Found this an interesting read - Bon-Ami being used to seat rings.
http://216.178.81.108/forums/showthread.php?t=574076
http://216.178.81.108/forums/showthread.php?t=574076
Link to Bon-Ami being used to seat rings
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You can use it to polish glass to remove scratches also.
If anybody remembers Fireball Roberts, NASCAR driver, he used it at Daytona to seat rings in a new engine before racing it. There is a picture somewhere of him shaking can into carb.
If anybody remembers Fireball Roberts, NASCAR driver, he used it at Daytona to seat rings in a new engine before racing it. There is a picture somewhere of him shaking can into carb.
This confirms my suspicion that high quality synthetic is a big mistake on a new car, especially synthetic oils like Amsoil and Red Line.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
JHZR2
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Originally Posted By: Falken
This confirms my suspicion that high quality synthetic is a big mistake on a new car, especially synthetic oils like Amsoil and Red Line.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
Then why are lots of cars shipped with top quality syn oils in them?
Do these engines have 500 miles on the dyno, get oil pulled and filled with sun when they are installed in the cars?
This confirms my suspicion that high quality synthetic is a big mistake on a new car, especially synthetic oils like Amsoil and Red Line.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
Then why are lots of cars shipped with top quality syn oils in them?
Do these engines have 500 miles on the dyno, get oil pulled and filled with sun when they are installed in the cars?
It all depends on the ring type, ring tension and the cross hatch pattern in cylinders. Yes new cars come with full synthetic oil in them, but are built for it.
its been around for a long time....Several years ago I met an engine builder who used it on army trucks just after WWII..
I just use dino for the first 1500 miles..never a problem.
Have a friend that used to rebuild radial aircraft engines. His boss did occasionally use Bon Ami to seat the rings on engines that were not breaking in properly. He said it was fairly brutal and that he personally couldn't do it, but that it did seem to work. These were large, turbo or supercharged, air-cooled aircraft engines with very different clearances, metallurgy and honing patterns than an automobile engine.
Originally Posted By: Falken
This confirms my suspicion that high quality synthetic is a big mistake on a new car, especially synthetic oils like Amsoil and Red Line.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
That was my first thought after reading his 'glazed over' comment. Personally i prefer Bar Keeper's Friend
This confirms my suspicion that high quality synthetic is a big mistake on a new car, especially synthetic oils like Amsoil and Red Line.
You don't need it to break-in, you need it to wear-in.
That was my first thought after reading his 'glazed over' comment. Personally i prefer Bar Keeper's Friend
old news/tricks from old mech that used it in the late 60s.
Just like some old mech that I talked to RE: how to fix landrover (the original one used in WWII way into the 60s), or old Ford model A, etc. where they would do their own babbit bearing wipes and tricks, etc., bon ami(abrasive cleanser) used to deglaze otherwise glazed over cylinder bore for rings to seat again, is, IMHO, so yesteryear.
It's no longer applicable to modern day engines. Those who still mesmerize on these old tricks, esp. mech who claimed that they used these tricks with success recently on modern day engine repair/rebuild, should be locked up in the dungeon (again, IMHO).
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
Q.
Just like some old mech that I talked to RE: how to fix landrover (the original one used in WWII way into the 60s), or old Ford model A, etc. where they would do their own babbit bearing wipes and tricks, etc., bon ami(abrasive cleanser) used to deglaze otherwise glazed over cylinder bore for rings to seat again, is, IMHO, so yesteryear.
It's no longer applicable to modern day engines. Those who still mesmerize on these old tricks, esp. mech who claimed that they used these tricks with success recently on modern day engine repair/rebuild, should be locked up in the dungeon (again, IMHO).
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
Q.
Google 55 Chevy break in fix for 265 SBC oil pumping when new . It was a dealer fix for the first SBC , the 265. I read that on the interweb somewhere
Google 55 Chevy break in fix for 265 SBC oil pumping when new . It was a dealer fix for the first SBC , the 265. I read that on the interweb somewhere
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/glazed-walls.81235/
"Cylinder-wall glazing is not a deposit left on the cylinder wall, but rather a displacement of cylinder-wall metal. This happens when the high spots of the cylinder wall crosshatch are not cut or worn off by the piston rings, but rather rolled over into the valleys or grooves of the crosshatch. This leaves a surface that oil adheres to poorly, against which the rings cannot seal well. Compression is lost and oil consumed, and the only cure is to tear down the engine to physically restore the cylinder-wall finish by honing."
All of these theories are very interesting, this is the essence of BITOG!
"Cylinder-wall glazing is not a deposit left on the cylinder wall, but rather a displacement of cylinder-wall metal. This happens when the high spots of the cylinder wall crosshatch are not cut or worn off by the piston rings, but rather rolled over into the valleys or grooves of the crosshatch. This leaves a surface that oil adheres to poorly, against which the rings cannot seal well. Compression is lost and oil consumed, and the only cure is to tear down the engine to physically restore the cylinder-wall finish by honing."
