Magnets on filters

[Ausfahrt]

I recently acquired a BMW R1150RT motorcycle in what amounted to a distress sale. I have been going through it and while changing the oil I noticed a magnet on it.

This may be common but I have never seen it before and I can only assume that it is to collect metal particulate the same as a magnetized drain plug would.

Thoughts?

 

[Malo83]

Better suited on the bottom of the filter.

 

[Johnny2Bad]

You can buy aftermarket commercial variants; that one looks like a DIY solution.

It's been around for decades. it will magnetize any iron based contaminants, which can then lodge or attach anywhere at a magnetic metal in the engine if dislodged. The large cluster of magnetized particles to me presents a caution, since the bigger the accumulation, the more likely it will become dislodged.

I personally don't use them, but have no evidence to support it's an issue either, except that OEMs don't use them on filters. They are commonly used by OEMs in transmission pans, though, but that is a completely different filter system, plus a higher risk of damage via metal particles in the valve body or perhaps solenoids which have fine passages and comparably small orfises. So automakers are obviously aware of the concept.

 

[UncleDave]

Originally Posted By: Ausfahrt
I recently acquired a BMW R1150RT motorcycle in what amounted to a distress sale. I have been going through it and while changing the oil I noticed a magnet on it.

This may be common but I have never seen it before and I can only assume that it is to collect metal particulate the same as a magnetized drain plug would.

Thoughts?


I believe that setup is better than no magnet. Plenty of OEMs use magnets in drain plugs since grandpa was a kid and still do.

If one is to beleive filtermags they claims a radial magnet on the side is a better place and their setup claims to delivers at least one all the way to 3 iso code drops in FE, just one of which is significant.

I think in a dome end down filter a magnet on the end of the dome makes a lot of sense as anything large or heavy will ultimately drop to the bottom- either you magnet can hold it during startup bypass moment or not - if it can the pieces dont go through your parts. If it can't the piece goes through the bypass opening your parts.

With no magnet you have no chance at all to catch and hold it - some chance is better than no chance to me.

If you have an iron clusters big enough to chunk off a neodymium, you have other problems.

UD

 

[i_hate_autofraud]

I’ve been trying this out for a while now and found out a few things.

In the Pic with a round ceramic magnet on the side, was there a radius
on that side of the magnet to match the curve of the filter housing? If it’s
flat sided it will be of little use, with a tiny contact patch to allow any magnet field
to go thru the relatively thin steel filter shell.

Magnets that sit on the closed /domed end of a filter don’t so much except
hold anything that settles there. Reason is that the greatest oil flow is thru
the filter medial at the spin-on end, oil takes the shortest path to get thru the
media.

Usually oil plugs with magnets are rather weak and don’t pick up much as I found each
time I checked mine, even under a microscope, but I’m just under 10ppm iron
anyway.
One member posted picks of his oil plug from his 6.7L diesel that picked up a lot due
mostly to break in, as I recall.

In any case, to make a difference, you’d need many magnets to pull iron out of the oil.
Bar magnets on the on the outside is way better then ring magnets anywhere on a filter
as shown in lots of Pics in the PDF below, etc:


“ FILTERMAG vs HOMEBREW “
https://app.box.com/s/uxvu8dmscf5wcgftutdm0ejqwgn86tw7

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: i_hate_autofraud
Usually oil plugs with magnets are rather weak and don’t pick up much as I found each
time I checked mine, even under a microscope, but I’m just under 10ppm iron anyway.


If you get a really good magnetic drain plug they can capture quite a bit of ferrous material. Here's one I use in my 2005 Tacoma (4.0L V6). You can see how much lower the captured amount is after a complete break-in. I'd rather have a strong magnetic drain plug than a magnet on the side of the oil filter.

@ 5,000 Miles



@ 43,000 Miles

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Malo83
Better suited on the bottom of the filter.

I agree. Unless you have magnets that contour to the shape of the sides, then I'd rather have them on the sides of the filter near the dome end of the filter.

 

[i_hate_autofraud]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: i_hate_autofraud
Usually oil plugs with magnets are rather weak and don’t pick up much as I found each
time I checked mine, even under a microscope, but I’m just under 10ppm iron anyway.


If you get a really good magnetic drain plug they can capture quite a bit of ferrous material. Here's one I use in my 2005 Tacoma (4.0L V6). You can see how much lower the captured amount is after a complete break-in. I'd rather have a strong magnetic drain plug than a magnet on the side of the oil filter.

@ 5,000 Miles




@ 43,000 Miles





I didn't forget - I mentioned your Pics in the next line! LOL

Dramatic Pics too, I'd be upset if I saw that coming out of my car.
Looks like the deposits are dropping in your case! Good!

I bought a mag oil plug from the local shop, wasn't impressed and tried
Ebay where a guy had a bunch with magnets with a 6 Lb pull and extended
3/4" into the oil and still got nothing to see, however I'm below 10PPMs iron.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: i_hate_autofraud
I didn't forget - I mentioned your Pics in the next line! LOL

Dramatic Pics too, I'd be upset if I saw that coming out of my car.
Looks like the deposits are dropping in your case! Good!

