Oil for custom 351W motor

[Texasdoc]

First post - sorry for the length.

I have a self-built 351w in my home-built kit car cobra. Since I built it, there are no manufacture's recommendations on what oil to use. I have read a lot of the posts here. Some even say to post this in the race forum, but I'm going to try here first. The race forum seems like it is for all out racing.

I will provide as much information here as I can to help with recommendations.

350hp/350tq at the wheels.
Stock 1982 block 351w bored to .040 over.
Stock crank .020 under
Stock rods .020 under
Hypereutectic pistons, moly rings
Moroso 7qt oil pan with windage tray. Moroso pickup.
Standard volume oil pump.
Comp cams XR282RF retrofit cam, roller lifters with dogbone locators.
AFR 185 heads, 1.6 rockers, Airgap intake, Holley 670cfm carb.
180 degree thermostat. Coolant runs 190-195 degrees with the fan on.
WIX oil filter - 1/2 height - can't use the F1A filter due to size restriction.

I drive it on the weekends. Usually short trips in town, but occasionally across town, or rarely across the state. Once a year on a track for a day - 20 minute runs with 1 hr cool down times. 2-3 times per year down to the local 1/8 mile strip (completely warm) for up to 10 passes with 10+ minutes between passes. It will sit over the winter for 3-4 months without being started. I don't drive unless the ambient temp is above 50 degrees. I will pull the distributor and prime the pump with a drill each year before the first start. I never just start the car and drive it cold. I always start it, then let it sit for at least a minute or two (usually about 5) before driving.

I have been using Castrol GTX 10w30 and it seems to be doing ok. I have about 60 psi oil pressure when cold. It gradually decreases as the oil/engine warms up. When hot, I have 15psi pressure at idle, and about 40psi at 3000rpm. I would like to see a little higher psi at idle when hot.

I have read about some of the recommendations for oils on this forum, but to be honest, I don't understand all of them. I don't have cats, so higher zinc won't destroy them. I can get Valvoline VR1 locally, as well as Mobil1, but I'm not sure if i need them. I can order anything if I need to (Summit, Jegs, etc)

So, the questions are:
1. Weight - would a 10w40 be better? Do they make 0w40 or 5w40? Would the 40 base oil increase the hot idle psi? Or, do I even need to increase the hot psi? OR, would a lighter weight oil be better? Would 0w20 or 5w20 increase protection to the bearings since they will flow thru the bearings easier? Or 5w30?

2. Additives - I've read some stuff about zinc. Should I use a high zinc oil (or a small amount of Lucas additive) since I don't have cats? I don't have a tappet cam, so is this still important?

3. Brand - I don't mind using the high dollar/hard to find/need to order online oil if I need to (Joe Gibbs, Royal Purple, Rotella, etc). I would prefer to just go down to the local store and pick it up. I will usually only change the oil once a year since I only drive 1500 miles (maximum) a year.

Thanks in advance. Again, sorry for the long post, I just want to get the best recommendations..

 

[147_Grain]

What about keeping things simple with Mobil 1's 0W-40 or Amsoil's 5W-40?

 

[OVERKILL]

M1 0w-40 is my go-to oil for Windsors. It would be an excellent choice here.

 

[440Magnum]

Another vote for M1 0w40. With the roller cam, you don't need sky-high zddp. I run it I both my RB mopars, even with flat tappet cams and have had no problems. One was my daily driver for several years.

If a little more zddp and a littlest cost is appealing, then Rotella T6 5w40. I used it in the RBs before M1

 

[chainblu]

Sounds like what you've been doing is working. If it was my car, I'd try a Hi-perf 160 degree thermostat to try and get the coolant temp down a few degrees and/or a bigger (better) fan.

The M1 0w-40 sounds like a good idea. You probably wouldn't need the 5 minute warm ups anymore.

 

[Clevy]

Firstly WELCOME TO BITOG.


