Contradict ? I suppose logic is not allowed in a discussion here?
"Park Outside" Recalls Are Soaring
- Thread starter billt460
- Start date
I've learned to be very careful in using words like "always" and "never".
JHZR2
Staff member
100% agree. Much better design. No garage that I’ve ever been in is free of fumes. It’s gross. I don’t want that junk diffusing into my living areas.
That said, I wouldn’t want an EV in a detached garage either. Outside, away from structures when charging.
I can understand that last part even if I don't agree with it. I don't want my charging cable out in the elements if it has to be. There's much less chance of getting water inside an outlet if it's in a garage. I've had attached garages with living space over them. While I don't recall having too many smell issues, I just didn't like the setup. It made the majority of the front of the house look like it was the garage and as we've discussed here adds another element that could make it unsafe in the event of a vehicle issue.
Depends on the charging system and the quality of the installation. I've seen plenty of commercial charging systems located outdoors and allegedgly weather resistant. And we're talking the connector just hanging there on a mount. Even the Tesla Wall Connector is rated for outdoor use.
I have looked at various 14-50 outlets and noticed that there are some that are rated for outdoor use. I think those might be the kind used for RV hookups. But even Leviton has an outdoor rated version of their 14-50 EV outlet, although I'm wondering what would be using it. I don't know of too many removable charging systems that are rated for outdoor use.
That's exactly it too, you'd want a hardwired solution like the Tesla home charger that is rated for outdoor use, which means you need the power supply to do so with a 60 amp breaker for the 48am charger. I only have a 14-30 which is capable of 24amps so that would not be an option for me. I find the 24amp charging to be more than adequate to run it dead and full charge in less than 8 hours and I had that concern when I had it installed. It's been great and now I'm glad I didn't go to the trouble of redoing the power supply to the garage and thankful they ran 240V 30A to the garage when it was originally wired.
Does nobody read the article and do the most minimum amount of research? A google search turned up the following information, all from NHTSA:
Makes and models mentioned in the article:
Lincoln - 2015-2019 Lincoln MKC underhood battery current sensor may overheat and catch fire
Jeep Cherokee - 2014-2016 Jeep Cherokee power liftgate may have a short and catch fire with the ignition on or off
Kia/Hyundai/Genesis - Multiple different models from 2010-2015 may have an internal fluid leak in the ABS unit that could cause a short and catch fire
That's an easy answer: 0%. None of them are EVs. The bulk (3.3 million) of the 3.7 million vehicles identified in the article are the Kia/Hyundai/Genesis models.
I'm sorry that your preconceived and biased notion that EVs are the cause of "park outside" recalls doesn't match the reality of the situation.
Makes and models mentioned in the article:
Lincoln - 2015-2019 Lincoln MKC underhood battery current sensor may overheat and catch fire
Jeep Cherokee - 2014-2016 Jeep Cherokee power liftgate may have a short and catch fire with the ignition on or off
Kia/Hyundai/Genesis - Multiple different models from 2010-2015 may have an internal fluid leak in the ABS unit that could cause a short and catch fire
That's an easy answer: 0%. None of them are EVs. The bulk (3.3 million) of the 3.7 million vehicles identified in the article are the Kia/Hyundai/Genesis models.
I'm sorry that your preconceived and biased notion that EVs are the cause of "park outside" recalls doesn't match the reality of the situation.
As I noted, LEviton does have an outdoor rated 14-50 receptacle meant for EV use. I don't quite get it though since I've never heard of any charging system that plugs in that's approved for outdoor use.
These are way more expensive than the $10 receptacles sold at Home Depot. I think they still fit in the same box size (don't quote me on that), but need a bigger opening for the faceplate. I think they have a similar clamping connector and a 75 in-lb torque requirement with an Allen wrench that Hubbell and Bryant receptacles use. Still not sure why they would need an outdoor version (I think the WR means "weather resistant").
For sure and that's my point. I agree. I don't think there is an EVSE that is rated for outdoor use.As I noted, LEviton does have an outdoor rated 14-50 receptacle meant for EV use. I don't quite get it though since I've never heard of any charging system that plugs in that's approved for outdoor use.
These are way more expensive than the $10 receptacles sold at Home Depot. I think they still fit in the same box size (don't quote me on that), but need a bigger opening for the faceplate. I think they have a similar clamping connector and a 75 in-lb torque requirement with an Allen wrench that Hubbell and Bryant receptacles use. Still not sure why they would need an outdoor version (I think the WR means "weather resistant").
Yes, the word Police will often call you out. You should also consider using "imo" that stops the fact Police.
This has nothing to do with, "bias". There are stories about these things spontaneously combusting in the news all but daily. This in spite of the fact they comprise about 1% of all the vehicles on the road. That's right, you read correctly, only 1%.
