Umm, no hate intended but I’d put HPL No VII blends against Mobil any day. Maybe if enough people start buying it, @High Performance Lubricants may pursue licensing to satiate people inside warranty!
New Mobil 1 0w40 Super Car
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D
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I'm running all HPL lubricants (engine & drivetrain) in a 2022 Jeep Grand Cherokee WK2 4X4 and in a 2022 Dodge Durango GT Plus AWD. In the Durango I'm running HPL NO-VII Euro 5W-30. I am not concerned about warranty coverage whatsoever.@High Performance Lubricants may pursue licensing to satiate people inside warranty!
@High Performance Lubricants has no reason to pursue API licensing.
Mobil's products compete in a different market, pricing category, and they have a different target audience.
As an example, the guy who just spent $13K in dealer markup for market adjustment on top of the $40K sticker price for his 2023 Toyota Corolla GR will not spend money on HPL. He will save $3 per oil change and buy Mobil 1 AFE 0W-20 instead of EP. That's because he needs to save every penny he can for premium gas, insurance, and most importantly, to feed the bank.
I love HPL, their products, and what they're doing for this community and car enthusiasts in general. However, some comparisons are just pointless as HPL products already are a cut above everything else.
Twice as much Moly in that 5W-50 vs the 0W-40. Ford Coyotes (Track Packs), Roadrunners (Boss 302) and Voodoo GT-350 and GT-500s will be liking that.
Recent article on this oil:
“We want to test everything. We don’t just want to pass the minimum suite of tests.”
“We were trying to put together an oil that would just crush all of those tests and well exceed the limits for those, “Salvesen says. “Then we tested Supercar on the track with the race teams to make sure that it’s going to hold up to track abuse with higher cylinder temperatures, with higher revs, with higher loading and just the extra abuse that you’re going to see on the track. It passed in both cases.
“We don’t just want to pass the test to get the checkmark, we do what’s called ‘Proof of Performance,’” Salvesen says.
“I think that level of testing, that level of prove-out work is really what we can bring to the table versus most smaller brands.”
“We want to test everything. We don’t just want to pass the minimum suite of tests.”
“We were trying to put together an oil that would just crush all of those tests and well exceed the limits for those, “Salvesen says. “Then we tested Supercar on the track with the race teams to make sure that it’s going to hold up to track abuse with higher cylinder temperatures, with higher revs, with higher loading and just the extra abuse that you’re going to see on the track. It passed in both cases.
“We don’t just want to pass the test to get the checkmark, we do what’s called ‘Proof of Performance,’” Salvesen says.
“I think that level of testing, that level of prove-out work is really what we can bring to the table versus most smaller brands.”
I wouldn't kick any of them out of bed. Ive run the fs 0w40 in my 911 for years as it was recommended and is even the fill in the cup race cars. I've used the ESPx3, ESP factory fill and the identical Supercar oil too in the c8 Corvettes as that's what Josh Holder the lead powertrain engineer told me he'd run. I'm not going to outthink his level of testing.
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Is the Mobil 1 super car 0w40 a PAO Base stock ?
Is there something magical about PAO base stock?
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Primarily only if you live in like Winnipeg, lol. Though I do personally prefer the superior cold temp performance that it offers, but unless you live where it gets really cold, it's not very important.
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No but from what Amsoil says PAO is a real Synthetic and the major commercial brands (Mobil,Pennzoil,Castrol etc ) use a cheaper base stock Gp3 and calling it synthetic.
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So PAO doesn’t really protect more in wear I guess ?
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Deleted member 89374
Actually, it protects less. PAO is helped by ANs and/or certain esters if the formulation is done right. Otherwise, in its pure form, it's worse than Group III or GTL. Therefore, it also gets more expensive to formulate with PAO.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Correct. It has two strengths:
- Oxidation resistance
- Cold temperature performance
The former, bases like Group III and GTL (technically also Group III) with the use of antioxidants, can be made perform just as well, without the formulation challenges such as seal shrink and the worst solubility of the groups (though both are also pretty bad in that department, 2nd worst).
As @Rod Knock noted, this is why you see the use of AN's and/or esters when PAO is used, because they add that solubility and counteract the seal shrink tendency as well as improving the overall base oil performance while retaining the cold temperature properties that were likely the main reason PAO was being used in the first place.
Blending a low Noack 0W-xx is extremely challenging without PAO, particularly if you want to use AN's, and it becomes more challenging the bigger the spread, like say a 0W-30 or 0W-40. This is why we continue to see PAO used in many, if not most, 0W-40's.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
AMSOIL uses plenty of Group III too, even in their SS oils, which can be somewhat inferred from the Point Point of their products. Mobil uses PAO where they need to/where it's advantageous or provides a performance improvement. One thing you can count on is change. Mobil has changed the base oil blend of their oils multiple times in the last decade or so, ramping up, ramping down, phasing out, phasing in, PAO, depending on the grade and performance targets. Formulation isn't static and there's always the push to optimize the balance of price and performance.
In the Gale Banks Amsoil video, Dan Peterson emphasized that they like and use group III and V. Their SDS also reflect the III base oil in the SS line. Much like the others they use multiple base oils and as Overkill said it changes.
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D
Deleted member 89374
They also use GTL now.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Yes, good point! Forgot about that, that's a recent, though not surprising, change.
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thanks for the informative info folks much appreciated
Not to invoke an old thread, but I'm running M1 Supercar 0w40 in my Honda Civic D17A right now & plan on pulling a sample for analysis in November to see how it holds up. The car is used for my daily commute to/from work, 95+% highway @ 50-80+mph, humming between 3-4k rpm with spikes up to 5+k rpm, 45min-1hr drive each way, 5 days/wk. I saw the M1 Supercar 0w40 on sale at my local WM, & thought why not. Kinda like a 5w30 with some extra hype, & may suit my needs perfectly. It's a Honda with a JDM motor that would probably be fine with whatever I gave it, but I plan on switching to HPL next spring & am still in the process of figuring out which oils of theirs would best suit my driving habits listed above for a little high rev engine. I'm intrigued by the no VII, & oddly enough their Supercar line up. Whether 5w30 or 10w30, pcmo or euro are little bits I'm still trying to figure out. Any insight is greatly appreciated. I'll post uoa of the M1 Supercar due time.
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