K. Are the bearing clearances stock and do you know what your oil temps stabilize at?
I've used 5w-20 in windsors and gone as thick as a straight 60 and from experience my mustangs felt like they had more pep on 5w-20 then anything else I used.
As a go to oil I like the euro spec oils. They are always top notch and stout and are a no brainer,especially if max oil temps are an unknown.
Oil pressure might increase a bit with a 40 grade too.
But considering how you operate the vehicle and mileage is low on the yearly change I'd use a conventional hdeo in either the 10w-30 or 15w-40 flavour.
No need to spend extra on synthetic in this application.

And Lucas contains no zddp so don't waste your money on that junk. If you want an additive that works use mos2. I use it in everything I own. My equipment has astronomical hours on them and my vehicles get better fuel economy.
Napa carries it

 

[Triton_330]

If you want something with a little heavier additive pack, you can try oil that is rated for both gas and diesel engines such as Rotella. I would recommend Rotella T6 5w-40.

Side note: My father used to own a '79 Bronco that had a 351 Windsor bored over the same amount as yours. That thing was a beast. We ran the heck outta that thing. One time we went down a flooded road so far that water was coming in the cab on our feet... and it was lifted! Those Windsors are good engines, man.

EDIT: Like Clevy said, you could even just get a conventional hdeo. Rotella T 15w-40 would be my recommendation there. But, I still recommend the T6 5w-40 as well.

 

[Kruse]

Originally Posted By: Texasdoc

Comp cams XR282RF retrofit cam, roller lifters with dogbone locators.

WIX oil filter - 1/2 height - can't use the F1A filter due to size restriction.



You've got roller lifters. I'm not so sure why you need more than a good dino oil. If you want to sleep better at night, buy a synthetic oil, but probably not necessary, IMO.
Are you sure you can't get a 90 degree oil filter adaptor in there?

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: chainblu
Sounds like what you've been doing is working. If it was my car, I'd try a Hi-perf 160 degree thermostat to try and get the coolant temp down a few degrees and/or a bigger (better) fan.

The M1 0w-40 sounds like a good idea. You probably wouldn't need the 5 minute warm ups anymore.


A colder T-Stat is known to cause more wear FWIW. A 180 is about as optimal as you can get with a Windsor.

 

[Texasdoc]

Thanks for all the suggestions. Looks like a 0w40 or a 5w40 is recommended. A couple votes for Mobil 1. Not sure what a hdeo is, but I'm guessing dino oil. (I saw a sticky that listed acronyms - I'll check that out.)

Forget the extra additives since I have a roller cam and lifters. Got it.

Edit: hdeo - Heavy Duty Engine Oil. Does the bottle need to say "Heavy Duty" or are there certain brands/blends that qualify?

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: Texasdoc
Thanks for all the suggestions. Looks like a 0w40 or a 5w40 is recommended. A couple votes for Mobil 1. Not sure what a hdeo is, but I'm guessing dino oil. (I saw a sticky that listed acronyms - I'll check that out.)

Forget the extra additives since I have a roller cam and lifters. Got it.

Edit: hdeo - Heavy Duty Engine Oil. Does the bottle need to say "Heavy Duty" or are there certain brands/blends that qualify?


It`s basically diesel/gasoline dual rated oil. Rotella,Delvac,Delo,etc.

 

[901Memphis]

Mobil 1 0w40 European Formula and Shell Rotella T6 5w40 are interchangeable here.

Your HDEO's are ones that have diesel specifications and usually some gas specs too, like Rotella T6 5w40, T5 10w30, Mobil Delvec 5w40, Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5w40, Amsoil DEO 5w40, and many more.

I would probably just stick with the Mobil 1 0w40. It's a high viscosity index oil, with tons of builder approvals, and also isn't overly thick like some HDEO's are.

The Mobil 1 0w40 is 13.5 cSt @ 100C with a HTHS of 3.8 , while something like Mobil 1 TDT 5w40 is 14.5 cSt @ 100C with the same 3.8 HTHS.

 

[Texasdoc]

Originally Posted By: Clevy
Firstly WELCOME TO BITOG.


Thanks!

Originally Posted By: Clevy
K. Are the bearing clearances stock and do you know what your oil temps stabilize at?


Don't remember what they were, but in the range recommended by Tom Monroe in his book about rebuilding SBFs. So, I guess that would be considered stock. Don't know what the oil temps are doing. Don't have an oil temp gauge. Water temp at idle is 190 with the fan on. I can cruise with the fan off and the water temp comes down to 180-ish.

