Radiators keeps leaking (multiple replacements)

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EdwardC

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A few years back, my Element's radiator started leaking, It would slightly drip and I could smell the coolant burning off.

It was replaced by a local indy with an aftermarket radiator (I was in a rush to get it done before a trip, so I didn't do it myself). About 3 months later, it started to do the same thing. It was replaced under warranty. A few months after that, I started noticing the smell again. I figured I had a bad run of parts from that vendor, and since I had more time on my hands, I bought an OEM radiator from Honda and did the installation myself. I figured I would be more careful. Fast forward a few more months, I smell the coolant again.

I have a pressure tester on the way to isolate the leak, but I can see the dried blue-green coolant along the top of the radiator, where the plastic endcaps meet the fins. Each time, the reservoir was drained dry. I believe the fluid was properly flowing out the cap when under pressure and sucking back in when cooling down. The hoses are all original as the indy said that they were in good shape when they squeezed them.

I'll keep you guys updated as I run the pressure test, but just wanted to see if you guys had any initial thoughts on what to check.

Thanks!
 
was your car ever involved in a frontal crash of any kind? If so, radiator mount maybe "off" and distort the radiator during operation, which leads to premature failure (due to flex).

Q.
 
Originally Posted By: satinsilver
Have you tried a new radiator cap?


Each of the aftermarket radiators came with new caps, plus I saved my original cap to try out. The OEM radiator came with a new cap, so I've been running that, I assumed it was good, but I don't actually have a way of testing it.


Originally Posted By: Quest
was your car ever involved in a frontal crash of any kind? If so, radiator mount maybe "off" and distort the radiator during operation, which leads to premature failure (due to flex).

Q.


Good question, there was no crash that I know of, the closest thing was when a car backed into the front on the Element, but that only squished in the bumper cover, no damage even to the bumper itself.

However, I recall that the original radiator that was removed had a slight bow, as in, it wasn't straight across the fins, as if it had been in an accident that pushed it in slightly. That sounds like it may be the culprit.

When I installed the radiator, I made sure that it set down in the rubber grommets correctly, and at the time, I didn't notice that it was tough to install, is just dropped right into the holes. I wasn't planning on it, but I think I'll pull off the entire front bumper cover and see if anything is noticeably strained.

Do you guys know of an easy way of telling where the flex could be coming from? I suppose I could look for rubbing marks.

Thanks for the replies so far!
 
Can you pressure check a new one with air before you install it ? I've got to wonder if the aftermarket one is made by the same outfit providing Hondas, and still part of a bad batch.
 
Well, this next time around, I'll probably go with another different aftermarket vendor, likely a Denso unit. I don't know if it's at all the same as the OEM or the previous 2 aftermarket radiators. If I can figure out a good way to plug up the radiator hose connections, I'll definitely pressure test it!


Also, I partially think that I would find a bad unit fairly quickly after installation, not months after, so the initial air pressure test might have passed.
 
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Leaks around the top of a radiator like that are from a leaky hose or cap.

Put a new screw clamp on the big hose and the overflow hose, tighten them with a wrench/ratchet, and make sure the cap seals.

The front-end isn't flexing, there's not a radiator manufacturing conspiracy, keep it simple.
 
Originally Posted By: JamesBond
Leaks around the top of a radiator like that are from a leaky hose or cap.

Put a new screw clamp on the big hose and the overflow hose, tighten them with a wrench/ratchet, and make sure the cap seals.

The front-end isn't flexing, there's not a radiator manufacturing conspiracy, keep it simple.

I would add-put a couple drops of blue Loctite on the threads when you put the clamps on-I seem to have a lot of trouble keeping mine from backing off unless I put the Loctite on them.
 
Are you using the original spring type clamps or aftermarket ones? Once you have a radiator that has leaked, have you had it pressure tested to confirm it was actually leaking? You could have a torn upper hose leaking past a clamp which might trick you into thinking the radiator is leaking again. Always use OEM clamps, the screw type aftermarket ones cause a pinch/pressure point which will damage hoses over time
 
I've never had a problem with worm clamps backing off, but they can require a re-tightening after a while as the squeezed hose gives up a bit.
 
I'm using the original spring clamps, as in, didn't replace them (should they be replaced?). I had heard that the spring clamp type usually better since they constantly put even pressure on the hose. I'll test it out and confirm where the leak is.
 
I had the same problem with my SARD radiator on my 86 colt.
I keep losing water from the reservoir tank. I removed the high pressure 1.3 bar cap and replaced with a standard 0.9 bar (88kpa) cap, and the problem was gone. Some aftermarket rads come with high pressure caps. These seem to put a lot of strain on the hoses. I also found my lower hose was slipping backwards, so I reapplied the silicon on the lower hose and used 2 hose clips on the lower hose. No problems thus far.
 
The actual pressure tester thing is coming tomorrow, but I turned down the regulator on the air compressor and blew some air into the overflow tube and looked for an air leak. I sprayed soapy water to try find the leak. Turns out the leak is on the top edge right where the mounting tab for the cooling fan is mounted. With my soapy rubber gloves, I could almost plug the air leak along the edge under the plastic tab. (I removed the radiator fan mount bolt to get underneath it better)

Hard to see, but the screw drive is pointing at where the leak it. Interestingly, the one crimp tab seems to have enough room to have been bent down, but it wasn't bent down.
3481r3b.jpg


I tried shaking the radiator, it doesn't feel particularly tight in any direction, so I don't know if there's obvious stress on the unit.
 
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Looks like you found your issue. Those tabs must be down to maintain the seal which is an epoxy, without the metal tab that seal will fail pretty quickly from stress.

Also when it comes to clamps USE the OEM style spring clamps you should NEVER use worm style clamps on plastic end connectors as they can warp, and stress them causing premature failure, I had a formerly trusted shop do a radiator replacement on my 94 Honda Accord and they used a cheap no name rad with a really fragile radiator cap and neck...and
worm clamps on plastic rad ends.....the job cost me 385 $. You already realize I no longer trust that shop after such shoddy work and parts were used.
 
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Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel
Also when it comes to clamps USE the OEM style spring clamps you should NEVER use worm style clamps on plastic end connectors as they can warp, and stress them causing premature failure, I had a formerly trusted shop do a radiator replacement on my 94 Honda Accord and they used a cheap no name rad with a really fragile radiator cap and neck...and
worm clamps on plastic rad ends.....the job cost me 385 $. You already realize I no longer trust that shop after such shoddy work and parts were used.


For this kind of job Trav suggested Constant Tension (or Constant Torque) clamps, which are available from Breeze and Gates. I got the Breeze and they are made in the US. The spring in them allows for some expansion and contraction without loosing grip. I will be using them for some radiator work I have coming up.
 
Is the clamp like this? http://www.amazon.com/Breeze-Constant-Torque-Stainless-Worm-Drive-Diameter/dp/B009SD07IK

I believe my issues aren't at the hose, but I figure if I'm going to be doing a replacement, I might as well replace those clamps too.



Follow up question now that I know where the failure is:

What are the chances that I get 3 radiators with a similar issue where the tab wasn't bent down and they end up leaking?

Could there still be a separate cause, I'm thinking maybe the radiator fan is vibrating or flexing causing the mounting point area to be irregularly stressed?

I wish I had done more trouble shooting with the previous 2 radiators to see if the failure was at the same point.
 
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