OLM / MMS; works with synthetic oils?

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I really like this website for so many reasons, one of which is there is so much information that can be had if one is willing to work hard. Question I was thinking about was since the OLM / MMS system tell you when to change your oil based on your driving habits and consequently how your driving style impacts your cars temperatures as well how many engine revolutions. This system is inherently better then doing it by straight miles and is more accurate on newer cars then simply feeling the oil. For example, you get stuck in stop and go traffic, very little miles accumulate but your car is idling, temps are rising etc but your miles dont go up. you still change your oil incorrectly by doing it by miles and not how our car is run. Another is city versus highway where obviously less wear and tear on highway over city yet you change the oil at the asme interval incorrectly. But how does it impact your oil decision particularly if your car was speced from factory with dino oil and you use synthetic. I am willing to guess that most if not all people who use full synthetic knowing #1 reason is extended drains disregard the MMS/OLM system. Even still I have seen other who simply use semi-synthetics change their oils at 40%, 50%, 30% etc they want to based on their "gut feelings , previous knowledge, UOAs etc. and not the MMS. This is a sad but true reality. I have used nothing but dino and dino blends (semi-syns) since I got the car and I am at just over 25 grand in miles on the ODO on a 2006 V6 Cord and the MMS has worked flawlessly. I remember when I went from Mobil dino to Mobil dino blend, I got about 500 more miles then the dino with the same driving. The MMS gave me 500 more miles on the semi-syn based on how I drove and how the oil performed and it was spot on and a 2nd OCI of the same syn blend oil with another +500 miles over the dino. I have now switched to another dino blend called Motorcraft which btw, has worked phenemonally (better perf + full dip stick so far) for my 4th oil change on this car and with 50% MMS I am about 400 miles short of 4 thousand miles on this OCI so I feel I am on track for about a 5K OCI when I swap out at 15% usefull oil life left on the OLM / MMS. Ironically this is spot on once again and this time it is spot on based directly on a UOA that another owner did with the same car, engine. The funny thing was based on his driving sytle of lots of highway miles and conventional driving, the UOA recommended 6k but with my driving style which is more city and more spirtied, it was 5k that was the recommendation. This is exactly what the MMS is shaping out to be for this interval I am on right now! Now I am going to get to my actual question. Since I have never used a full synthetic in this car and since full synthetic intervals recommended range go anywhere from 10k to even 30k, how would the OLM/MMS work with this. Well, we know it doesn't change based on purely on the oil but rather how you use the oil based on your driving, I am sure you are not going to get extended drain intervals of 10+ and I would say that synthetics and the OLM / MMS are not compatible with each other if you go by the MMS. It works well with dino and dino blends (semi-synthetics)but 10k + interval with synthetics?? nahh, I don't think so. I know this may not be as big of a deal for a PP that you may have gotten BOGOF esp. at some of the insane prices some markets are getting but if you use a boutique oil and follow the MMS, you will waste perfectly good oil because there is no way your interval will be the extended one that your OLM/MMS will tell you. Bottom line is: Ignore MMS/OLM if you use synthetics is all I can say. Does this mean you will never use synthetic oil if you adhere to your OLM /MMS? Perhaps not but I think you have to choose on or the other if you do not want to cheat your OLM/MMS and that is a huge price to pay if you use synthetics. IF I ever pay 4/qt for oil or more, that would be the day I stopped relying on the OLM / MMS and push for the higher drain intervals that synthetics are primarily used for and that would be a sad day, indeed. All I can say right now is the OLM / MMS on my V6 Honda works perfectly with regular dino and dino blend aka semi-syn aka syn blends but I do not think it would not work at all with full synthetics extended drain interval which for me would equate to never considering boutique oils and their 10k plus intervals! yay, so there is some silver lining here. Saves me money. I think my money and MMS are going to go with semi-synthetics because even with BOGOF of PP, it's still 4 bucks a quart and thats still too much when you consider it will cost you labor (12 bucks roughly at GY-Gemini here) to get new oil in if you bring your oil + filter. Factor in 4 bucks a quart x 5 and you got 20 bucks + say 7 dollar OEM filter + the labor and you got 40 bucks spent on an oil change. The money you save is directly related to what oil you choose so why would you shoot yourself in the foot for miniscule improivements? There are great blends out there with similar performance if not equal performance. Ofcourse, protection in some very specific engines depends on how you drive and your driving sytle in relation to your oil but like many have said, noone will actually use what their full synthetic oils can provide. I think the OLM / MMS is a threat to synthetics and boutique oils for the average joe and even for this BITOG reader. I might be able to make an exception if I can get PP for some of the ridiculous prices others get here but I know I won't and the best I could do is like 4 bucks a quart. Why bother with this pricing headache when MC and others are just an arms reach away at your local Wal Mart store for like what 10 bucks and change! MAkes even 4 dollar PP and 6 dolar M1 nothing but a dinosaur, a thing of the past! (Now who can get me PP for 2 bucks a quart!!)
 
