Oil Related Failure at less than 150k Miles

[hominid7]

Engines do seem to be somewhat forgiving even when not maintained properly. My Dad had an old 1964 plymouth station wagon (V8 w/push button transmission). He sold it to our next door neighbor in 1976 when it had around 125K on it. The neighbors daughter drove it to and from Denton/Dallas for 4 years of college (90 mile round trip). After she graduated he took back the car and used it to haul tools around in for his cabinet business. The car had well over 200K on it when he finally sold it (still running strong).

Dad always used Pennzoil and changed it every 4k-5k miles. The neighbor used mostly pennzoil or havoline in it. As far as i know the transmission and the engine never had any problems.

Since that time my family has owned 4 other Dodge/Chrysler/Plymouth vans and all have been very reliable and long lasting with lots of use and not so much love.

My sister just sold her 1998 Caravan with 160K of HARD driven city miles. Her new car: 2005 Caravan.

The only odd thing i've experienced is my Dad's 1977 GMC Rally STX passenger van with 350 V8. It ran great and was very reliable but on the highway it would burn/leak about 1 quart of oil every 500 miles. The right rear spark plug would get completely soaked with oil and junk. Obviously it needed an overhaul, but sad that it went south with only 70,000 on it. Having said that, we did have a trouble free trip in it from Dallas to NYC and back (with a case of pennzoil 10w40 in the back)!

My personal cars and mileage have been:
1975 Toyota Corona, 115K
1981 Honda Accord, 165K
1988 VW Golf, 30K
1989 VW Jetta, 250K
2000 Mazda Protege, 11K
2001 Mazda 626, 38K

Never an oil problem in my cars! Then again, i'm not sure i've ever gone as far as 4000 between oil changes in my life!

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

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Originally posted by kenw:

quote:

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Originally posted by bulwnkl:
Wow, that's crazy! The 2.6-liter Mitsu was a far better motor than the stuff ChryCo replaced it with...

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you're kidding, right?..

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Just thought I come follow-up a little. No, I'm not kidding. That Caravan was 1 of 4 Mitsu 2.6s from the '80s we had, and the neighbor I talked about had (has) several more. They were in the Dodge Raider (Mitsu Montero)and Dodge D-50 (Mitsu pickup, later called Mighty Max). They were all excellent engines which provided excellent service for a very long time (and mileage).

I had a '90 Dodge Shadow with the Mopar 2.5 non-turbo that I bought new, so I have a good comparison. That 2.5 was also completely reliable, but it started burning enough oil at ~60,000 to require top-offs between 5,000-mile drains, and that increased toward ~90,000 when I traded it off. The most noticeable differences between the older Mitsu 2.6 and the newer Mopar 2.5 were the 20-30% greater horsepower of the Mitsu, which didn't give up any torque to the Mopar, and the much better smoothness of the Mitsu. I was told the smoothness was due to Mitsu's better balance shaft design/implementation.

Perhaps the Mitsus liked the 15W40 HDEO that they always got. The Shadow usually got 15W40, but there were many times it got 10W30 PCMO instead. It was also exclusively a highway car, whereas the Mitsus saw mainly dusty, muddy farm service (the Caravan less so, but it was still a water-changer).

 

[mettech_2001]

I bought new a 95 Ply Neon Sport 5-speed. As of last week, it hit....200,000 miles..... Nothing, I repeat nothing has been done to the engine... Same head gasket even.... OBTW, up to about the 150,000 mile mark, before I gave it to my daughter, I ran only M1 5w30. Since then, it's had M Drive Clean/7500 5w30. My daughter just put on 4 new tires. We expect at least another 30K miles out of it... It looks bad, but still runs good and gets 30 MPG on Shell gas.

 

[muddawgs]

kenw is right on.. they used those in the mitsu trucks also if i remember right. those 2.6's are typical mosquito foggers around here but do last for some time. the 2.2's and 2.5's are a great engine,easy to work on, cheap and are pretty dependable with little more than a oil change and a timing belt at the appropriate times. check out turbovan.net/van.html for a caravan from my neighbor and friend. check out the video too its funny hearing the kids yell.

 

[Annihilator]

Hmmm, no problems in our family. Mostly 350's, 318's, and ford 4.6's. The worst thing that I can tell right now is that the Tbird 4.6 knocks a tad on startup even with a good flowing filter. My Caprice police car with 130k still runs great. Long live the 350

 

[brianl703]

quote:

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Originally posted by TooSlick:
Lubricants don't "cause" engine failures, with the following exceptions:

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I would add:

5)You let the engine oil get low. Words of wisdom from my mechanic: "Air is a ****** lubricant."

 

[Winston]

quote:

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Mitsu, which didn't give up any torque to the Mopar, and the much better smoothness of the Mitsu. I was told the smoothness was due to Mitsu's better balance shaft design/implementation.

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I believe Mitsu had a patent on the counter rotating balance shaft idea. That patent has run out so now it is showing up on other four cylinder engines. ie. the new GM Ecotec engine.

 

[z917990]

I've never had a car go to car heaven due to an oil related failure. I take meticulous care of my cars, but I think I'm cursed. Here's the list:
1. 1987 Mustang 5.0 - died 1996, 100,000 miles - bad heater core, bad clutch, seat collapsed, radio quit, excessive rust, multiple sensors gone bad - not worth $2500.00 in repairs.
2. 1990 Pontiac Grand Prix. 3.1 litre - died 1998, 100,000 miles - transmission, ball joints, all the paint fell off, a/c quit - not worth $3000.00 in repairs.
3. 1987 Nissan Sentra (wife's car) - died 1996, 120,000 miles - car rusted so badly that the rear axle fell off - irreparable.
4. 1992 Buick Century - died 2003 - 118,000 miles - bad injectors, slipping trans, collapsed seat, power antenna busted, radio died, windows didn't open - I had already sunk $2500.00 into the car and didn't want to spend another $3000.00
5. 1995 Geo Prism - died 2005, 125,000 miles - blown head gasket, timing belt needed replacement - just not worth it.

