P0456 from a car without a gas cap

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My wife has a 2010 Ford Fusion with the stupid gas-capless design (which I see as more parts to fail with no real benefit). It's throwing a P0456 Small Evap Leak. Usually the gas ca is the first thing I'd look at but this car doesn't have one. I found a TSB about using the fuel fill funnel to clear debris from the cap-less seal. I did that procedure, and cleared the codes. It hasn't set a CEL yet but I do see a code pending with my ELM327 and OBD app. I'm hoping to be able to figure something out without needing to go to a shop. I don't have access to a smoke tester. I have Torque Lite and would upgrade to the full version if I could figure out how to use the Lite version and knew it would help. But right now it's just a confusing app I I can sometime read engine codes with (when I remember how to navigate to that part of the app). Does anybody have any suggestions? I see the solenoid valve in the engine compartment is a pretty frequent problem, and it's only $20 or so. I don't like replacing parts just for the heck of it, however. I'm thinking I should be able to put +12v onto that valve from wires aligator clipped to the battery and to ground, and then try to blow through the thing. I should be able to move air through it with no current, but not with +12v - correct? If this thing passes the test, where would you look next? Thanks everyone!
 

Smcatub

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Originally Posted By: eljefino
How many miles? Could it still be under an emissions warranty?
56k. I checked the emissions warranty - it's 3/36k for the evap stuff as far as I was able to tell. The catalyst and other componbents is longer, but the evap is expired
 
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That VCV is a problem on a lot of makes. It can hang up partially open and not provide the full vacuum reading in the tank and hoses the computer is looking for. There is usually another VSV located next to the charcoal canister, near the tank, the underhood valve is just for running a test cycle. There's a lot of "stuff" in that system, and NONE of it is needed in a non- emission state like Florida. Testing the valve is a good idea but you need to read the shop manual to see if + 12 is going to open it or close it.
 
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Replace the filler neck, Ford basic number 9034. Before the capless system we replaced them on 90s Rangers and E-vans, now we replace them on everything. Ford was trying to find a solution to a problem that did not exist with this system.
 
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Originally Posted By: eljefino
How many miles? Could it still be under an emissions warranty?
Catalyst, ECU and associated diagnostic computers required for OBD scanning are covered for a minimum of 8 years, 80K miles. Everything else is covered for a minimum of 2 years, 24K miles but most cover it for 3+ years and 36K. Seems you're just outside the warranty period. Bummer. =(
 
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Gas-capless design???? WTH?? That's just @#$%! nuts. Manufacturers really do want to transform their products into 4-wheel CEL's..... Evidently they think this is a 'feature' for owners too stupid to deal with a gas-cap. And the hits just keep on coming.....
 
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Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Gas-capless design???? WTH?? That's just @#$%! nuts. Manufacturers really do want to transform their products into 4-wheel CEL's..... Evidently they think this is a 'feature' for owners too stupid to deal with a gas-cap. And the hits just keep on coming.....
1 CEL that hasn't come back to the OP, somehow morphed into an internet diagnosis that he needs to replace a whole bunch of parts. You're only saying this because that is what you are used to, classic luddite thinking. There really is no point to a gas cap if you had a cap-less option from the get go. I'm sure you had company when hand cranks gave way to electric starters.
 
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Smcatub

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Originally Posted By: raytseng
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Gas-capless design???? WTH?? That's just @#$%! nuts. Manufacturers really do want to transform their products into 4-wheel CEL's..... Evidently they think this is a 'feature' for owners too stupid to deal with a gas-cap. And the hits just keep on coming.....
1 CEL that hasn't come back to the OP, somehow morphed into an internet diagnosis that he needs to replace a whole bunch of parts. You're only saying this because that is what you are used to, classic luddite thinking. There really is no point to a gas cap if you had a cap-less option from the get go. I'm sure you had company when hand cranks gave way to electric starters.
I kind of agree with the guy. I'm not scared of technology or change, but I just don't get why Ford did this. The part is about $300 (filler neck and valve) vs. $85 for the old design. And it seems to accomplish . . . Well, nothing really. It saves maybe 8 seconds every ten days when you fill up. I'd rather have the car priced $215 less, and have fewer parts to go bad. Seems like a Win-Win to me. But yeah, the CEL isn't necessarily related to the filler cap. Could be a lot of EVAP parts. Valves, hoses, pressure sensors, charcoal canisters (why does a box of coal cost $200?!?!) . . . The EVAP system is a real mess for a DIYer who doesn't have the education or the experience of working with it on a regular basis, and who doesn't have a good scan tool to run tests with.
 
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Originally Posted By: raytseng
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Gas-capless design???? WTH?? That's just @#$%! nuts. Manufacturers really do want to transform their products into 4-wheel CEL's..... Evidently they think this is a 'feature' for owners too stupid to deal with a gas-cap. And the hits just keep on coming.....
1 CEL that hasn't come back to the OP, somehow morphed into an internet diagnosis that he needs to replace a whole bunch of parts. You're only saying this because that is what you are used to, classic luddite thinking. There really is no point to a gas cap if you had a cap-less option from the get go. I'm sure you had company when hand cranks gave way to electric starters.
Given the dismissive, condescending tone of your reply + your location, expect to be replied to likewise. First, the code was cleared, but OP noted one is pending. Second, I'm a degreed engineer, not a luddite. As such, I'm smart enough to realize that tech for tech's sake is stupid, often needlessly complicated and usually expensive. If it's simple, inexpensive and works, why complicate it with technology? Third, your example of hand cranks is a very poor example to prove your (mis-guided) point. They were replaced because they broke too many arms, among others. Lastly, you've exposed yourself as a infantile, immature 'dude' from a state known flooded with such, who trolls boards, taking cheap, drive-by shots, not at all pertinent to the topic at hand. I agree with the OP. His reply above to you shows he agrees with me as well. So why are you here?
 
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Originally Posted By: Smcatub
But yeah, the CEL isn't necessarily related to the filler cap. Could be a lot of EVAP parts. Valves, hoses, pressure sensors, charcoal canisters (why does a box of coal cost $200?!?!) . . . The EVAP system is a real mess for a DIYer who doesn't have the education or the experience of working with it on a regular basis, and who doesn't have a good scan tool to run tests with.
Thank you and yes, I too agree. The evap system is often a royal PITA to deal with and needlessly complicated...not to mention expensive to diagnose and fix. Thanks to an overzealous epa who wants their nose up everyone's tailpipe.
 

Smcatub

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So I think I've got it figured out. I took off the purge valve and blew through it. I got a bit of air through, but not so much that I would assume it's open. I think it's closed normally and open when it gets current. I couldn't test because the pins on the connector are so close I couldn't get alligator clips on without them touching. But, a guy on YouTube did a video on replacing it. He got no air through his new part, so I'm pretty sure it's normally closed and mine isn't sealing. $25 shipped via Amazon Prime and I'll have it in a few days. Hopefully that will be the end of the P0456.
 
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