't quit. I actually didn't know Mr. Graham had all that military service so I retrospectively look at him in a better light.

 

[Zee09]

Show some respect please
You have the ability to DM if you want to argue

 

[edyvw]

Don’t underestimate the risk of DVT - deep vein thrombosis - on those long flights.

That is what I was thinking.

 

[PWMDMD]

hopefully he can now prance freely through the fields of flowers with Liberace with no worries

I didn't like Graham as a person. His legacy, in my view, is one of flip-flopping and submission. That said, if the rumors about him being homosexual were true, there's something genuinely sad about feeling unable to live authentically. Whether that was due to personal choice, career ambitions, fear, or because the rumors weren't true, only he knew.

 

[dnewton3]

Folks, the real shame is that some of you clearly don't understand BITOG written rules as well as unwritten expectations.

RIP threads are meant to show respect for those who pass away. It could be a music icon, a politician, an actress, a noteworthy automotive journalist, etc ...
This isn't a debate about viscosity or a POV roundtable about ZDDP. It's a thread to recognize the passing of someone noteworthy (for any one of a plethora of reasons). If you feel compelled to "critique" a person who's passed away, take it to social media where it belongs.

Some of you need to be reminded of the age old adage ...
If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

Any more shenanigans will result in me doling out some serious consequences.
You've been warned.

 

[PWMDMD]

Folks, the real shame is that some of you clearly don't understand BITOG written rules as well as unwritten expectations.

RIP threads are meant to show respect for those who pass away. It could be a music icon, a politician, an actress, a noteworthy automotive journalist, etc ...
This isn't a debate about viscosity or a POV roundtable about ZDDP. It's a thread to recognize the passing of someone noteworthy (for any one of a plethora of reasons). If you feel compelled to "critique" a person who's passed away, take it to social media where it belongs.

Some of you need to be reminded of the age old adage ...
If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

Any more shenanigans will result in me doling out some serious consequences.
You've been warned.

Respecting someone's passing and rewriting their legacy are two different things. Saying "RIP" is one thing. Expecting everyone to suddenly speak only in praise of a public figure, especially one whose career affected millions of people, is another. Public figures leave public legacies, and those legacies are naturally discussed after they die. Civility should be expected. Mandatory admiration shouldn't be. Is this not America?

More broadly, the idea that criticism of a public official should be off-limits simply because they've died runs counter to a core American value - the freedom to openly discuss and evaluate our public figures. We can be respectful without pretending everyone deserves unanimous praise.

 

[dnewton3]

Respecting someone's passing and rewriting their legacy are two different things. Saying "RIP" is one thing. Expecting everyone to suddenly speak only in praise of a public figure, especially one whose career affected millions of people, is another. Public figures leave public legacies, and those legacies are naturally discussed after they die. Civility should be expected. Mandatory admiration shouldn't be. Is this not America?

More broadly, the idea that criticism of a public official should be off-limits simply because they've died runs counter to a core American value - the freedom to openly discuss and evaluate our public figures. We can be respectful without pretending everyone deserves unanimous praise.

Your objections are read, and noted.
But that does not change our position.
Take your criticism elsewhere.

You are not required to praise anyone here, but we don't use RIP threads to air grievances or debate the nuances of a career.
We don't allow politics for a reason, so there's no credible belief one could have that somehow it's OK to suddenly discuss once the person passes.

There have been lots of RIP threads I've simply chose to ignore because I didn't like or respect the person, but I'm adult enough to realize dancing on someone's grave is not civil conduct and will not be tolerated on BITOG.

You are free to set the record straight about any RIP person with your interpretation elsewhere, but not on this site.

 

[PWMDMD]

Your objections are read, and noted.
But that does not change our position.
Take your criticism elsewhere.

You are not required to praise anyone here, but we don't use RIP threads to air grievances or debate the nuances of a career.
We don't allow politics for a reason, so there's no credible belief one could have that somehow it's OK to suddenly discuss once the person passes.

There have been lots of RIP threads I've simply chose to ignore because I didn't like or respect the person, but I'm adult enough to realize dancing on someone's grave is not civil conduct and will not be tolerated on BITOG.

You are free to set the record straight about any RIP person with your interpretation elsewhere, but not on this site.

I think that's a slippery slope, but it's your hill to defend. I disagree with the policy, but I'll respect the rules while I'm here.