I changed the oil, using dino, less than every 3000 miles. I changed the transmission fluid and radiator fluid every 2 years. I had the cars checked annually by reputable mechanics. I replaced things that needed fixing until the cars turned into money pits. I really wish that some day, I'll have the luck that some of you guys have and I'll see one of my Hondas go over 200,000.

 

[DOC]

I have never had an oil related failure. I only recently sent my 89 Dakota to the bone yard with over 380,000 miles. The engine still ran strong it was the trans and other stuff that added up to cost more than it was worth. Current vehicles are 97 3.8 Pontiac Bonneville with 175,000 and orginal trans.
1999 Dodge 5.2 Ram with 125,000 and getting 4,000 miles before it needs a quart of oil. And the oil I use mostly valvoline 10/40 5-7000 mile change intervals.

 

[CBR.worm]

I had an oil control problem on an '89 Plymouth voyager w/ 3.0 Mitsu V6 smoked like a pig starting around 60K. I was very dissapointed, but it was still reliable for many more years. Head gasket went at 278K probably at least partially due to pinging because of oil in the chamber.

I spun a rod bearing in a bike with about 35K miles on it but I never really attributed it to oil failure. The bike saw extended operation regularly above 14,000 rpm - I was surprised it lasted as long as it did.

 

[MIAMI-DADE]

Yeah had a roomate awhile back who had a 73 Vega.I could always see him coming cause of the black smoke pouring out behind it

. Sold it at 30k.

He finally put something in the oil to stop it from smoking for 10 seconds to trade it in on a Ford Torino.The Torino was best car ever.Never any problems.I think it had a 351 V8.We put over 100k on it& it had ice cold a/c.

 

[Johnson994]

I have seen broken timing chains on Mercedes V8s before 40,000 miles, a siezed camshaft on a Dodge Challenger 1.6 Liter Mitsubishi at just shy of 50,000 miles. Many bad Mercedes camshafts. All of this when Quaker State was used.

 

[Dad2leia]

CBR.worm, the Mitsubishi 3 L engine in the Voyagers had a problem with valve stems going bad rather quickly (had one for 400K miles, so personal experience).

Very strong engine other than that. Unfortunately, they weren't a cheap fix, as the heads had to come off do replace them.

 

[Winston]

quote:

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CBR.worm, the Mitsubishi 3 L engine in the Voyagers had a problem with valve stems going bad rather quickly (had one for 400K miles, so personal experience).

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Did you replace the seals or just add oil? Was the 400k on the original engine?

 

[Kestas]

3.0L Mitsubishi engine - well known problem with oil leakage past the valve guides. New seals won't last long. The guides need to be replaced because slop in the valve guide will open up the seals quicker. Otherwise, the engine has a very strong bottom end and is nearly bulletproof.

Mercedes timing chains - on some engines, especially the V8s, they are known to need replacement at high miles. Again, very strong bottom ends.

You can't blame both situations on the oil used. Rather, the design or materials just isn't good enough for the lubrication available.

 

[Dad2leia]

Winston, I gave the engine a minor overhaul at 175K, which included the valve guides and seals, cleaded up heads, rings and bearings. I figured that also was cheap insurance given the fact that the heads had to come off anyway. Knowing now, I would've have just done the heads, and done them again at 300K, when it really started to use the oil again, instead of the overhaul route.

Kestas, I don't blame the oil at all. I just had to switch to a dino oil, because the synthetic was just getting too expensive to be sending out the exhaust pipe every 500-750 miles per quart. Too bad they had the valve problem, because I agree that this was indeed a bulletproof motor, and if the rest of the van wasn't falling apart, the engine probably would've seen half a million easy!!

 

[Winston]

Hmm. I never heard that the seals failed because the valve guides are too loose. Some people change the seals with the heads still on the engine. Tricky, but doable. I do not know the long term success of changing the seals, but short term it is very effective.

Dad, what do you mean by cleaned up the bearings? Do you mean the cam shaft bearings? Or did yo dissassemble the bottom end too?

I have a mitsu 3.0 liter in my '95 Montero with 155k miles. It burns about 1 qt per 1500-2000 miles. Which is much better than some of these engines. I wonder if synthetic oil for the 1st 100k miles helped. I have ARX'd it and it is helping.

 

[Dad2leia]

Had the bottom end done too. Man, I loved that engine (Japanese technology...phooey!)

 

[the_oil_dealer]

I bought a 88 626 2.2L with 360k KM's and a shot oil pump. After running for about 2 minutes after a cold start, the oil light would come on and stay on, regardless of the 20w50 i put in there. The engine never seized and I drove it for about, 600km's that way lol. The worst was on the 'longer' trips, the HLAs would collapse and the valvetrain got a bit noisey. The funniest thing ever with this car, I took it for an e-test and the guy was like "hey man, your oil light is on) i told him to just run it anyway....... the results had everyone floored. The results from the E-test were amazing, not many NEW cars could pull the numbers off! After e-testing and registering, I took it to a shop and pulled the motor out to be replaced with a DOHC 2.0