LC or ARX Maint Dose

[wn1998]

I am just about to go into the rinse phase of my 3rd application (20k since the previous ARX treatment) in my wifes 97 cavalier with 170k. Car runs great and see's a steady diet of mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum at 7k intervals.

My question is what is the better route? Use lube control at reccomended dose (which I have been doing for the last 2 years) or try the maint dose of ARX? Which option would have the greatest effect on her car?

Just on a side note, I am running the 3rd treament of auto rx just because I have had this extra bottle in my stash and I was not trying to fix any problems. The car doesn't burn or leak a drop of oil in my 7k OCI.

 

[GROUCHO MARX]

Hey, I don't think you can pick one over the other.

I like A-Rx, plenty of others prefer LC. I'm not looking to drastically extend OCIs, which I think is LC's intended function.

 

[bruce381]

niether just drian M1 or PP at 7-8K and be happy
bruce

 

[Terry]

wn1998, use high quality oil analysis to answer your own question .....definitively.

There are a myriad of regimen variations that work. I use both products as correction fluids based on testing results.

LESS LC can be used with the newer SM oil formulations as oxidation stability is improving with the newer add chemistries..

Periodic deep cleaning with RX is a safe bet regardless of oil chemistry as no oil can clean deeply, even the stuff bruce formulates!

Auto-RX in maintenance dosage levels is an untested, unverified, technique. From our observations may have little effect on sustained cleanliness. It does seem to assist in showing lower wear levels.

Untreated Pennzoil Platinum should produce lower wear values over M1 based on oil analysis results.

DysonAnalysis recieves no compensation for promotion of any product. We are strictly a independent oil analysis/tribological interpretation and consulting firm focusing primarily on automotive lubrication.

 

[bruce381]

""Periodic deep cleaning with RX is a safe bet regardless of oil chemistry as no oil can clean deeply, even the stuff bruce formulates!""

Agree BUT IMHO if a oil is changed out at correct intervals and is a quality oil to begin with, there will be very minimal debris to "deep clean" therfore no need to "deep clean" anything since there is none.
bruce

 

[TooSlick]

I'm in total agreement with Bruce...

I've tested ARX and it's very effective at cleaning up deposits in high mileage, neglected engines. Once you've cleaned the engine however, any top tier, PAO/Ester synthetic will keep the engine very clean from that time on.

There may be some benefit from periodic cleaning with AutoRX if you use conventional oils and fairly long OCI's. I'd say that practice falls under the heading of neglect and it's better to avoid the issue in the first place. Any of todays Group II petroleum basestocks will keep engines very clean with conservative, 3000-5000 mile change intervals.

TS

 

[Terry]

Bruce and Slick:

Well then, as it applies to the majority of car owners I am in complete disagreement with BOTH of you well respected gentleman.

Basing that judgement on the fact that I see many used oil analysis a week in actual oil analysis reports from actual users that really care about their cars and engines. Not abusing anything but following that worn out mantra of a good oil will cover all the bases. Thats pure poppycock from oil marketers and makers.

If that were true wear would be minimal, and engines would never loose performance measured very accurately in compression degradation,etc.

When I still tested for Auto-RX/Cycle-RX (and LC for that matter), I was shocked when we did the Cycle-RX HD motorcycle test; a well maintained V-twin using OEM oil and OEM filtration at the "proper" factory intervals showed dramatic compression gains by a third party test facility after using RX. One of many results like that. Backed by UOA.

Bruce I know that you Ford Bronco is running like the day it came off the showroom floor but I bet you have cooked a few chemical oil and fuel mods in there to get that result? The average guy here and in the real road world does not have 30 years of that kind of knowledge or access to chems.

Both you guys are very knowledgable and IMHO genuinely mean well but you have a vested interest in selling or making oil.

I just test it for the consumer who will buy it from you. Even when I work for a lube formulator I am still independent.

Sheds a whole different light on things.

LCD , I will respond to you when you respond to my last email dated 7-13-06 until then don't waste your time. I'm busy.

Terry

 

[bruce381]

""Both you guys are very knowledgable and IMHO genuinely mean well but you have a vested interest in selling or making oil.""

I could care less since I sell nothing to anyone here also read my post "if a oil is changed out at correct intervals and is a quality oil to begin with"

That means using a lab service to keep track of and to trend any problems also a GOOD oil.

and as Ted says

"I've tested ARX and it's very effective at cleaning up deposits in high mileage, neglected engines"

All true just IMHO NOT needed "if a oil is changed out at correct intervals and is a quality oil to begin with".

"Bruce I know that you Ford Bronco is running like the day it came off the showroom floor but I bet you have cooked a few chemical oil and fuel mods in there to get that result? The average guy here and in the real road world does not have 30 years of that kind of knowledge or access to chems""

For the record my bronco at 195K has a OCI of ?? whenever I think about it could be 10-20K and I use whatever is made that day nothing special tho I like >30wt DO NOY LIKE 5/20.

I do disagree here tho:

"Not abusing anything but following that worn out mantra of a good oil will cover all the bases. Thats pure poppycock from oil marketers and makers"

That may have been true years ago but is now days closer to the truth IMHO.

The days of any "additive" helping much is slipping away, base stocks and finished oils are getting very good when used and monitored correctly.

Again I'm selling nothing just my OPINION.
LOve and kisses

bruce

 

[Craig in Canada]

For what it's worth, my 1998 BMW M52 engine has always been very carefully cared for with short, synthetic OCIs (50,000km of Penzane 5W50 and 65,000km of Mobil 1 0W40) and still got a performance boost within a few hundred kms of starting ARX. While I wasn't popping plugs and measuring compression all the time, I'm putting my money on ring pack cleaning. This is the one area of cleaning that I'm not sure just "any good oil" can keep up with. For sludge, I mostly agree. Who knows, maybe a high ester oil like RL can keep the rings clean too.

Craig.

 

[buster]

I agree with bruce in that a well formulated oil shouldn't need any additives under reasonable drains. Those that are going way out past 12k miles are just taking their chances....I've known many people that said conventional oil kept their engines very clean with well over 200k on them. I know of no one that ever said M1/Amsoil left behind any sludge/deposits when performing a tear down.

 

[ARB1977]

Im not too concerned with the way my engine is performing. Ive had a steady diet of good quality synthetics since 9K with 5K changes in between and she still looks brand new under the oil cap. Untill i get a valve cover leak and need to replace the gasket ill take a closer look to see if i need autorx or not. Any veichal thats maintained properly shouldnt need this stuff. Im not saying it does not work but if its not needed why bother.

 

[LCD]

Terry.....when you get a chance check your email or PM.

Thanks!

 

[JAG]

quote:

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Originally posted by Craig in Canada:
While I wasn't popping plugs and measuring compression all the time, I'm putting my money on ring pack cleaning. This is the one area of cleaning that I'm not sure just "any good oil" can keep up with. For sludge, I mostly agree.
Craig.

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I agree. Ring packs are the only area of an otherwise clean engine that motor oil cannot keep as clean as does same oil with Auto-RX. Rings are constantly bombarded with numerous deposit forming substances from combustion. I'm a synthetic only user and an Auto-RX maintenance dose user. It worked its magic in my engine. Saw increased gas mileage and small amount of dissolved crud on oil fill cap (never did before Auto-RX). Even the rubber seal on the oil fill cap shed black debris and when whiped it got so brand-new clean and supple.