All of these theories are very interesting, this is the essence of BITOG!
Here is another one:
http://www.stealth316.com/2-breakin.htm
And, I don't believe a GRIII synthetic is much more than a de-waxed dino. So a lot of people who have "synthetic factory fills" just have a dino with better cold weather performance, not much more.
But, as Mechtech2 said, this is all Google research of a theory that still has some superstition to it, you just have to decide what camp you are in when you buy a brand new car.
Most people had someone else break in the engine for them, on Castrol GTX that was left there for a year and a half after the car was purchased.
Also, I have heard a rumor that many engines are broken in on an engine stand and brought through a few red line cycles. Honda does this I believe.
http://www.stealth316.com/2-breakin.htm
And, I don't believe a GRIII synthetic is much more than a de-waxed dino. So a lot of people who have "synthetic factory fills" just have a dino with better cold weather performance, not much more.
But, as Mechtech2 said, this is all Google research of a theory that still has some superstition to it, you just have to decide what camp you are in when you buy a brand new car.
Most people had someone else break in the engine for them, on Castrol GTX that was left there for a year and a half after the car was purchased.
Also, I have heard a rumor that many engines are broken in on an engine stand and brought through a few red line cycles. Honda does this I believe.
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Quest
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
The scary part is there are people that are still applying these shady tree tricks to modern engines.
Indeed. And places like these keep them going forever and ever... just like the "de-waxed" comment about Group III oils and no synth for a new engine. Hopelessly out of date and hard to kill.
Many engines are not run in at all, only some are. And rotating an engine on a stand with compressed air or a driving device is NOT like running it. It will not seat rings correctly.
Even in a modern engine the gases from combustion pressure force the ring outward to seal the bore. This happens best at larger throttle openings, in high load situations. Higher gears and full throttle operation EARLY is a hidden key to a happy engine for the long haul.
Originally Posted By: Quest
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
The scary part is there are people that are still applying these shady tree tricks to modern engines.
Indeed. And places like these keep them going forever and ever... just like the "de-waxed" comment about Group III oils and no synth for a new engine. Hopelessly out of date and hard to kill.
Many engines are not run in at all, only some are. And rotating an engine on a stand with compressed air or a driving device is NOT like running it. It will not seat rings correctly.
Even in a modern engine the gases from combustion pressure force the ring outward to seal the bore. This happens best at larger throttle openings, in high load situations. Higher gears and full throttle operation EARLY is a hidden key to a happy engine for the long haul.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Quest
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
The scary part is there are people that are still applying these shady tree tricks to modern engines.
Indeed. And places like these keep them going forever and ever... just like the "de-waxed" comment about Group III oils and no synth for a new engine. Hopelessly out of date and hard to kill.
Many engines are not run in at all, only some are. And rotating an engine on a stand with compressed air or a driving device is NOT like running it. It will not seat rings correctly.
Even in a modern engine the gases from combustion pressure force the ring outward to seal the bore. This happens best at larger throttle openings, in high load situations. Higher gears and full throttle operation EARLY is a hidden key to a happy engine for the long haul.
I was reading something about that when I bought my Focus new. I tried to do something similar to "break in" the engine.
Full load (foot to floor) on a warmed up engine from like 1500RPM to near redline.
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Quest
funny there's still lots of shade-tree mechs, backyard mechs who believes on these tricks to this day.
The scary part is there are people that are still applying these shady tree tricks to modern engines.
Indeed. And places like these keep them going forever and ever... just like the "de-waxed" comment about Group III oils and no synth for a new engine. Hopelessly out of date and hard to kill.
Many engines are not run in at all, only some are. And rotating an engine on a stand with compressed air or a driving device is NOT like running it. It will not seat rings correctly.
Even in a modern engine the gases from combustion pressure force the ring outward to seal the bore. This happens best at larger throttle openings, in high load situations. Higher gears and full throttle operation EARLY is a hidden key to a happy engine for the long haul.
I was reading something about that when I bought my Focus new. I tried to do something similar to "break in" the engine.
Full load (foot to floor) on a warmed up engine from like 1500RPM to near redline.
After 1,000 miles of gentle city driving, I do agree to floor it to red line up an on ramp once a day for a few weeks.
You are giving a superb break in like this. And if you lift a ring, now would be a great time while the car is fresh off the lot under full warranty.
But, I think most people agree on that one.
The compression gasses force themselves around the ring and puff them outwards firmly to the cylinder wall, enhancing contact to give a nice break in.
No superstition in that one. Even an owners manual for most brands says to NEVER go long distances down a highway at stable low RPM with a brand new car.
You are giving a superb break in like this. And if you lift a ring, now would be a great time while the car is fresh off the lot under full warranty.
But, I think most people agree on that one.
The compression gasses force themselves around the ring and puff them outwards firmly to the cylinder wall, enhancing contact to give a nice break in.
No superstition in that one. Even an owners manual for most brands says to NEVER go long distances down a highway at stable low RPM with a brand new car.
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