REDLINE 5W30 in 01 Integra GSR

[RC211V]

Here is my first analysis with this vehicle as well as RL being used in this application. Blackstone performed the test with Terry performing the interpretation, as part of the "Dyson Package". All previous oil used was 5W30 Honda and Valvoline conventional, before running RL.

Concerns
1. The traces of Potassium, which were at 17ppm.


Driving Habits
1. daily one way trip to work is 4-5 miles in 40-50 ambient temps.

2. A few times (3) a week, the vehicle is driven for ~.5 miles, each way, after sitting throughout the day.

3. On the weekends, vehicle is driven on the highway for 30-40 miles with sustained rpms at 5Krpm including numerous on-ramp exercises, which then see repeated redline usage.

4. The first half of this oil saw weekend hill climbs and plateau adventures where sustained rpms > 5500 rpm. This was during the summer/fall months were the roads were much less damp and the ambient temps were higher.

5. No track days on this oil, yet vehicle was on the track at ~800 miles and on two other occasions using dino.

6. Vehicle is garaged with 30-1minute 'warm-up' periods in the morning.

Oil Analysis Results

Oil Filter was Mighty (never again but didn't have the time to change it myself the last time

) and OEM air filter was used.

OIL USE INTERVAL: 5,250 Miles
MAKE-UP OIL ADDED: 0.5 qt
MI/HR ON UNIT: 14,880

Aluminum 16

Copper 19 ppm, oil additive

Iron 10

Lead 3

Moly 536 ppm

Potassium 17 ppm

Boron 12

Silicon 15 ppm oil additive

Sodium 13

Calcium 2365

Phos 1094

Zinc 1231

Viscosity at 66.3 SUS

Flashpoint 395 F

Fuel dilution < 0.5

Water is 0.0

Insolubles 0.4

TBN = 9.5


What remains to be explained is the coolant traces. Terry will get back to me on this after confirmation from the lab. The only explanation I see is contamination from the lab given the miles on the motor. The oil sample was taken when 3/4 of the oil had already been drained out. So, the sample was representing what was in the upper portion of the pan.

Also, Blackstone compared this sample with the CBR motorbike used for unit averages. I need to let them know that these are two different vehicles.

-Nader

 

[Patman]

Looks like a great report to me! Iron is low when you consider your driving habits. Lead is excellent! TBN is holding strong, this oil could go 15k I believe.

 

[vvk]

Isn't aluminum pretty high for a Honda?!

 

[jond]

quote:

---

Originally posted by vvk:
Isn't aluminum pretty high for a Honda?!

---

Yep. Redline produced 3 times more aluminum wear in my integra. I would be interested to see the results of this engine using Mobil 1. My guess is the aluminum wear will drop a lot.

 

[Bror Jace]

With a lead of only 3ppms, I can't imagine the potassium is indicative of serious coolant contamination.

All my aluminum amounts when using Red Line were in the 3-5ppm range ... and that's WITH a coolant leak.

--- Bror Jace

 

[Al]

I still wonder what the long term offect of using RedLine oil is. I am by no means slamming the oil. But the huge amount of Moly which can cause corrosion (I know the Iron is low). Also I wonder about long term sealwear and engine cleanliness. We certainly have very solid evidence that Amsoil and Mobil give long engine durability. I worry a little about my Shaeffer's Moly Pure Syn. I have some faith in Shaeffers and expecially considering the form of the moly they are using. Also it isn't in the 500 to 600 range.

Has anyone out there seen an engine with 100K + miles on it with documented engine condition. And (also forgive me ) I have some misgivings with the hype and nature of their site. But than again I have some thoughts about :Lieutenant Colonel Al Amatuzio's 25 years as an award-
winning jet fighter pilot ..bla..bla...bla.

And beleve me-I think Amsoil may be the best oil out there.

I am thinking of using it but I just can't see any reasons to go there. Also I can only try so many things at a time: Mobil 1 10w30(1 vehicle), Shaeffers Moly Pure Syn (2 vehicles), Delvac 1 (1 vehicle), Rotella T Synthetic (2 vehicles)

 

[satterfi]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al:
But the huge amount of Moly which can cause corrosion..

---

All moly compounds including MoS2 and the organic forms?

 

[Terry]

Guys I won't say too much as it is Satterfi's report but the additives in Redline show higher metals, and when first used will test unusual values. Throw the residual metals being dispersed by the oil and it looks funky. Continue using the product and aside from add package variations the metals will be fine.

If I had a 1.8L and was periodically racing it I would run Redline as a off the shelf oil option.

The mighty filter may have contributed to interupted flow to the head on start later in drain.

