Motul vs Pentosin?

edyvw said:
Those are different oils Motul is Low-SAPS, Pentosin LL01 is not.
This is comparable Pentosin:
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/pento-super-performance-iii-5w30-1-liter-8078106-8078107

Or, you could go to local Wal Mart and get Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W30 LL04 for $22 for 5qt. Exceptional oil.
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Right, I'm comparing the Motul XClean+ to the Pennzoil Euro 5w40 locally found at Walmart/AAP.

Is LL-04 Low SAPS vs LL-01 Full SAPS preferable in the Bx8 engines for valve deposits, cleanliness, etc. ?

The Penz Euro L looks like a good option, but would like it with VW 504 additionally.

Hence my question in switching from locally procured Pennzoil to the FCP sold Motul XClean+.
 
AspektZA said:
Right, I'm comparing the Motul XClean+ to the Pennzoil Euro 5w40 locally found at Walmart/AAP.

Is LL-04 Low SAPS vs LL-01 Full SAPS preferable in the Bx8 engines for valve deposits, cleanliness, etc. ?

The Penz Euro L looks like a good option, but would like it with VW 504 additionally.

Hence my question in switching from locally procured Pennzoil to the FCP sold Motul XClean+.
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Hard to say. B58 should not have any issues with CBU. I use PP EUro 5W40 in my car now. It is super smooth etc.
I used Motul X-Clean+ too, in my VW. Really, it is up to you what you gonna go with. Or, to really help you, if you do not track the car, stick to 5W30. Forget 5W40.
I personally would go PP Euro L 5W30 due to very high HTHS.
 
The discussions here about laws in Germany are sort of correct. Any oil that is manufactured in Germany has to state HC-Synthesis for Group III oils. The only "Full Synthetic" oils we can label as such are Group IV oils.

Even some of the newer 0W-20 weight oils we released ran into some issues worldwide with labeling, because it was originally labeled at Semi Synthetic, since they were a mix of PAO and Group III oils. We have since relabeled them.

The laws in Germany in terms of what is considered Fully Synthetic are much different than the rest of the world. There aren't too many oils available in the US that are ACTUALLY manufactured in Germany. LM and ours are very similar. Motul is manufacturered in France, and Pentosin, which is now owned by FUCHS, is manufactured in Mexico, Canada and SOME of their program is made in Germany, but not much anymore unfortunately.

If anyone wants to learn more about the laws and the actual breakdown of synthetics and what it means for a made in Germany product, feel free to message! We love to educate about quality Made In Germany oils!!
 
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ROWEMotorOilUSA said:
The discussions here about laws in Germany are sort of correct. Any oil that is manufactured in Germany has to state HC-Synthesis for Group III oils. The only "Full Synthetic" oils we can label as such are Group IV oils.

Even some of the new 0 weight oils we released ran into some issues worldwide with labeling, because it was originally labeled at Semi Synthetic, since they were a mix of PAO and Group III oils. We have since relabeled them.

The laws in Germany in terms of what is considered Fully Synthetic are much different than the rest of the world. There aren't too many oils available in the US that are ACTUALLY manufactured in Germany. LM and ours are very similar. Motul is manufacturered in France, and Pentosin, which is now owned by FUCHS, is manufactured in Mexico, Canada and SOME of their program is made in Germany, but not much anymore unfortunately.

If anyone wants to learn more about the laws and the actual breakdown of synthetics and what it means for a made in Germany product, feel free to message! We love to educate about quality Made In Germany oils!!
Click to expand...
Are you certain it is a law? Or is it some sort of administrative rule? We had a couple discussions on this in the past and no one was able to cite legislation but did say it was a “rule” or some other marketing ordinance.

And what’s a “0 weight oil”? Do you mean there is something such as a XW-0 out there?
 
kschachn said:
Are you certain it is a law? Or is it some sort of administrative rule? We had a couple discussions on this in the past and no one was able to cite legislation but did say it was a “rule” or some other marketing ordinance.

And what’s a “0 weight oil”? Do you mean there is something such as a XW-0 out there?
Click to expand...
I was discussing the 0W-20's that are in our program. Sorry for the confusion there.

I can ask our home office to better explain the laws/legistlations on our labeling.
 
kschachn said:
Are you certain it is a law? Or is it some sort of administrative rule? We had a couple discussions on this in the past and no one was able to cite legislation but did say it was a “rule” or some other marketing ordinance.

And what’s a “0 weight oil”? Do you mean there is something such as a XW-0 out there?
Click to expand...

The term "synthetic" or "fully synthetic" motor oil is used controversial internationally, but has been clearly defined in Germany by several court decisions. According to these rulings, only motor oils that consist entirely of polyalphaolefinic or dicarboxylic acid ester base oils plus additives may be labeled as “fully synthetic” in Germany. Some ready-to-use oils can therefore not be described as fully synthetic in Germany, although they contain polyalphaolefins of base oil group IV and deliver outstanding performance.