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I remember when I went from Mobil dino to Mobil dino blend, I got about 500 more miles then the dino with the same driving. The MMS gave me 500 more miles on the semi-syn based on how I drove and how the oil performed and it was spot on and a 2nd OCI of the same syn blend oil with another +500 miles over the dino. …….how would the OLM/MMS work with this.
The OLM doesn’t actually test the oil, it’s just some algorithm based on miles, temperature, rpm … etc. … (or some variation of that). So it has no way of knowing whether synthetic or conventional oil is being used. It also just assumes some baseline minimum oil quality like SL or SM. Better oils can/may/will yield better results, but the current crop of Group II SM/GF4 conventional oils are so good out to 5000 miles or more (possibly a lot more) in most applications, there isn’t really much advantage to using synthetics. Synthetics still have value in extreme situations of cold/hot, and for some that may want to extend their OCI somewhat. If I was running a car with a turbo in 100F+ weather in LasVegas, or towing a heavy load, I would certainly seriously consider synthetics. Synthetics can provide an extra measure of thermal oxidation life. I think your current regimen of good quality conventional and synthetic-blend oils is more than adequate to get very good service life from your engine.
 
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Quote:
I really like this website for so many reasons, one of which is there is so much information that can be had if one is willing to work hard. Question I was thinking about was since the OLM / MMS system tell you when to change your oil based on your driving habits and consequently how your driving style impacts your cars temperatures as well how many engine revolutions. This system is inherently better then doing it by straight miles and is more accurate on newer cars then simply feeling the oil. For example, you get stuck in stop and go traffic, very little miles accumulate but your car is idling, temps are rising etc but your miles dont go up. you still change your oil incorrectly by doing it by miles and not how our car is run. Another is city versus highway where obviously less wear and tear on highway over city yet you change the oil at the asme interval incorrectly. But how does it impact your oil decision particularly if your car was speced from factory with dino oil and you use synthetic. I am willing to guess that most if not all people who use full synthetic knowing #1 reason is extended drains disregard the MMS/OLM system. Even still I have seen other who simply use semi-synthetics change their oils at 40%, 50%, 30% etc they want to based on their "gut feelings , previous knowledge, UOAs etc. and not the MMS. This is a sad but true reality. I have used nothing but dino and dino blends (semi-syns) since I got the car and I am at just over 25 grand in miles on the ODO on a 2006 V6 Cord and the MMS has worked flawlessly. I remember when I went from Mobil dino to Mobil dino blend, I got about 500 more miles then the dino with the same driving. The MMS gave me 500 more miles on the semi-syn based on how I drove and how the oil performed and it was spot on and a 2nd OCI of the same syn blend oil with another +500 miles over the dino. I have now switched to another dino blend called Motorcraft which btw, has worked phenemonally (better perf + full dip stick so far) for my 4th oil change on this car and with 50% MMS I am about 400 miles short of 4 thousand miles on this OCI so I feel I am on track for about a 5K OCI when I swap out at 15% usefull oil life left on the OLM / MMS. Ironically this is spot on once again and this time it is spot on based directly on a UOA that another owner did with the same car, engine. The funny thing was based on his driving sytle of lots of highway miles and conventional driving, the UOA recommended 6k but with my driving style which is more city and more spirtied, it was 5k that was the recommendation. This is exactly what the MMS is shaping out to be for this interval I am on right now! Now I am going to get to my actual question. Since I have never used a full synthetic in this car and since full synthetic intervals recommended range go anywhere from 10k to even 30k, how would the OLM/MMS work with this. Well, we know it doesn't change based on purely on the oil but rather how you use the oil based on your driving, I am sure you are not going to get extended drain intervals of 10+ and I would say that synthetics and the OLM / MMS are not compatible with each other if you go by the MMS. It works well with dino and dino blends (semi-synthetics)but 10k + interval with synthetics?? nahh, I don't think so. I know this may not be as big of a deal for a PP that you may have gotten BOGOF esp. at some of the insane prices some markets are getting but if you use a boutique oil and follow the MMS, you will waste perfectly good oil because there is no way your interval will be the extended one that your OLM/MMS will tell you. Bottom line is: Ignore MMS/OLM if you use synthetics is all I can say. Does this mean you will never use synthetic oil if you adhere to your OLM /MMS? Perhaps not but I think you have to choose on or the other if you do not want to cheat your OLM/MMS and that is a huge price to pay if you use synthetics. IF I ever pay 4/qt for oil or more, that would be the day I stopped relying on the OLM / MMS and push for the higher drain intervals that synthetics are primarily used for and that would be a sad day, indeed. All I can say right now is the OLM / MMS on my V6 Honda works perfectly with regular dino and dino blend aka semi-syn aka syn blends but I do not think it would not work at all with full synthetics extended drain interval which for me would equate to never considering boutique oils and their 10k plus intervals! yay, so there is some silver lining here. Saves me money. I think my money and MMS are going to go with semi-synthetics because even with BOGOF of PP, it's still 4 bucks a quart and thats still too much when you consider it will cost you labor (12 bucks roughly at GY-Gemini here) to get new oil in if you bring your oil + filter. Factor in 4 bucks a quart x 5 and you got 20 bucks + say 7 dollar OEM filter + the labor and you got 40 bucks spent on an oil change. The money you save is directly related to what oil you choose so why would you shoot yourself in the foot for miniscule improivements? There are great blends out there with similar performance if not equal performance. Ofcourse, protection in some very specific engines depends on how you drive and your driving sytle in relation to your oil but like many have said, noone will actually use what their full synthetic oils can provide. I think the OLM / MMS is a threat to synthetics and boutique oils for the average joe and even for this BITOG reader. I might be able to make an exception if I can get PP for some of the ridiculous prices others get here but I know I won't and the best I could do is like 4 bucks a quart. Why bother with this pricing headache when MC and others are just an arms reach away at your local Wal Mart store for like what 10 bucks and change! MAkes even 4 dollar PP and 6 dolar M1 nothing but a dinosaur, a thing of the past! (Now who can get me PP for 2 bucks a quart!!)
OK.
 