This engine has NO coolant contamination as of this test.

Terry

 

[Idrinkmotoroil]

run a Honda oil filter, cant think of anything better for that engine despite all the hype about other filters.

 

[mdv]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Idrinkmotoroil:
run a Honda oil filter, cant think of anything better for that engine despite all the hype about other filters.

---

Even though Fram makes them now?

 

[Idrinkmotoroil]

absolutely,on a high revving 4 cylinder there is nothing more important than oil flow, the Fram/Honda filters will at lest flow the proper oil. Filtering particles down to tiny tiny microns comes second to flow capabilities when it comes to protecting these engines. I believe Honda has designed their filters for proper flow, I've been told this by a few Honda technicians as well. Even the basic Fram filters appear to be working well in Bob's preliminary testing.

 

[RC211V]

mdv, Idrink:

Honda outsourcers the filters to two manufactures; Filtech and Honeywell(Fram). I was lucky and picked up the Filtech at the dealer for this change, which is a excellent filter. Also, I agree that flow is more of a concern with Honda's engines as opposed to filtering particles down to 10 microns. At 8K rpm, you want flow, not restrictive filtering.

As Terry mentioned, 3/4 into the drain period, I noticed my oil pressure light on for a few seconds during warm startup.

I suspect this may have contributed to the increased wear which Iam almost certain was due to the Mighty filter. Perhaps it was in bypass mode?

. Surprisingly, the light was on longer during warm startups as opposed to cold startups.

Thanks Terry for resolving the coolant traces.

 

[MolaKule]

If Redline is using the Potassium Triborate additives (as I suspect they do) then the Potassium numbers might appear slightly elevated.

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

Yep, the VOA shows approximately the same amount of potassium.
What can you say about this additive?

 

[Jay]

Your engine only had 9600 miles on it when you changed the oil so it's likely still wearing in. The aluminum and iron will come down. Nice report.

 

[rob-the-oil-nut]

Originally posted by Al:
[QB] I still wonder what the long term offect of using RedLine oil is...Has anyone out there seen an engine with 100K + miles on it with documented engine condition. And (also forgive me ) I have some misgivings with the hype and nature of their site.
Which site? RedLine's? I, uh, have heard that point before, but there's hype on just about any site that wants to sell you something. Take for instance the half-dozen spams I get offering me larger cup size by June or my money back

But *I* have a car, I've put 20,000 KM on it and did my first sample about a year ago, have done another recently, have a tick under 160,000 KM's (100,000 miles) on it, used RedLine for a year. Prior to that it had a 'breaking in oil' (at 135,000 km

So keep yer ears on!

Rob

 

[Steve S]

I used to own a Ford f 150 with a 6 cylinder engine . I sold it to a friend at 112,000 miles. I used mobil 1 5w20 then 10w30 when it came out then Amsoil and mobil 1 interchanging oils as I felt like it . Anyway my friend has been a hard core Redline oil user since he had a Vega .He sold the truck with over 300,000 miles, he did not have to add oil between 6,000filter changes and had no problem passing smog checks. Redline worked good it that application.

 

[MolaKule]

"Yep, the VOA shows approximately the same amount of potassium. What can you say about this additive? "

The "Multifunctional Additive" (i.e, performs more than one additive function) Potassium Triborate, K2B3O2, or Potassium Tetraborate, K2B4O2, is a powerful detergent and anti-wear additive, which means that Redline has three Anti-Wear additives: ZDDP, Moly, and Potassium Triborate.

This may also be the reason why residual metals are dispersed so well. Between the Potassium Triborate (Tetraborate) and the polyol esters, crud doesn't have a chance.

[ March 06, 2003, 12:17 AM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

 

[Patman]

quote:

---

Originally posted by MolaKule:
"Yep, the VOA shows approximately the same amount of potassium. What can you say about this additive? "

The "Multifunctional Additive" (i.e, performs more than one additive function) Potassium Triborate, K2B3O2, or Potassium Tetraborate, K2B4O2, is a powerful detergent and anti-wear additive, which means that Redline has three Anti-Wear additives: ZDDP, Moly, and Potassium Triborate.

This may also be the reason why residual metals are dispersed so well. Between the Potassium Triborate (Tetraborate) and the polyol esters, crud doesn't have a chance.

---

So is it safe to say that if you did an Auto-rx treatment, then switched to Redline, you'd never have a dirty engine ever again? Would the 3oz Auto-rx dose even be necessary for someone using Redline?

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

Great info, Thanks.

I thought Boron was AW too?

That makes 4 plus I know there may be at least 1 more we arent supposed to know about.