Propane vs Oil Boiler (NATURAL GAS NOT OPTION)

[Andrew1972]

We are in need of a new boiler likely in spring. We have a near 35 year old Well McClain with a serious fault of 2 of 4 bolts(really one) holding the burner on. No one wants to tap new ones as they afraid to break it.

NATURAL GAS is not an option in my locale, I live 1 mile unfortunately away from a natural gas pipeline from Nova Scotia.

Oil: The tank(in basement) is from 1972 and needs replacement. The chimney is unlined and requires a liner. An new oil boiler automatically means a new stainless liner as the efficiency means it burns cooler creating (corrosive) condensate easier. The liner for chimney will approach a few thousand dollars. Oil is cheap (very) currently for heating however just last year I paid near double for fuel oil.

Propane: Seems like expensive fuel compared to oil however propane has significantly better efficiency but less BTU per unit of propane vs oil. It may be a wash after applying factors? The chimney liner costs less then half of a stainless larger unit diameter pipe required for oil boiler. I have no idea on how much tank installation will cost for digging/piping etc.

Anyone have any direction on what is better? And yes I dearly miss natural gas, never will I live in a place where not available again.

 

[BigCahuna]

I know some furnaces have a vent thru the basement wall, instead of using the chimney. I would look into that. Maybe a high efficiency wood burning stove setup?.,,,,

 

[AandPDan]

I was in the same situation a few years ago. I went propane. My boiler is a direct vent unit (Munchkin). I was able to tear the old chimney down and reclaim the floor space.

Cost wise, both vary greatly in price. The "benefit" of propane is that I also use it for cooking and I have a backup generator that I can run on the same tank. There are also no fumes from the oil tank during filling.

I have a tank buried outside. No concerns as compared to having an oil tank leak and the cleanup costs (can't even bury an oil tank now due to local regs). It wasn't much more than having a new oil tank installed.

Most gas boilers also have better efficiency than an oil boiler.

My two cents.

 

[JHZR2]

Can't you do a modulating/condensing propane boiler? If so, that's how I'd go, no liners, vent through PVC. Upgrade your hot water to an indirect tank for near zero losses and substantial supply. All at mid 90% efficiency. We have had a peerless for years and it has been great.

The only thing is that you'll need to find a place to put an ugly propane tank. Fuel oil has a high flashpoint and is ok for a basement, but I'd not want propane in there (I have no clue about code). Underground is probably most desirable, but that's a big undertaking...

 

[Donald]

You can put a propane tank underground, its not a danger like a buried oil tank and it will keep the propane warm, which is important regarding vaporization rates in the winter.

For propane you can get modulating (means they can turn on the flame half way or all the way) and condensing (they suck all the heat possible out of the exhaust) and it will need only PVC pipe to an outside wall. It can also be relocated, does not need to be next to the chimney.

Hard to predict which will be less in the future per BTU, propane or heating oil.

If you have multiple zones go with multiple circulator pumps rather than zone valves.

If you go with oil, get a quality boiler (Buderus makes excellent ones) with a Riello gun. The Riello is the best and most efficient gun out there.

 

[Cujet]

Just a quick note:

91,600 BTU/gallon for propane
(up to) 140,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Propane efficiency 89 to 98%
Oil burner efficiency 80-90%

Let's assume you can purchase the most efficient "burner" of each type:

91,600 x 98 percent = 89,768 BTU/gallon for propane
140,000 x 90 percent = 126,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Put another way, propane (at best) produces 71% of the heat per gallon. Therefore, it should be 71% less expensive per gallon to make economic sense.

My local propane delivery costs me $3.99/gallon. Absurd!

 

[NormanBuntz]

I use an underground propane tank to fuel my cooktop, fireplace and generator.

Everyone so far has made some great points. One additional point: propane furnaces should require less cleaning and maintenance than an oil burner. Also, I favor the savings of not needing a new stainless steel flue.

 

[Bandito440]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Just a quick note:

91,600 BTU/gallon for propane
(up to) 140,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Propane efficiency 89 to 98%
Oil burner efficiency 80-90%

Let's assume you can purchase the most efficient "burner" of each type:

91,600 x 98 percent = 89,768 BTU/gallon for propane
140,000 x 90 percent = 126,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Put another way, propane (at best) produces 71% of the heat per gallon. Therefore, it should be 71% less expensive per gallon to make economic sense.

My local propane delivery costs me $3.99/gallon. Absurd!

I paid $1.09/gal for propane in August, and $1.39 in December. My neighbor is on an annual contract for $1.25.

The wholesale price is about $0.60/gallon at the moment. You're getting fleeced.

 

[Bandito440]

My propane furnace is much easier to maintain versus an oil-burner, and the most efficient varieties can be vented with just a small section of PVC pipe. You can disregard the chimney entirely.

I've also got a pellet stove that I run for most of the winter. Having two heating sources is handy, as I can burn whichever fuel costs less.

 

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Just a quick note:

91,600 BTU/gallon for propane
(up to) 140,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Propane efficiency 89 to 98%
Oil burner efficiency 80-90%

Let's assume you can purchase the most efficient "burner" of each type:

91,600 x 98 percent = 89,768 BTU/gallon for propane
140,000 x 90 percent = 126,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Put another way, propane (at best) produces 71% of the heat per gallon. Therefore, it should be 71% less expensive per gallon to make economic sense.

