Some people are not MMO fans, let alone fans of any additive. I have used it at the end of an OCI and as a flush with good results in freeing up sticky lifters.
Only 2000 Miles. Why oil so dark? Pics attached.
- Thread starter Thomas34
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But might I add I used it with cheaper conventional oil to flush.
Always remember that whatever additive you add to the crankcase will be competing with the oil for protection of the metal surface. It could be that adding a solvent such as cyclic hydrocarbons and other substituted hydrocarbons which constitute a major component of MMO according to the MSDS cause more harm than good but leave you with just the IMPRESSION that you are doing something beneficial for your engine when in fact you are NOT.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
Originally Posted By: djlinux64
Always remember that whatever additive you add to the crankcase will be competing with the oil for protection of the metal surface. It could be that adding a solvent such as cyclic hydrocarbons and other substituted hydrocarbons which constitute a major component of MMO according to the MSDS cause more harm than good but leave you with just the IMPRESSION that you are doing something beneficial for your engine when in fact you are NOT.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
then under what circumstances will MMO be beneficial in the crank case? i assume that you dont use MMO. hmm maybe i should get an oil change soon.
Always remember that whatever additive you add to the crankcase will be competing with the oil for protection of the metal surface. It could be that adding a solvent such as cyclic hydrocarbons and other substituted hydrocarbons which constitute a major component of MMO according to the MSDS cause more harm than good but leave you with just the IMPRESSION that you are doing something beneficial for your engine when in fact you are NOT.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
then under what circumstances will MMO be beneficial in the crank case? i assume that you dont use MMO. hmm maybe i should get an oil change soon.
3000 mile oil change intervals are your ticket. With cheap non-synthetic oil, you will minimize cost and get the results you desire.
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak
But that's redline race oil...
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak
But that's redline race oil...Mine is way blacker than this after only 1,000 mi.
Originally Posted By: Thomas34
Originally Posted By: djlinux64
Always remember that whatever additive you add to the crankcase will be competing with the oil for protection of the metal surface. It could be that adding a solvent such as cyclic hydrocarbons and other substituted hydrocarbons which constitute a major component of MMO according to the MSDS cause more harm than good but leave you with just the IMPRESSION that you are doing something beneficial for your engine when in fact you are NOT.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
then under what circumstances will MMO be beneficial in the crank case? i assume that you dont use MMO. hmm maybe i should get an oil change soon.
Here's a thought, if you are concerned with elevated wear levels with the addition of MMO in the oil visit the used oil analysis section. There are a few reports where MMO was used and the reports were quite good. Only negative is MMO might lower the TBN slightly. So if you plan on running extended drains then add MMO toward the end of the OCI. If you follow the OM for the OCI then MMO should pose no problems.
Back on topic, the oil looks fine for 2000 miles, as I mentioned before.
Originally Posted By: djlinux64
Always remember that whatever additive you add to the crankcase will be competing with the oil for protection of the metal surface. It could be that adding a solvent such as cyclic hydrocarbons and other substituted hydrocarbons which constitute a major component of MMO according to the MSDS cause more harm than good but leave you with just the IMPRESSION that you are doing something beneficial for your engine when in fact you are NOT.
I highly suggest you at least read through and understand what the abstract of this study is about:
A.K. Misra, A.K. Mehrotra, R.D. Srivastava, Antiwear characteristics of additives: Synergistic and adverse effects, Wear, Volume 31, Issue 2, February 1975, Pages 345-357, ISSN 0043-1648, DOI: 10.1016/0043-1648(75)90168-4.
(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6V5B-47YXX61-GS/2/b1d6207040f9e8429c3b96c48ce8ba1a)
To summarize, chemicals such as those used in MMO will dissolve ZDDP (the major anti-wear component in oil, brutha!) and prevent it from binding to metal and preventing wear. Therefore, while your engine may be squeaky clean there will be elevated levels of wear and damage. How is that for irony?
I suggest you stop what you are doing and never use after market motor oil additives. Find a motor oil that is properly formulated for your needs and in the proper weight and stick with it as long as it works for you. I personally recommend a heavy duty engine oil such as Shell Rotella due to excellent TBN, detergency, and level of dispersants.
then under what circumstances will MMO be beneficial in the crank case? i assume that you dont use MMO. hmm maybe i should get an oil change soon.
