Just had to remove FRAM XG4967!

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ARCOgraphite

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I was going to run the FRAM XG on my toyota for a "longer 7-8K OCI with M1 10w30 HM, but two problems cropped up:
1) Fram XG Filter could only be tightened < 2 turns due to the concave baseplate.
2) Excessive startup noise and noisy, powerless warmed engine on the road.

The FRAM filter was in service for about 4 days, I had a BOSCH/Purolator in my used filter "evidence locker" that I put back in service. The Bosch was removed last Winter (after a couple days service) due to startup noise and VVI cam phasing issues when running M1 AFE. This filter could only be tightened bypass around the nipple threads since its a loose class 3/4"-16 UNC thread fit. No Problems with WIX51396/94 or original equipment Japan OEM Denso 90915-10003. 90915-Yzzf2 Thai denso give me NO oil pressure!? I'm done with FRAM with THIS car.
 
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Arco, I really hate to say it, but telling us that a Fram oil filter gave you a "powerless warmed engine on the road", makes you lose even more credibility.

Now Fram oil filters make you lose enough horsepower that you can feel it? ABSURD.
smirk2.gif


Did you maybe think it's the Mobil 1 HM oil? It's pretty thick with a high HT/HS viscosity for a 30 weight.

And how the heck does a Bosch oil filter create "VVI cam phasing issues"?
 
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Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Arco, I really hate to say it, but telling us that a Fram oil filter gave you a "powerless warmed engine on the road", makes you lose even more credibility.

Now Fram oil filters make you lose enough horsepower that you can feel it? ABSURD.
smirk2.gif


Did you maybe think it's the Mobil 1 HM oil? It's pretty thick with a high HT/HS viscosity for a 30 weight.

And how the heck does a Bosch oil filter create "VVI cam phasing issues"?



Stranger things HAVE happened. There isn't always an explanation for why something does something. I've seen this a few times over the years with different things.
 
I've used AFE in a 1NZ-FE, no issues, used SM rated oil, no issues, 20 weight, again, no issues. 1NZ-FE just turned 220K miles with, you guess it, no issues. You can tighten a filter < 2 turns? The filters I buy say 3/4 turn. I might have mentioned, I've had no issues with the above scenario.
 
Drew summed it up fairly well.

Your post is absurd, Arco, and you really seem like have a very loose grasp on reality.

For some reason, you WANT there to be a problem, and your imagination is creating things that aren't there.

It doesn't matter how many turns it takes to tighten a filter, as long as it is snug and doesn't leak, you're good to go.

The filter would have very little to do with a 'powerless engine', unless it completely blocked oil flow, in which case the oil light would go on. Like Drew said, maybe the oil is too thick - that could cause an engine to feel sluggish, sure.

But the filter has nothing to do with what is going on here!
 
Weird? All of the Fram XG's that I have used, have given my vehicles a super powerful, warm engine. I estimate the Fram XG gives me 10 RWHP.
 
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Drew summed it up fairly well.

Your post is absurd, Arco, and you really seem like have a very loose grasp on reality.

For some reason, you WANT there to be a problem, and your imagination is creating things that aren't there.

It doesn't matter how many turns it takes to tighten a filter, as long as it is snug and doesn't leak, you're good to go.

The filter would have very little to do with a 'powerless engine', unless it completely blocked oil flow, in which case the oil light would go on. Like Drew said, maybe the oil is too thick - that could cause an engine to feel sluggish, sure.

But the filter has nothing to do with what is going on here!
Sorry I see NO engineering or scientific (flow dynamics) explanantion from you guys. AFA tightening the filter 2 turns - I meant (and stated in previous posts) 2 turns from initial thread engagement on the nipple to 3/4 turns AFTER gasket kisses the mounting face. This is advanced engine class not childrens hour. Sorry if you cannot play.
Requirements:

- B_S in Mechanical Engineering
- Automotive engine building/repair experience
- NIASE/ASE Master
( Some qualifications not required with extensive engine building experience).
OK who is still in?
 
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Originally Posted By: D Bone
Now the Bosch on the other hand, that filter robbed 7hp easily......
This is a pressure limited VVTI engine with 40 degreess possible intake cam phasing. Oddly sensitive to oil volume flow. Does THAT make a little sense now?
 
Okay, I can't play.

Doesn't bother me - many here, like me, 'can't play' and still know your post is absolutely rediculous!

...also, you KNOW that being able to build engines doesn't mean you know squat about oil or oil filters.

Point blank - if the filter screws on the thread properly, 'fits' to the block properly, and doesn't leak or work itself loose, there is no issue. It doesn't matter how many turns that takes!
 
Originally Posted By: D Bone
Weird? All of the Fram XG's that I have used, have given my vehicles a super powerful, warm engine. I estimate the Fram XG gives me 10 RWHP.


Oh man, I just blew snot out of my nose from laughing. Now all you need is to get a Fram sticker for your car - instant 15 rwhp.
 
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Drew summed it up fairly well.

Your post is absurd, Arco, and you really seem like have a very loose grasp on reality.

For some reason, you WANT there to be a problem, and your imagination is creating things that aren't there.

It doesn't matter how many turns it takes to tighten a filter, as long as it is snug and doesn't leak, you're good to go.

The filter would have very little to do with a 'powerless engine', unless it completely blocked oil flow, in which case the oil light would go on. Like Drew said, maybe the oil is too thick - that could cause an engine to feel sluggish, sure.