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Quoting an entire long posting just to add "OK" isn't very good form. That said, the OLM doesn't know what oil you are using and I doubt that the difference in change intervals noted between a "conventional" and a "synthetic blend" had anything to do with the oils used. Personally I'm running whatever name brand synthetic I've most recently gotten a good price on (Pennzoil Platinum right now) in my Acura for safety margin and am simply changing when the monitor says to, which is when it calculates 15% remaining life. This is probably overkill, but it costs me very little to do an oil and filter change and I like having good records in case of any warranty problems. Some vehicles end up with design marginalities leading to sludge, oil leaks and the like. My view is that using very high quality oils gives me a little extra margin against such problems at a very low cost. Considering what depreciation, insurance and fuel costs are; the cost of my DIY oil changes is minimal.
 

06VtecV6

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That said, the OLM doesn't know what oil you are using and I doubt that the difference in change intervals noted between a "conventional" and a "synthetic blend" had anything to do with the oils used. Personally I'm running whatever name brand synthetic I've most recently gotten a good price on (Pennzoil Platinum right now) in my Acura for safety margin and am simply changing when the monitor says to, which is when it calculates 15% remaining life. This is probably overkill, but it costs me very little to do an oil and filter change and I like having good records in case of any warranty problems. Some vehicles end up with design marginalities leading to sludge, oil leaks and the like. My view is that using very high quality oils gives me a little extra margin against such problems at a very low cost. Considering what depreciation, insurance and fuel costs are; the cost of my DIY oil changes is minimal.
I disagree that the longer OCI was not related to the oil. When you start off with more stronger and better additives, ofcourse your car is going to run better and thus your MMS will see that your oil's temp has decreased and/or increased and adjust your OCI based on that and thus the OLM/MMS will reward you with a longer OCI assuming most environmental variables remained constant. You should've seen how efficient the J30A5 was when I first put in the MC. I was doing a lot of highway miles and the thing, I swear, had be on track for a 10k OCI! Yes, the MMS works like it's supposed to despite not actually guages the oil itself. Well you have to break-in your car the best you can and cannot settle for just whatever is cheapest. Yeah that's what I liked about the DC 75k.. it supposedly guaranteed clean oil until 7500 miles but my OCI were only about 5500 at the most so I was covered safely from just about everything until I actually dropped the oil.
 
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I would think if the OLM is set up for conventional oil, then if you run synthetic, you should be able to go about 50% farther than the OLM says. Just a rough guess though.
 

06VtecV6

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I would think if the OLM is set up for conventional oil, then if you run synthetic, you should be able to go about 50% farther than the OLM says. Just a rough guess though.
How does it do it without any sensors touching the oil? How does the OCIs get extended if the OLM/MMS does not know the oil is dino, blend or synthetic?
 
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There used to be a very detailed explanantion from one of GM's engineers that designed the OLM. It's apparently gone from the archives. His explanation based on what I remember is that the systems measures RPM's, ambient temperatures, coolant temps and several other factors then ESTIMATES the usable life left in the oil.It does not TEST the oil. Highway miles are considered the easiest on oil so a vehicle driven strictly on the highway in the summer will get longer usage from the oil then one that is started and shut off frequently in the winter. The OLM is calibrated for the specific vehicle and the type of oil recomended for it.It has no "sensors' that determine if it's conventional or synthetic.There are no "sensors" that sample the oil.
 
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