New CVT oil ??

[Rand]

Another option I'd recommend above any OEM fluid would be from Red Line. Here's what they have to say:

https://www.redlineoil.com/non-slip-cvt

• Designed specifically for use in metal belt-type Continuously Variable Transmissions including Mini, Nissan and Subaru

... and there's plenty more options available out there.

Hopefully redline's testing is more thorough than the person writing that.
subaru uses "puller" chain style. vs the pusher metal belt style.

the 2015 Crosstrek uses Subaru High Torque CVT Fluid (CVTF-II or CVTF-HP)

I wouldn't discredit your mechanic for asking.

There is no CVTF-HP?

and the crosstrek has never used CVTF-HT "orange"

only CVTF-II "Green" in CVT equipped until year 2020 which changed to CVTF-III Blue

 

[Nessism1]

If the fluid was the problem (it wasn't if you were using a recommended fluid) then you could confirm this by changing fluids.

People often blame damage from neglect and poor maintenance on the fluid, this is incorrect but easy to understand why they think or believe it.

The Sentra manual called for NissanMatic D fluid, or XYZ spec fluid. I used XYZ, and the trans didn't blow up, but it also didn't shift right afterwards. The car was bought new, and well maintenanced by me. There was no neglect. I just messed up and didn't buy the Nissan ATF, because the aftermarket fluid was available on Amazon.

 

[kschachn]

Having the transmission “tuned” to a specific fluid viscosity sounds a lot like those mythical Toyota electric oil pumps that are calibrated to a -20 grade oil. How does it cope with the fact that viscosity is highly dependent on temperature? Do they operate improperly when it’s a little cooler or warmer than ideal?

 

[JRHAWK9]

I'm planning on doing a drain/refill on my '21 Crosstrek (CVT-III) with Amsoil CVT fluid at around 30K miles.

 

[Pablo]

Just know that in my experience, using after market fluid in my old Nissan Sentra transmission, cause it to never shift correctly again.

I'm stuck on this. Why would this happen? Need some science in aisle 9!

 

[nascarnation]

Having the transmission “tuned” to a specific fluid viscosity sounds a lot like those mythical Toyota electric oil pumps that are calibrated to a -20 grade oil. How does it cope with the fact that viscosity is highly dependent on temperature? Do they operate improperly when it’s a little cooler or warmer than ideal?

At Allison we had (likely still do) characterization tables that take this into account.
But the adaptive functions are also able to compensate over time (it took a good number of shifts to learn) for everything from fresh 15W40 diesel engine oil to worn out Dexron.

 

[rijndael]

I'm stuck on this. Why would this happen? Need some science in aisle 9!

Let's not forget the possibility that any oil change could have induced the same result, OEM or aftermarket fluid.

 

[martinq]

The Sentra manual called for NissanMatic D fluid, or XYZ spec fluid. I used XYZ, and the trans didn't blow up, but it also didn't shift right afterwards. The car was bought new, and well maintenanced by me. There was no neglect. I just messed up and didn't buy the Nissan ATF, because the aftermarket fluid was available on Amazon.

And what happened when you changed the fluid after that? Not a drain and fill, as that is usually about a third of the ATF in the system, but a full system change. More info is needed to try to make sense of what you experienced.

- what was the milage when you changed the fluid (as mentioned in your post)?
- what did the pan & magnets look like?
- how clean were the magnets, any flakes noticed?
- when was the next complete system fluid change and what was it changed to?
- what did the pan and magnets look like then?

 

[IndyIan]

I'm planning on doing a drain/refill on my '21 Crosstrek (CVT-III) with Amsoil CVT fluid at around 30K miles.

I would be interested in see how this works out, but you do know you have 100k miles of factory warranty on that transmission? If the amsoil is the same color I doubt Subaru would even know if you did a couple amsoil changes, but a different color might have you losing the warranty if the trans has an issue.
My dealership finally just gave me a price to change the CVT fluid without one of the "service packages" and it wasn't too bad considering the cost of the fluid. I might be getting another Subaru, so if I do I'll get a 20l pail and do my own drain and fills.

 

[KGMtech]

I doubt any OEM company producing cars, trucks, ICE vehicles makes its own oils. They work with outside & inside Tribologists and Engineers to decide what is important and then make a recipe that is produced by an outside formulator. There might be secrecy, but let's be real here..

 

[JRHAWK9]

I would be interested in see how this works out, but you do know you have 100k miles of factory warranty on that transmission? If the amsoil is the same color I doubt Subaru would even know if you did a couple amsoil changes, but a different color might have you losing the warranty if the trans has an issue.
My dealership finally just gave me a price to change the CVT fluid without one of the "service packages" and it wasn't too bad considering the cost of the fluid. I might be getting another Subaru, so if I do I'll get a 20l pail and do my own drain and fills.

Magnuson-Moss Act

Lots of people seem to use Amsoil CVT fluids in their Subaru CVT's with good results.

 

[JRHAWK9]

I doubt any OEM company producing cars, trucks, ICE vehicles makes its own oils. They work with outside & inside Tribologists and Engineers to decide what is important and then make a recipe that is produced by an outside formulator. There might be secrecy, but let's be real here..

Subaru's CVT fluid is made by Idemitsu.

 

[IndyIan]

Magnuson-Moss Act

Lots of people seem to use Amsoil CVT fluids in their Subaru CVT's with good results.

Yes very true, I guess all these manufacturer CVT certifications are no different than other automatic transmissions manufacturer certifications.
It still seems to me odd why subaru would bother spec'ing different fluids if one "really good" fluid would work "really good" for all the subaru transmissions, and then work "really good" for the rest of the CVT's on the planet?
Also given they cost about the same, why do amsoils testing for them?