But the filter has nothing to do with what is going on here!
Sorry I see NO engineering or scientific (flow dynamics) explanantion from you guys. AFA tightening the filter 2 turns - I meant (and stated in previous posts) 2 turns from initial thread engagement on the nipple to 3/4 turns AFTER gasket kisses the mounting face. This is advanced engine class not childrens hour. Sorry if you cannot play.
Requirements:

- B_S in Mechanical Engineering
- Automotive engine building/repair experience
- NIASE/ASE Master
( Some qualifications not required with extensive engine building experience).
OK who is still in?


I've met engineers who couldn't program their cell phones. Met many so called automotive experts/master techs who don't know their [censored] from a hole in the ground. Your credentials are meaningless to the subject matter at hand. You post THE MOST OUTRAGEOUS claims on this forum, and many of us have come to the point of laughing out loud at them.

If you're such a mechanical genius Arco, why not do some oil pressure testing with different oil filters to see if the pressure is different before making ludicrous claims that certain oil filters are affecting your Toyota Yaris's HP. Heck, most people don't even by into bogus claims of air filter HP differences, let alone oil filters.

Here's an explanation of perhaps why your engine felt lower on power - it's been extremely hot all over the country lately, even in the northeast. Higher ambient temps alone will lower hp. In addition, if you start getting any kind of detonation, the knock sensor will tell the ECU to pull back some timing, making engines feel sluggish. Hook up a scan gauge and show us the knock count and take other things into consideration (like ambient conditions) before coming to bizarre conclusions. I'd think someone with such "credentials" and mechanical skills would perhaps take those other things into consideration.
 
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted By: D Bone
Now the Bosch on the other hand, that filter robbed 7hp easily......
This is a pressure limited VVTI engine with 40 degreess possible intake cam phasing. Oddly sensitive to oil volume flow. Does THAT make a little sense now?


Test the oil pressure! You're using one of the thickest 10w-30 oils available; your Yaris specs GF-4 energy conserving 5w-30 oil, and might spec 5w-20 or 0w-20 at some point. Does THAT make sense as to why the variable vale timing might not be working correctly?
54.gif
 
VVT and resulting power is fine with the Bosch filter in place. SAME oil, SAME oil level, SAME ambient temps. I dont have time to make a science experimant out of this. If the filter doesnt work in the application I 86 it. Those whom own the same engine might find this info useful. Anyone wnat a slighltly used fram XG4967?
 
Quote:

This is advanced engine class not childrens hour


Yes, 100s of thousands produced and apparently only you need a bench lab, graduated cylinders, a brinell hardness tester and copper smelter to get it to work properly.

I will agree with your assessment that the engine is noticeably sluggish with thick oil, but it doesn't go beyond pumping losses.
 
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
...

Here's an explanation of perhaps why your engine felt lower on power - it's been extremely hot all over the country lately, even in the northeast. Higher ambient temps alone will lower hp. In addition, if you start getting any kind of detonation, the knock sensor will tell the ECU to pull back some timing, making engines feel sluggish. Hook up a scan gauge and show us the knock count and take other things into consideration (like ambient conditions) before coming to bizarre conclusions. I'd think someone with such "credentials" and mechanical skills would perhaps take those other things into consideration.

If you know Logic and classic Greek methods, all that "time wasting" is not required - especially if you dont have time to waste.
I made a change, performance suffered. Two Items were changed. Oil and oil filter. One was easier, less costly to reset to initial conditions. Therefore, I replaced the Oil Filter with a different brand. Car again runs well. Problem solved - FRAM XG indicted using simple logic.
 
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Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I was going to run the FRAM XG on my toyota for a "longer 7-8K OCI with M1 10w30 HM, but two problems cropped up:
1) Fram XG Filter could only be tightened < 2 turns due to the concave baseplate.
2) Excessive startup noise and noisy, powerless warmed engine on the road.

The FRAM filter was in service for about 4 days, I had a BOSCH/Purolator in my used filter "evidence locker" that I put back in service. The Bosch was removed last Winter (after a couple days service) due to startup noise and VVI cam phasing issues when running M1 AFE. This filter could only be tightened bypass around the nipple threads since its a loose class 3/4"-16 UNC thread fit. No Problems with WIX51396/94 or original equipment Japan OEM Denso 90915-10003. 90915-Yzzf2 Thai denso give me NO oil pressure!? I'm done with FRAM with THIS car.

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This funny post plus pay day made my day lmao! Oh and this is coming from a electrical engineer B_S Auburn University. I could list many more credentials...but how would you know if it's true haha.
 
All I did was simply and logically relay my real world experience with an oil filter change. Can you list all the variables which could drastically affect the engine performance on a "seemingly" simple Oil and filter change? I Dont see much logic presented here, just moronic bashing. At least drew99 tried with the K sensor - I'll give him points for that.
 
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Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite

If you know Logic and classic Greek methods, all that "time wasting" is not required - especially if you dont have time to waste.
I made a change, performance suffered. Two Items were changed. Oil and oil filter. One was easier, less costly to reset to initial conditions. Therefore, I replaced the Oil Filter with a different brand. Car again runs well. Problem solved - FRAM XG indicted using simple logic.


You changed ONE variable (and one that anyone with common sense would consider irrelevant) in a sea of variables, many of which are out of your control, such as ambient conditions, and may have made a false conclusion based on said variable. Changing one variable doesn't automatically equate to causation.

If I knew logic. Please.
crackmeup2.gif


If the Greeks had modern engines with knock sensors, with all their methods and logic you seem to desire, they wouldn't have been screwing around changing oil filters to diagnose power loss.
 
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