What Is the Percentage of Electric Cars in the U.S.? | Edmunds
More than 1 million EVs were sold for the first time last year, but what percentage of all vehicles do they make up on U.S. roads today?
www.edmunds.com
.....1% translates to 3 million new and used electric cars on U.S. roads — out of 288.5 million registered vehicles of all fuel types — as of the third quarter of 2023.
This currently translates to 1 EV for every 96 cars on the road. This in spite of the government pushing these things like there is no tomorrow. With purchase and tax incentives, future mandates, along with steep discounts from dealers in many parts of the country.
Because they sit on lots for months, and sell like used chewing gum. Not to mention when they do burn, they do so with much more ferocity, and are far more difficult for firefighters to put out.
They are also far more likely to erupt into flames when they've been flooded. Many of them doing so days, or even weeks later. Florida and Texas had this happen several times after serious storms.
So.... You have right around 1 EV for every 100 ICE powered cars in this country. And yet in spite of that, they manage to dominate the news cycle with fires and other serious issues on an all but daily basis. You can call that a lot of things, but "bias" certainly isn't one of them.
Now, try to imagine if all of this was on an equal 50/50 basis, ICE vs. EV. Then what do you think your numbers and Google searches would look like?
And I'm not even going to get into how completely worthless these things are in freezing temperatures.... Which was proven in Chicago a few weeks ago. When the news was full of people pushing and towing these contraptions, in an all but futile attempt trying to get them charged..... When they managed to find a charger that actually worked.
I can't think of a single product, that currently represents only 1% of the market, that has managed to dominate the news cycle with so many issues, problems, and consumer negativity.
They dominate the news cycle in fires by design. You’re just taking the bait. That’s the bias you claim does not exist.This has nothing to do with, "bias". There are stories about these things spontaneously combusting in the news all but daily. This in spite of the fact they comprise about 1% of all the vehicles on the road. That's right, you read correctly, only 1%.
What Is the Percentage of Electric Cars in the U.S.? | Edmunds
More than 1 million EVs were sold for the first time last year, but what percentage of all vehicles do they make up on U.S. roads today?www.edmunds.com
.....1% translates to 3 million new and used electric cars on U.S. roads — out of 288.5 million registered vehicles of all fuel types — as of the third quarter of 2023.
This currently translates to 1 EV for every 96 cars on the road. This in spite of the government pushing these things like there is no tomorrow. With purchase and tax incentives, future mandates, along with steep discounts from dealers in many parts of the country.
Because they sit on lots for months, and sell like used chewing gum. Not to mention when they do burn, they do so with much more ferocity, and are far more difficult for firefighters to put out.
They are also far more likely to erupt into flames when they've been flooded. Many of them doing so days, or even weeks later. Florida and Texas had this happen several times after serious storms.
So.... You have right around 1 EV for every 100 ICE powered cars in this country. And yet in spite of that, they manage to dominate the news cycle with fires and other serious issues on an all but daily basis. You can call that a lot of things, but "bias" certainly isn't one of them.
Now, try to imagine if all of this was on an equal 50/50 basis, ICE vs. EV. Then what do you think your numbers and Google searches would look like?
And I'm not even going to get into how completely worthless these things are in freezing temperatures.... Which was proven in Chicago a few weeks ago. When the news was full of people pushing and towing these contraptions, in an all but futile attempt trying to get them charged..... When they managed to find a charger that actually worked.
I can't think of a single product, that currently represents only 1% of the market, that has managed to dominate the news cycle with so many issues, problems, and consumer negativity.
Here we go again with the “worthless in cold conditions” nonsense. There’s no one more right on EVs than someone who hates them with a passion that bubbles up from deep within. It’s laughable and you should feel embarrassed to care so much about something you don’t want to buy. Most of this consumer negativity is from people who haven’t even driven one, let alone owned one.
That was way, way overblown. There was someone here linking an article that suggested that a higher proportion (relative to the number of vehicles) of gas-powered cars needed some sort of tow or service because of the cold weather than EVs.
In freezing temperatures they work just fine as long as there's sufficient charge. Heat comes up very quickly, heat can be turned remotely (and yeah I know some ICE cars can be started remotely) and it's perfectly fine to just drive away without needing to "warm up" anything. I've been in cold weather waiting a while for the heat to come up in a gasoline-powered car. There are efficiency reductions in cold temperatures for EVs, but that goes for gasoline-powered vehicles.
There certainly is a learning curve about keeping an EV charged and how to prepare for fast charging. However, it shouldn't be an issue with someone who charges an EV at home and can keep it charged. If I had one an didn't have a way to charge at home or work, I'd be proactive and top off often in cold temperatures.
Any kind of driving in cold weather should involve some sort of planning. I've been in cold weather with ice on the windshield.
I understood that often the people who got stuck in their EVs let the charge level go too low. That's just poor planning. Even with gasoline that would be a bad idea to let the fuel level go down too low. I know there was also a frustration with DC fast charging because batteries weren't pre-heated. It's certainly a different mindset.
Did a little digging around and there are some.
