I agree. It's always better to change to soon than to late.
Question Concerning 10k OCI & Timing Chains
- Thread starter BISCUT
- Start date
I put several hundred thousand miles on a 1988 Toyota truck w/22RE. The timing chain did eventually go out. At least there was no interference damage...lucky. As I am sure you know, they put lots of nickel in the block yet put plastic timing chain sprockets in these trucks. 10W30 w/5k mi OCI all the way !!
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And?
The VW EA888 2.0t is well known for timing chain issues through 2011. The reason was a poor tensioner design, by 12 there was a new one. I have seen countless posts on VW forums about doing 5k oil changes because of the chain (instead of the 10k VW recommended OCI) but I have never seen one shred of evidence that shorter OCI's have anything to do with chain life. Not there or here on BITOG either.
Our 12 Tiguan (with the new tensioner design) is happily tooling along on VW 10k OCI's I see no reason to change.
Our 12 Tiguan (with the new tensioner design) is happily tooling along on VW 10k OCI's I see no reason to change.
That's kind of where I stand.
GM had a seperate issue where the Oil Life Monitor was to aggressive with some API certified Oils. This is what gave birth to Dexos.
No doubt an excessive interval (for oil and design) will lead to timing chain wear. However no amount of shortening of Interval will fix poor design or poor quality control.
I reread the thread: at 140,000 miles he replaced the tensioner belt pulley and idler pulleys, and at 260,000 the alternator. Then he ran it to 634,000 miles. Even the stuff that went kaput was belt driven stuff not the engine. Again this is with 12,000 mile oil change intervals with 0W20 starting the day the powertrain warranty ended, and now his car has 970,000 miles.
A few things I would like to comment about in this thread...
1. Subaru lowered their OCI from 7500 miles to 6000 miles a few years ago, in my opinion, due to the fact of the limitations of their OEM oil filter.
2. Mobil 1 0w40 is an excellent oil for usage in Subaru's 3.6L engine for up to 10,000 miles.
3. I agree 100% that an OCI with a direct injection engine should not be extended, in fact it would likely be better to consider reducing it down to as low as 3000 miles across the board. My Hyundai GDI has developed an issue, which others have reported elsewhere, whereby engine noise gets substantially worse as more time and miles add up every oil change interval and it has only been reduced by changing the oil specifically in my case.
4. Just because an oil product is marketed as "extended performance" or something to the effect that it is good for an extended OCI does not mean that you must or even should use it for the advertised mileage. I don't care if I am or am not getting my extra $2 out of that jug of M1 EP vs. M1 Vanilla, I buy EP because my car runs and performs better with it in the engine.
1. Subaru lowered their OCI from 7500 miles to 6000 miles a few years ago, in my opinion, due to the fact of the limitations of their OEM oil filter.
2. Mobil 1 0w40 is an excellent oil for usage in Subaru's 3.6L engine for up to 10,000 miles.
3. I agree 100% that an OCI with a direct injection engine should not be extended, in fact it would likely be better to consider reducing it down to as low as 3000 miles across the board. My Hyundai GDI has developed an issue, which others have reported elsewhere, whereby engine noise gets substantially worse as more time and miles add up every oil change interval and it has only been reduced by changing the oil specifically in my case.
4. Just because an oil product is marketed as "extended performance" or something to the effect that it is good for an extended OCI does not mean that you must or even should use it for the advertised mileage. I don't care if I am or am not getting my extra $2 out of that jug of M1 EP vs. M1 Vanilla, I buy EP because my car runs and performs better with it in the engine.
gathermewool
Site Donor 2023
Subaru very likely lowered their OCI due to continued concerns about oil consumption.
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This was my theory but that's all we we get is theories; nobody from Subaru has been transparent on this.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
I don't even recall reading of a severe service interval for the Passat.
I'm glad your VW is doing well. There have been issues with post 2012 models though, and after reading of VW silent timing chain revision in 2014 and experiencing some symptoms of timing issues we bailed on our 2014. Loved the car, but wasn't ready to put more money into it for timing issues outside of warranty.
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Curious because the 2.5L engine was having oil consumption issues in model year 2013 after they switched to using 0w20, yet they lowered the recommended OCI for the 3.6L engine as well which never experienced any such consumption issue.
Oil consumption may have played a part in that decision to lower the OCI but I think we would be remiss if we did not acknowledge that the OEM oil filter played a part as well. Form the connection that for a long time Fram never recommended using its lower level oil filters for more that what, 5000 miles? I don't consider Subaru's OEM oil filter to be any better than a Fram Extra Guard. Mind you that the Extra Guard has been improved in recent years allowing for an extension of the recommended FCI while the Subaru OEM oil filter has stayed the same.
I was considering buying a Jetta and looked into the tensioner issue. I do not believe VW has this problem solved. They are on their 4th iteration of tensioner design and problems are already beginning to surface with the latest design. I loved the way the Jetta looked and drove but I did not want any part of that timing chain.
The Subaru engines in 2013 are not the Subaru engines of 2020. The 3.6 has been discontinued. The new direct injection FB20DI engine in the Impreza, and later the Crosstrek, was only introduced three years ago, and they do not consume oil. It's a completely new engine design. The 2.5 has followed suit with direct injection very recently in the Outback I think for model year 2020. I follow the 5th generation Impreza forums and the new engines are as tight as a drum. My Toyotas specify a 5,000 mile oil change interval.
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Before I bought my 17 Outback 3.6 I came across many threads of 3.6 oil burners. Was not to the same degree or severity of the 2.5's but there was enough that I would not have bought a certain few years of these engines. I cannot recall from memory what they were so I won't just post what I think the spread to be. It was not just the 2.5 that Subaru took a bath on engine replacement it was the 3.6 as well just not in the same numerical sense.
Showing my age but frankly I'd love a GM Series II 3.8 V6 in my Subaru
I understand that is off the wall to say but I mean it. And I am not a GM fan. I did maintenance on 2 of these for my mother and grandparents in their Buick's and this engine was awesome. Good performance, so easy to work on, and with maintenance would rune for ever.Isn't the filter supposed to remove those contaminants?
gathermewool
Site Donor 2023
How much different is a Subie blue filter from a Honda blue filter? Honda allows for two OFIs, which can be well over 10k miles and closer to 15k.
1. No oil filter can remove everything
2. Oil filters become saturated with particulate matter over the duration of their usage. In my experience with a Hyundai GDI engine, that has a reputation for producing an excessive amount of carbon soot, it can effectively cut the expected usage in half or more.
I could not tell you, perhaps the Honda filter is more like a Tough Guard? It does use a silicone ADBV.
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