Here's a thought, if you are concerned with elevated wear levels with the addition of MMO in the oil visit the used oil analysis section. There are a few reports where MMO was used and the reports were quite good. Only negative is MMO might lower the TBN slightly. So if you plan on running extended drains then add MMO toward the end of the OCI. If you follow the OM for the OCI then MMO should pose no problems.
Back on topic, the oil looks fine for 2000 miles, as I mentioned before.
Originally Posted By: djlinux64
3000 mile oil change intervals are your ticket. With cheap non-synthetic oil, you will minimize cost and get the results you desire.
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak But that's redline race oil...
i have seen how black oil can get on a diesel. our family used to have a 1975 Mercedes 240D 4 speed manual a long time ago. i just have never had the oil become so dark at 2000 miles.
3000 mile oil change intervals are your ticket. With cheap non-synthetic oil, you will minimize cost and get the results you desire.
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak
But that's redline race oil...i have seen how black oil can get on a diesel. our family used to have a 1975 Mercedes 240D 4 speed manual a long time ago. i just have never had the oil become so dark at 2000 miles.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: djlinux64
3000 mile oil change intervals are your ticket. With cheap non-synthetic oil, you will minimize cost and get the results you desire.
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak But that's redline race oil...
Subject: Oil Color does not matter.
so let me get this straight. for the most part of the life of my Honda CRV, it has been changed with conventional oil. It has only been changed with synthetic for the last 3 oil changes.
During the times when I used conventional oil...I dont recall my oil to be this dark at 2000 miles. I dont check my dipstick everyday but i do check it often.
This leads me to this current fill of Mobil 1 Extended Performance with MMO. Most of you are saying that "oil color does not matter"
If oil color does not matter, then why is my use of synthetic with MMO at 2000 miles causing my oil to get darker much sooner than conventional oil use at 2000 miles? Does synthetic do a better job of cleaning?
3000 mile oil change intervals are your ticket. With cheap non-synthetic oil, you will minimize cost and get the results you desire.
Remember that often times your oil will turn dark quickly because it does a very good job at capturing soot and preventing it from binding with the metal or otherwise leading to undesired consequences in your engine. Dark oil is good! It can literally be PITCH BLACK and still serviceable.
I am willing to bet you never saw the oil that comes out of a diesel engine? You should see it one day. You will regain your faith instantly.
You should see the oil my friend has in his engine... Dark blue straight out of the bottle! 'Pre-tinted' from the factory so to speak
But that's redline race oil...Subject: Oil Color does not matter.
so let me get this straight. for the most part of the life of my Honda CRV, it has been changed with conventional oil. It has only been changed with synthetic for the last 3 oil changes.
During the times when I used conventional oil...I dont recall my oil to be this dark at 2000 miles. I dont check my dipstick everyday but i do check it often.
This leads me to this current fill of Mobil 1 Extended Performance with MMO. Most of you are saying that "oil color does not matter"
If oil color does not matter, then why is my use of synthetic with MMO at 2000 miles causing my oil to get darker much sooner than conventional oil use at 2000 miles? Does synthetic do a better job of cleaning?
Originally Posted By: Thomas34
Most of you are saying that "oil color does not matter"
If oil color does not matter, then why is my use of synthetic with MMO at 2000 miles causing my oil to get darker much sooner than conventional oil use at 2000 miles? Does synthetic do a better job of cleaning?
Ok.. REPEAT.. Oil color does NOT MATTER..
Since OIL COLOR does NOT MATTER the 2nd part above DOES NOT MATTER.
And all oils have detergents to clean. No oil is going to clean that much better in a normal engine (and your engine is VERY normal and EASY on ANY oil) so again....
Oil color does NOT MATTER!
I've got a idea.. Since you are not believing us, you should do the following...
Change the oil. (use any oil)
Check it after every drive. Once the color becomes to a point where you feel its "bad" change the oil.
If that happens at 500 miles or 5000 miles, you'll be covered.
That makes as much sense as worrying about oil color @ 2000 miles.
Sorry but...
Most of you are saying that "oil color does not matter"
If oil color does not matter, then why is my use of synthetic with MMO at 2000 miles causing my oil to get darker much sooner than conventional oil use at 2000 miles? Does synthetic do a better job of cleaning?