This is the feedback I received from our home office in Germany regarding the rules and regulations for labeling. If this helps at all!
 
ROWEMotorOilUSA said:
The term "synthetic" or "fully synthetic" motor oil is used controversial internationally, but has been clearly defined in Germany by several court decisions. According to these rulings, only motor oils that consist entirely of polyalphaolefinic or dicarboxylic acid ester base oils plus additives may be labeled as “fully synthetic” in Germany. Some ready-to-use oils can therefore not be described as fully synthetic in Germany, although they contain polyalphaolefins of base oil group IV and deliver outstanding performance.

This is the feedback I received from our home office in Germany regarding the rules and regulations for labeling. If this helps at all!
Click to expand...
Yeah I’d say that’s consistent with what has been discussed here in the past.
 
ROWEMotorOilUSA said:
The discussions here about laws in Germany are sort of correct. Any oil that is manufactured in Germany has to state HC-Synthesis for Group III oils. The only "Full Synthetic" oils we can label as such are Group IV oils.

Even some of the newer 0W-20 weight oils we released ran into some issues worldwide with labeling, because it was originally labeled at Semi Synthetic, since they were a mix of PAO and Group III oils. We have since relabeled them.

The laws in Germany in terms of what is considered Fully Synthetic are much different than the rest of the world. There aren't too many oils available in the US that are ACTUALLY manufactured in Germany. LM and ours are very similar. Motul is manufacturered in France, and Pentosin, which is now owned by FUCHS, is manufactured in Mexico, Canada and SOME of their program is made in Germany, but not much anymore unfortunately.

If anyone wants to learn more about the laws and the actual breakdown of synthetics and what it means for a made in Germany product, feel free to message! We love to educate about quality Made In Germany oils!!
Click to expand...
From what I’m seeing. It says 100% synthetic oil not full synthetic on the Motul bottles, does that change anything. I’m looking at the 8100 max 0W 40
 
edyvw said:
Max is not full synthetic. It is mostly Group III.
Click to expand...
Do you have any links? I guess I’m still confused, I was under the impression that if it’s labeled 100% synthetic in Germany that it has to be and if not it can say Full Synthetic
 
AMG2VETTE said:
Do you have any links? I guess I’m still confused, I was under the impression that if it’s labeled 100% synthetic in Germany that it has to be and if not it can say Full Synthetic
Click to expand...
It is not labeled 100% SYnthetic. It is labeled Synthetic Technology.
Based on the pour point and PDS probably on the lower end of 25-50% PAO that is in PDS.

https://www.motul.com/de/de/products/8100-x-max-0w40
 
edyvw said:
It is not labeled 100% SYnthetic. It is labeled Synthetic Technology.
Based on the pour point and PDS probably on the lower end of 25-50% PAO that is in PDS.

https://www.motul.com/de/de/products/8100-x-max-0w40
Click to expand...
I don’t know, when I look at the bottle it says the words “100% synthetic” on it. It also says it on their website, I don’t see synthetic technology anywhere on the bottle or the website.
 

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edyvw said:
What that has to do with German web site I gave you? Check the link I gave you, it is Motul.de. Bottle has to be in German, not English.
Also, German Amazon, check bottle:
https://www.amazon.de/104533-Motul-...EuMTUifQ==&sprefix=motul+X-Max,aps,278&sr=8-1
Click to expand...
I doubt the OP is buying stuff from German Amazon. He'll likely be buying from US sources who gets their stuff from France

Even the French website calls it "100% Synthetic"
https://www.motul.com/fr/fr/landings/car-engine-lubricants
 
I bought it from FCP Euro, the bottle says 100% synthetic based off of their website. I get that it's labeled something different in Germany, I should have phrased it differently, is the 100% synthetic bottle sold outside of Germany different than what they're selling in Germany? Can they label it 100% synthetic and sell it if it isn't in the US? For $60-75 for 5 liters I would like to believe it's not a group 3 oil.
 
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AMG2VETTE said:
I bought it from FCP Euro, the bottle says 100% synthetic based off of their website. I get that it's labeled something different in Germany, I should have phrased it differently, is the 100% synthetic bottle sold outside of Germany different than what they're selling in Germany? Can they label it 100% synthetic and sell it if it isn't in the US? For $60-75 for 5 liters I would like to believe it's not a group 3 oil.
Click to expand...
No, same stuff, different marketing.
If you want bunch if PAO, go HPL. Mobil1 0W40 and Castrol Edge 0W40 (API SN) will also have more PAO.

In US they can get away with such marketing. In Germany they cannot, nor other companies can.
 
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