I bought a mag oil plug from the local shop, wasn't impressed and tried
Ebay where a guy had a bunch with magnets with a 6 Lb pull and extended
3/4" into the oil and still got nothing to see, however I'm below 10PPMs iron.


Guess I didn't correlate, because I don't have a 6.7L diesel. The Tacoma is a 4.0L V6, gasoline engine.

I think what I saw on the first oil change during break-in if pretty normal. This engine runs super strong and doesn't use any oil between 5K mile oil changes, so must be fine.

 

[Ausfahrt]

Originally Posted By: Malo83
Better suited on the bottom of the filter.

I agree!

 

[Yah-Tah-Hey]

Do about as much as putting magnets in your shoes. What is it about magnetic fields that gets some individuals goofy?

 

[L_Sludger]

Originally Posted By: HosteenJorje
Do about as much as putting magnets in your shoes. What is it about magnetic fields that gets some individuals goofy?

No, you are supposed to put them on your wrists, in a dual magnet bracelet. They align your magnetic fields, improve blood circulation and provide alkalinity. They also align your humors and something.

 

[Corelokt]

Where do I put them in my mattress?

 

[UncleDave]

An ISO code drop is quite a meaningful reduction.



UD

 

[Corelokt]

I actually like the idea of a magnet. Maybe a round donut type neodium one.

 

[Hall]

Originally Posted By: Malo83
Better suited on the bottom of the filter.

Depends on the mounting orientation, does it not ? This one may be mounted horizontally.

 

[HonorAndHonesty]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: i_hate_autofraud
Usually oil plugs with magnets are rather weak and don’t pick up much as I found each
time I checked mine, even under a microscope, but I’m just under 10ppm iron anyway.


If you get a really good magnetic drain plug they can capture quite a bit of ferrous material. Here's one I use in my 2005 Tacoma (4.0L V6). You can see how much lower the captured amount is after a complete break-in. I'd rather have a strong magnetic drain plug than a magnet on the side of the oil filter.





My question is this, would the oil filter not catch this if there was not a magnet? Granted it would go thru the oil pump, but i assume that a filter should catch all that. I think the magnetic drain plugs are a great idea BTW. Scary how much metal an engine makes.

 

[kohnen]

Originally Posted By: 5AcresAndAFool
My question is this, would the oil filter not catch this if there was not a magnet? Granted it would go thru the oil pump, but i assume that a filter should catch all that. I think the magnetic drain plugs are a great idea BTW. Scary how much metal an engine makes.


The stuff that collects on a magnet in the oil is most all magnetic (likely iron mostly) bits that are too small to be captured by the filter media. Oil filter media works (depending on brand and other variables) on capturing stuff in the > 15 micron or so size. If the particle is, let's say, 30 micron, it would most likely get captured by the filter (unless it happened to be caught by the magnet, this is possible). If the particle is, let's say, 2 microns or so, it will go right through the filter time and time again. If it's magnetic, it can be caught and held by the magnet.

I'm doing an experiment where I'm using a MicroGreen oil filter with magnets around it. The microgreen filter has two filters: A standard oil filtering element, and a disk at the top that filters down to 5 microns or so. I don't know how much material will be stuck to the magnets since it's quite possible that smaller particles can get trapped by the 5 micron disk filter. My filter cutter's in the mail, so we'll see in a few days. I'll post on BITOG if there's sufficient interest.

 

[HonorAndHonesty]

Originally Posted By: kohnen

I'm doing an experiment where I'm using a MicroGreen oil filter with magnets around it. The microgreen filter has two filters: A standard oil filtering element, and a disk at the top that filters down to 5 microns or so. I don't know how much material will be stuck to the magnets since it's quite possible that smaller particles can get trapped by the 5 micron disk filter. My filter cutter's in the mail, so we'll see in a few days. I'll post on BITOG if there's sufficient interest.


I myself would love to see it. I have my oil filter cutter on its way, I first cut open a filter 20 years ago or so with a hack saw, I have cut a few more open over the years with grinders and such but it was such a mess I avoided doing it, plus all the junk that got in the filter from the cutting debris made the results inconclusive to a point.

Two filters I WISH I still had to cut open were the Factory filter from my John deere with the Kohler Command Pro engine, That thing had so much junk in the first few oil changes it alarmed me. I actually talked to a tech at the dealership and showed him some oil and he didn't seem concerned and said I had plenty of warranty and if it blew up they would put a new engine on it...lol

The second is what I believe is a filter from what I am almost certain was a 20k+ OCI on my parents van.

 

[sohccammer427]

I'm sure some here have heard of Dimple magnetic drain plugs and filter magnets. I've used them on my VW Tdi and have one ready for my 1st OC on my new Dmax Colorado. They are suppose to retain their magnetic properties at much higher temps than regular magnets.

They really are super strong too. When I do an OC on the Tdi, when reinstalling the plug, it's kinda difficult to get the thing threaded because the magnet is so strong it keeps pulling the plug to the side of the bolt hole.

Not pushing them, just seem to be one of the better brands that I've seen. Dimple Magnetic Drain Plugs