Ok.. REPEAT.. Oil color does NOT MATTER..
Since OIL COLOR does NOT MATTER the 2nd part above DOES NOT MATTER.
And all oils have detergents to clean. No oil is going to clean that much better in a normal engine (and your engine is VERY normal and EASY on ANY oil) so again....
Oil color does NOT MATTER!
I've got a idea.. Since you are not believing us, you should do the following...
Change the oil. (use any oil)
Check it after every drive. Once the color becomes to a point where you feel its "bad" change the oil.
That makes as much sense as worrying about oil color @ 2000 miles.
Sorry but...
Originally Posted By: Thomas34
So considering this is Mobil 1 Extended Performance and im NOT gonna get a used oil analysis on this current fill...the only things I can go by is
Time
Mileage
Color of Oil
Highway Miles or Stop and Go Miles
You can scratch "Color of Oil".
Without sophisticated testing it's impossible to tell just what it is in the oil that produces a particular color. If you use high quality oil filters and don't have something else going on such as a mechanical problem, you can generally assume that whatever is in solution or suspension is not wearing the engine.
Just remember, whatever is in the oil when you drain it is not in your engine, and that's good.
So considering this is Mobil 1 Extended Performance and im NOT gonna get a used oil analysis on this current fill...the only things I can go by is
Time
Mileage
Color of Oil
Highway Miles or Stop and Go Miles
You can scratch "Color of Oil".
Without sophisticated testing it's impossible to tell just what it is in the oil that produces a particular color. If you use high quality oil filters and don't have something else going on such as a mechanical problem, you can generally assume that whatever is in solution or suspension is not wearing the engine.
Just remember, whatever is in the oil when you drain it is not in your engine, and that's good.
IMMHO oil colar to some extent does matter. If your oil turns black in a short time that tells me your engine may have a lot of sludge and it's darkening the oil quickly. As I use Mobil 1 oil I haven't personlly experienced this sludge problem in many years.
Oil color does matter....alot. Take a old dirty motor and run it on Redline oil- the first few runs will turn the oil black rather quickly, and after all this cleaning, the future fills will remain light in color much longer.......obviously the color means something- it is showing you the cleaning being done and the dirt it is holding in suspension in the first few fills compared to later fills where the oil remains clean.
they mean that oil can look black as night and still have TBN remaining under UOA. but it could also have a little or a lot of wear metals suspended, as well as insolubles (soot, small bits of ground up carbon, etc). this usually occurs in that twilight zone of 5,000 - 10,000 miles on the oil.
the game at bitog is to stretch it out as long as possible before the TBN decreases, TAN increases, and hopefully other bad stuff doesn't increase. all of this can be remedied by an oil change, but on the other side of the issue, many people do change their oil too soon, when it could still go thousands of miles futher.
the game at bitog is to stretch it out as long as possible before the TBN decreases, TAN increases, and hopefully other bad stuff doesn't increase. all of this can be remedied by an oil change, but on the other side of the issue, many people do change their oil too soon, when it could still go thousands of miles futher.
and that's what i usually do
In my experience, that's typical for Mobil 1. It just tends to darken faster for some reason than other oil. Should be fine.
Originally Posted By: qship1996
Oil color does matter....alot. Take a old dirty motor and run it on Redline oil- the first few runs will turn the oil black rather quickly, and after all this cleaning, the future fills will remain light in color much longer.......obviously the color means something- it is showing you the cleaning being done and the dirt it is holding in suspension in the first few fills compared to later fills where the oil remains clean.
You cannot tell for certain that the dark color is showing the cleaning being done unless and until you analyze the oil.
You can surmise that it is, but that is simply a good guess or an estimate without actual testing.
Oil color does matter....alot. Take a old dirty motor and run it on Redline oil- the first few runs will turn the oil black rather quickly, and after all this cleaning, the future fills will remain light in color much longer.......obviously the color means something- it is showing you the cleaning being done and the dirt it is holding in suspension in the first few fills compared to later fills where the oil remains clean.
You cannot tell for certain that the dark color is showing the cleaning being done unless and until you analyze the oil.
You can surmise that it is, but that is simply a good guess or an estimate without actual testing.
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