Originally Posted By: Clevy
Oil pressure might increase a bit with a 40 grade too. But considering how you operate the vehicle and mileage is low on the yearly change I'd use a conventional hdeo in either the 10w-30 or 15w-40 flavour.


See above question about hdeo. I am using Castrol GTX - don't know if it qualifies as heavy duty. I don't mind the cost of once a year changes with M1 0w40 if it is better than hdeo.

Edit: Nevermind on the last one. Cross post while others were posting. I'll go with the M1 0w40 and see what happens.

Thanks!

 

[Texasdoc]

Originally Posted By: chainblu
If it was my car, I'd try ... and get ... a bigger (better) fan.

The M1 0w-40 sounds like a good idea. You probably wouldn't need the 5 minute warm ups anymore.


Yeah, I'm going to get a different puller fan with shroud. I have a shroud in the front, but none in the back with the fan. I have a single 17-inch puller. Going to try to go with a dual fan, progressive turn-on system.

The car doesn't like running until it really warms up. It runs a little rough until it gets a little heat in it.

For those interested, here is a link to a picture of the car. Clicky

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Texasdoc
Originally Posted By: chainblu
If it was my car, I'd try ... and get ... a bigger (better) fan.

The M1 0w-40 sounds like a good idea. You probably wouldn't need the 5 minute warm ups anymore.


Yeah, I'm going to get a different puller fan with shroud. I have a shroud in the front, but none in the back with the fan. I have a single 17-inch puller. Going to try to go with a dual fan, progressive turn-on system.

The car doesn't like running until it really warms up. It runs a little rough until it gets a little heat in it.

For those interested, here is a link to a picture of the car. Clicky



Will a Mark VIII fan fit? If so, that, plus a DCC controller should be all you'll ever need. Those things move a STUPID amount of air.

 

[bubbatime]

First off the temps sound ok and nothing to worry about. The 180 degree thermostat seems to be ideal in your application.

Second off, hard to beat conventional 15W40 oil such as Rotella, Delo or Delvac. It would be ideal for that Ford and is what I would run. 2nd choice would be 10W40 Quaker State Defy. A solid oil with a good add pack.

 

[vintageant]

Shell Rotella 15W40 diesel oil is what I've been using in my three old tech engines for years.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

Will a Mark VIII fan fit? If so, that, plus a DCC controller should be all you'll ever need. Those things move a STUPID amount of air.


I bought a MkVIII fan for my Polara, and decided it would be too much work to make it fit. So I risked going down in size to the fan from a 3.8 Taurus (considered second to the MkVIII fan among OEM fans) and it works great at keeping the 440 with AC cool along with a DCC continuously-variable controller. Why that much fan is needed for a front-drive v6, I'll never know. The only complaint I have is that the DCC controller generates a lot of EMI and actually interfered with my ignition system until I added a lot of ferrite chokes on the wiring. You could feel the idle get "choppy" as the fan ramped through certain speeds- not good. But a big electrolytic cap on the input, chokes on the input/output, and re-routing the wiring in the harness to stay away from the ignition fixed it right up.

 

[440Magnum]

I don't get everyone pushing to run conventional oils in a car like this. Cost? Doesn't seem like that should be a driving factor.

Nothing at all WRONG with conventionals, but I prefer synthetics in wide viscosity spreads, and I like wide viscosity spreads to keep the start-up oil pressure and hot oil pressure from being so drastically different. Hence my recommendation for M1 0w40 OR Rotella T6 5w40. Yes a 15w40 conventional HD oil will work and protect the engine quite well, but you'll get a wider pressure spread between cold and hot. Been there, done that, didn't twist an oil pump drive or blow apart a filter, but it gave me pause seeing >100 PSI cold.

 

[yvon_la]

I would use rotella t6 0w40 .it will handle !why?turbo in big rig reach 1100 f very often.normal oil temp in todays oil in big rig?225 f !so dont sweat it ,its good !let your toy warm up or cooldown 3 minute and you ll have ton of fun