Level 2 EVSE Charging Station for Homes | EvoCharge EVSE
EvoCharge EVSE is a standard charging station for faster charge and drive convenience with no-hassle set up for home use. Explore specs, features and purchase information.
evocharge.com
- Electrical 240V outlet required and NEMA 6-50 Plug for power supply connection
- Rated for indoor and outdoor use
This company has several outdoor approved units.
I noticed yesterday that I got the car down to 19% and it even warned on the screen that I should charge soon instead of leaving it that low in the cold. I thought that was interesting. I was going to plug in anyway, but I don't recall seeing that before. I don't know if that was added after the recent stories or if it always was there. I don't think I've ever personally ran the car that low on my own.
Haven’t heard of that, but I don’t drive much in cold temps. I have heard of software updates that mean automatic battery heating in anticipation of DC fast charging and heating up the charge port. Some have complained of stuck charge ports and I think they made the heating automatic for some conditions. I heard the charge port heater has always been in the Model 3/Y but wasn’t enabled until a 2020 update that would turn it on during defrost mode. But now it should heat up when navigating to charging in cold weather.
Still, a lot of issues might arise when not using navigation. My dad hates using navigation, even when I’m driving. He might have these issues. But he charges at home and lives in a temperate area.
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The one that came with my e-tron was rated for outdoor use (the OE charger). That's how I charged the Jeep 4xe when I had it at home too, the factory charger, sitting in the snow, lol.As I noted, LEviton does have an outdoor rated 14-50 receptacle meant for EV use. I don't quite get it though since I've never heard of any charging system that plugs in that's approved for outdoor use.
These are way more expensive than the $10 receptacles sold at Home Depot. I think they still fit in the same box size (don't quote me on that), but need a bigger opening for the faceplate. I think they have a similar clamping connector and a 75 in-lb torque requirement with an Allen wrench that Hubbell and Bryant receptacles use. Still not sure why they would need an outdoor version (I think the WR means "weather resistant").
Until valid statistics are published, you are drawing your own results on what you have seen. That's hardly a valid analysis.This has nothing to do with, "bias". There are stories about these things spontaneously combusting in the news all but daily. This in spite of the fact they comprise about 1% of all the vehicles on the road. That's right, you read correctly, only 1%.
What Is the Percentage of Electric Cars in the U.S.? | Edmunds
More than 1 million EVs were sold for the first time last year, but what percentage of all vehicles do they make up on U.S. roads today?www.edmunds.com
.....1% translates to 3 million new and used electric cars on U.S. roads — out of 288.5 million registered vehicles of all fuel types — as of the third quarter of 2023.
This currently translates to 1 EV for every 96 cars on the road. This in spite of the government pushing these things like there is no tomorrow. With purchase and tax incentives, future mandates, along with steep discounts from dealers in many parts of the country.
Because they sit on lots for months, and sell like used chewing gum. Not to mention when they do burn, they do so with much more ferocity, and are far more difficult for firefighters to put out.
They are also far more likely to erupt into flames when they've been flooded. Many of them doing so days, or even weeks later. Florida and Texas had this happen several times after serious storms.
So.... You have right around 1 EV for every 100 ICE powered cars in this country. And yet in spite of that, they manage to dominate the news cycle with fires and other serious issues on an all but daily basis. You can call that a lot of things, but "bias" certainly isn't one of them.
Now, try to imagine if all of this was on an equal 50/50 basis, ICE vs. EV. Then what do you think your numbers and Google searches would look like?
And I'm not even going to get into how completely worthless these things are in freezing temperatures.... Which was proven in Chicago a few weeks ago. When the news was full of people pushing and towing these contraptions, in an all but futile attempt trying to get them charged..... When they managed to find a charger that actually worked.
I can't think of a single product, that currently represents only 1% of the market, that has managed to dominate the news cycle with so many issues, problems, and consumer negativity.
If you really want to know what's going on, you have to dig far deeper than a high level generalization.
Otherwise it's bias and opinion.
It's all "made up" as "bait" for people who hate them..... Right. That's why they sell so well in cold climates. You need to face the reality, that if people don't want something, they don't want it, period.
What their negativity is "based on" means nothing, because either way they're never going to buy one. Your made up excuses as to why are meaningless.
The fact is these things have been around for decades, and in spite of that, today represent less than 1% of the total vehicle market. This in spite of numerous purchase incentives, dealer discounts, and seemingly never ending government rebates. There is no ducking or dodging any of that. Again, it's well established fact, regardless if you want to believe it or not.
Along with the government continually pushing all they possibly can, to force them on to the buying public. That's not because people are in love with them. And I'm sorry, but none of this "embarrasses" me.
I find it all but laughable for something to be pushed so hard on a marketing public, that over the years refuses to have any interest in it. And everything they throw at the buying public to convince them, pushes them further away.
Hell, it's gotten to the point if they rose Billy Mays from the dead, he couldn't sell these things on a bet.
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