 

[Pelican]

Yes, exactly why? It's an old story that gets told over and over again.

Just have a look at the list of CVT fluids (or ATF for that matter) on the Volvoline Maxlife PDS, it's ridiculous. I suppose I should say to look at the PDS for the respective fluid to see if it is recommended.

... just had a peek at Amsoil and... why am I not surprised? OEMs just love making that sweet markup on fearful customers.

"Subaru e-CVTF, i-CVTF, Lineartronic® CVTF, K0425Y0710, CV-30, “Certified CVTF-II (SOA427V1660), High Torque CVTF"

https://www.amsoil.ca/p/amsoil-100-synthetic-cvt-fluid-cvt/

I would NOT take that as the Gospel! These fluid manufacturers to be in business must supply fluid for the most common trannies.
I memory serves, Subaru is the ONLY manufacturer that build its own transmissions, as such they may have particular needs that can only be provided by OEM Fluid. This is a sevice that the average person will do once every 3 to 5 years if at all, so what are the yearly savings of OEM fluid vs aftermarket claims.

 

[Pablo]

Yes very true, I guess all these manufacturer CVT certifications are no different than other automatic transmissions manufacturer certifications.
It still seems to me odd why subaru would bother spec'ing different fluids if one "really good" fluid would work "really good" for all the subaru transmissions, and then work "really good" for the rest of the CVT's on the planet?
Also given they cost about the same, why do amsoils testing for them?

The implications that Amsoil does no testing or somehow Amsoil CVT fluid on the market for years now damages CVTs truly needs some proof from the folks making the claims at this point.

 

[Rand]

The implications that Amsoil does no testing or somehow Amsoil CVT fluid on the market for years now damages CVTs truly needs some proof from the folks making the claims at this point.

if my 97000mile cvt fails(many had warranties extended to 100k miles) and the dealer says its not covered because of the fluid.. .them amsoil says the fluid didnt cause the failure .. what am I left with? Lawyers? Also how can 1 amsoil product replace 3 different subaru cvt fluids with different properties and viscosities?

I'll use the oem fluid. at least in warranty to avoid being "the man in the middle".

 

[Nessism1]

Having the transmission “tuned” to a specific fluid viscosity sounds a lot like those mythical Toyota electric oil pumps that are calibrated to a -20 grade oil. How does it cope with the fact that viscosity is highly dependent on temperature? Do they operate improperly when it’s a little cooler or warmer than ideal?

Incorrect (regarding the trans fluid, no clue about Toyota).

Every fluid formulation has it's own unique friction characteristics, viscosity, etc, and the engineers tune the TCU to work with the OEM fluid. Where I used to work, for an Asian OEM, the engineers had a laptop, and they would drive all over the place, while being able to tweak settings in the TCU. It's a fine line between a comfortable shift, too harsh, too mushy, shifting too late, etc, etc. These guys are pros, and sometimes the smallest change can have a noticeable effect in the transmission performance.

 

[goblin]

if my 97000mile cvt fails(many had warranties extended to 100k miles) and the dealer says its not covered because of the fluid.. .them amsoil says the fluid didnt cause the failure .. what am I left with? Lawyers? Also how can 1 amsoil product replace 3 different subaru cvt fluids with different properties and viscosities?

Again - Magnuson - Moss...

- Subaru can't tell you "Use only Subaru fluid, or else". If they do - they'd have to provide it to you for free.

- Subaru can tell you "Use only fluid matching certifications or parameters XYZ, such as Subaru's fluid XYZ".

- If Amsoil's fluid is XYZ certified - Subaru can't deny your claim based on that.

As for why Amsoil has one fluid where Subaru has three... well...wisdom advises to marry a woman who is smart, or attractive, or rich. Wisdom doesn't advise against marrying a woman that is smart, and attractive, and rich...

PS: I am on purpose on my horse here, as there's a reason for my madness. I came to know Amsoil specifically because they saved my FrogEye's manual transmission, after the Subaru dealership flushed it with what Subaru recommended at 50k miles and the gearbox started grinding at every shift straight out the door, with the dealership refusing to acknowledge that when THEY test the car and I can hear them shifting from two blocks away - there might be an issue.

About two weeks and two more tranny oil changes later the first guy I heard on the phone at Amsoil cut me off after hearing "Subaru", "Manual" and "Grind" in one sentence and directed me towards I believe 75w105 rather than the 75w90 that was specced by Subaru. I remember it was some viscosity I had not seen before, that they carried. And that was it. No more noises.

 

[Nessism1]

And what happened when you changed the fluid after that? Not a drain and fill, as that is usually about a third of the ATF in the system, but a full system change. More info is needed to try to make sense of what you experienced.

- what was the milage when you changed the fluid (as mentioned in your post)?
- what did the pan & magnets look like?
- how clean were the magnets, any flakes noticed?
- when was the next complete system fluid change and what was it changed to?
- what did the pan and magnets look like then?

I can't remember all the details like miles, but it was less than 50k. And I got lazy, and didn't flush the system thereafter. I just lived with the crap shifting. And no, I didn't drop the pan, it was a simple drain and fill. I did it twice, actually, driving in between drains.

 

[Nessism1]

As for why Amsoil has one fluid where Subaru has three... well...wisdom advises to marry a woman who is smart, or attractive, or rich. Wisdom doesn't advise against marrying a woman that is smart, and attractive, and rich...

The fact that Subaru has so many different types of CVT fluid is case in point, supporting what I mentioned above. CVT-LV, CVT-HT, CVTF-III, CVTF-II. Use generic fluid at your own risk.

https://www.subaruoutback.org/attachments/automatic_transmission_fluid_guide-pdf.490058/