Observations about Honda's OLM system

[The Critic]

Recently, a topic came up on AcuraZine regarding Honda's OLM system, which is called the Maintenance Minder.

Most owners with the 2.4L i-VTEC engine in the TSX are only getting 3.5k to 5k miles before the display shows < 15% oil life remaining and calls for an A or B service. Same goes for the turbocharged RDX, even though the RDX uses Mobil 1.

On the other hand, owners of the V6 Acura are usually averaging 6-7k between service.

The maintenance minder system has a maximum interval of 10,000 miles for the TL, TSX, and RDX (and all Honda/Acura vehicles).

Is the 4-cyl Honda actually harder on oil than the V6? Or is it because owners of the 4-cyl models are forced to drive them harder in order to extract enough power, and as a result, the higher rpms seen is resulting in a shorter service interval?

Any ideas?

 

[Auto-Union]

5k @ 40% (actually=50%) on mine.

 

[southpanola]

My Accord 2.4 has between 6300-6700 when it reaches 15%.

 

[buster]

Quote:

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Or is it because owners of the 4-cyl models are forced to drive them harder in order to extract enough power, and as a result, the higher rpms seen is resulting in a shorter service interval?

Any ideas?

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I think it comes down to whether you think the OLM is a better indicator of the oil condition vs that of a Lab such as Blackstone.

Now in the Accord it's a lower Hp engine, but still the same low wearing Honda engine. Of all the oil analysis I've seen, these engines can go very far on the oil so I'm not exactly sure how the OLM is determining the condition of the oil. Was the oil used conventional and do synthetics actually last longer?

 

[jmsbntz]

The OLM cannot determine the actual "condition" of your oil, and it may even be a bit conservative for conventional oil. UOA is the best way to gauge remaining oil life in my opinion. My 07 Pilot manual says that "Based on the engine operating conditions and accumulated engine revolutions, the onboard computer in your vehicle calculates the remaining engine oil life and displays it as a percentage." So it is obviously counting the revolutions as part of the OLM algorithm whether the engine is just idling, involved in stop and go city driving or just cruising down the highway. I'll have to have a look in ALLDATA to see if it sheds light on what else is taken into consideration. I have reached a little over 7.4k before the OLM reached 0% with 40 mile one way trips to work. A co-worker who's wife does a lot of in town driving with her 07 Pilot was under 5k when her OLM reached 15%. So my off the cuff guess is that the 2.4 doesn't use the same OLM algorithm.

 

[Pablo]

I agree with jmsbntz - sounds to me the algorithm for the 4 needs a tweak. The V6 is even too conservative for me.

 

[Boomer01]

I've got an '07 CRV bought in January with 2.4.

Lots of short trips in high altitude sub zero early on. It tripped the 90% at 1000 miles in this type of driving.

Longer trips in summer took it around 1300 to 1400 miles for each 10% tripped. So pro rate that out and it would appear Honda's telling me you can go 13 to 14k on a dino change in the thing under "normal" service (which it will never see). Won't see that kind of oil change shedule either.

Just tripped 60% the other day at 7000 miles exactly.

 

[Boomer01]

Meant to say 40% at 7000 miles.

 

[double vanos]

I wonder if sump capacity vs liters of displacement has anything to do with it. How much oil does the 4 hold vs the 6?

 

[jmsbntz]

Wow Boomer01,
You're not still on the factory fill are you? Keep us informed on the OLM %, I don't think they are supposed exceed 10k. My Pilot OLM hit 15% on the factory fill at just over 6k. My 7.4k was with Royal Purple 5W40 and my co-workers wife was on the factory fill. Could it be the algorithm is different on the CRV too? I'll check ALLDATA on Tuesday when I go back to work.

 

[The Critic]

Quote:

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I wonder if sump capacity vs liters of displacement has anything to do with it. How much oil does the 4 hold vs the 6?

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Both the 2.4L i-VTEC 4-cyl and the 3.2L V6 hold 4.5 qts of 5W20 conventional oil and use the identical "tea cup" filter. The only exception is the RDX which uses synthetic oil.

 

[jmsbntz]

Definitely a possibility, hopefully a Honda tech will chime in or ALLDATA will provide some more info.

 

[The Critic]

Quote:

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I've got an '07 CRV bought in January with 2.4.

Lots of short trips in high altitude sub zero early on. It tripped the 90% at 1000 miles in this type of driving.

Longer trips in summer took it around 1300 to 1400 miles for each 10% tripped. So pro rate that out and it would appear Honda's telling me you can go 13 to 14k on a dino change in the thing under "normal" service (which it will never see). Won't see that kind of oil change shedule either.

Just tripped 60% the other day at 7000 miles exactly.

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It's possible that the oil life will drop faster toward the end of the interval, as I do recall reading that Honda does not allow the maintenance minder to exceed 10,000 miles between service, period, even under the most ideal conditions.

 

[jmsbntz]

All righty then! We can rule that possibility out!

 

[Boomer01]

No, I changed the oil out at 2550 miles, then 6350. Never reset the Maintenance minder though. Pennz 5w-20 dino for both.

Honda says the 2.4 holds 4.4 quarts with a filter change.

Mine took exactly 5.5 quarts both times. Let it drain for about 1 1/2 hrs. both times. Its a steady drainer for a long time. Put it up on ramps too and that seems to level out the oil pan, so maybe that's where that extra 1.1 quarts come from.

I don't know, but i think this MM will take me past 10 k.

 

[06VtecV6]

My observations:

I will follow it to a T using synthetic oil and will monitor it's 4700-5500 mile MMS range so far in my V6 Accord when I use a blend like I am. Right now I'm on a blend that I might "pull" at 30%, *wink* *wink* *nod* (Merk)

Isn't this cool to talk about MMS exclusively. PM me Honda peeps.

 

[televascular]

I disagree with the OP. I never go longer than 5,000mi on M1, except for my first two OCIs. I had around 7,000mi during break-in when the OLM said 10%. Now I have about 35,000mi and I hit 8,000rpm on a regular basis, but still have an OLM reading of about 30% when I reach 5,000. All while returning 27-29mpg. I love Hondas.

 

[Max_Wander]

there has got to be a little warranty clock built in... i mean, who would know?

 

[buster]

The OLM has no way of knowing what type of oil you are using and whether it's truly shot or not. You will have to compare the OLM drain intervals vs a UOA to really see the true condition of the oil IMHO. The OLM is probably somewhat conservative (I would think coming from Honda) but accurate based on conventional oil. Long drain synthetics with high TBN would most likely be excluded from the Honda's testing of the OLM.

 

[Bullwinkle007]

My 2007 Acura MDX dropped from 100% to 90% in 550 miles. It sees short trips less than 5 miles M-F. And Uber /Lyft on Saturday. Easy 500 miles, from 100%-15% is about 5k miles. I know the previous owner did them every 3500-5k per her maintenance records she provided me.