My local propane delivery costs me $3.99/gallon. Absurd!


Do you use Amerigas?

 

[Click]

You might consider a ground source heat pump if you have your own water well with a good supply of water, or a yard that can accommodate an in ground series of tubes to recirculate a fluid that can then heat AND air condition you home for alot less than propane or oil. A bit pricey on the front end but will save you tons of money in long run, paybacks are usually within 5 years.

We are in our 4th home and we've converted them all to heat pumps. Bosch (Florida heat pump) makes one of the best.

 

[SHOZ]

I have an oil forced air furnace that is about 15 years old. Three years ago I put in a small propane heater and unless it is into the single digits or lower I no longer use the oil furnace.

Propane fill last year was $0.85 gallon delivered.

 

[Virtus_Probi]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Just a quick note:

91,600 BTU/gallon for propane
(up to) 140,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Propane efficiency 89 to 98%
Oil burner efficiency 80-90%

Let's assume you can purchase the most efficient "burner" of each type:

91,600 x 98 percent = 89,768 BTU/gallon for propane
140,000 x 90 percent = 126,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Put another way, propane (at best) produces 71% of the heat per gallon. Therefore, it should be 71% less expensive per gallon to make economic sense.

My local propane delivery costs me $3.99/gallon. Absurd!


We didn't learn this until after we built our house, we were stupid enough to believe our builder when he told us oil and propane were about the same. We don't even use the propane for cooking, so oil would have been a no brainer for us.
We also had the main local propane supplier install their own tank in our backyard for "free" and we are locked in with them, so they hose us over on the per gallon rate. I told them I wanted to buy the tank from them, and they told me they will not sell it to me under any circumstances. When I told them to come dig their tank up, they cut their rates a bit, but we are still getting hosed. I am thinking about calling some of the smaller local suppliers to see if they will give us partial fillups on the sly.

I wish we could build our house all over again, we learned so much during the process but too late to be of any help to us unless we move and do it again.

 

[ecotourist]

We recently bought a house (in British Columbia) where there is no access to natural gas. Heat was by wood stove and electric baseboard heaters. We have just installed a heat pump. The heating cost is much lower than by electric baseboard heaters. I expect it's more expensive than gas but a lot less than baseboard heaters.

Our installation was fairly expensive but we had quite a complex installation (3 wall units and one ducted unit). With a furnace already installed there must be some way to convert what's there to a heat pump source.

One qualifier is you need fairly mild outdoor temperatures for a standard heat pump to work. You could always use a ground source heat pump as suggested by Click, but I assume that would be pretty expensive. One of my neighbours has one and he won't even talk about how much it cost! So if a plain vanilla air to air heat pump is an option that should be the better choice (acknowledging that ground source would have lower monthly costs).

My niece in Nova Scotia has a standard heat pump and really likes it. So it would be worth reviewing the practicality in your location.

 

[JTK]

To me it doesn't matter which fuel you use to heat your home, they're all expensive.

I'd go with a gaseous fuel simply because like you say it's easier to vent. Less chance of corrosive nastiness and less CO. Plus the gaseous fuel won't need a fuel pump, etc. Fewer moving parts to break.

 

[Shrubitup]

Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Just a quick note:

91,600 BTU/gallon for propane
(up to) 140,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Propane efficiency 89 to 98%
Oil burner efficiency 80-90%

Let's assume you can purchase the most efficient "burner" of each type:

91,600 x 98 percent = 89,768 BTU/gallon for propane
140,000 x 90 percent = 126,000 BTU/gallon for heating oil

Put another way, propane (at best) produces 71% of the heat per gallon. Therefore, it should be 71% less expensive per gallon to make economic sense.

My local propane delivery costs me $3.99/gallon. Absurd!


We didn't learn this until after we built our house, we were stupid enough to believe our builder when he told us oil and propane were about the same. We don't even use the propane for cooking, so oil would have been a no brainer for us.
We also had the main local propane supplier install their own tank in our backyard for "free" and we are locked in with them, so they hose us over on the per gallon rate. I told them I wanted to buy the tank from them, and they told me they will not sell it to me under any circumstances. When I told them to come dig their tank up, they cut their rates a bit, but we are still getting hosed. I am thinking about calling some of the smaller local suppliers to see if they will give us partial fillups on the sly.

I wish we could build our house all over again, we learned so much during the process but too late to be of any help to us unless we move and do it again.


Call your local propane competitors and purchase their tank. We bought a 120 gallon upright above-ground tank for $600 delivered and installed a few years back. Delivered propane ranges in price here between $0.99 - $1.29 per gallon.

We had a leased tank to begin with and I hated their chokehold on me so I told them to haul it away. In your case if they won't haul it away just dig it up yourself. Once you get to the valve and turn it off disconnecting it from the service line will be easy. Or possibly just abandon it and prevent them from coming back to fill it.

 

[Donald]

Also I believe efficiency is the efficiency of the boiler with the fuel running. There are some inefficiencies when its off. With a modulating gas boiler you can keep it half on and run longer.

Hard to do that with oil, but with a Riello gun it blocks the air intake if its off, so fresh air cannot flow through the gun, past the boiler cooling it off and up the flue.

 

[JHZR2]

That's why indirect water heating is optimal addition when adding mod/con boilers. No stack losses, can couple the ops with heating the home.