Japan Studies Ice Wall to Halt Radioactive Water..

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Electric generation is not an issue and won't be anytime soon. .



Flatly false if you look at every single 5 to 10 year prediction I've seen. Generation construction is well behind the curve. The grid may be a localized part of the problem on Aug 15 2013 in some areas, but its going to be generation in 5 years or less. The Texas grid is already down far enough on generation capacity that some scheduled plant outages and an unexpected deep cold front caused rolling brownouts a couple of years ago... and it was NOT a grid issue.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: PandaBear

The surges is easy to resolve. We already have smart meter and smart controller that the utility can turn on / off based on load to prevent blowing circuits.


A band-aid, again to mask the real problem. Load shedding devices are just a "rolling brownout" by a less frightening name.

Another proposed solution is to let the grid draw power FROM people's EVs when they're plugged in and there's a power shortage, then charge later on to level the load. I like that one a little better, but it would kinda suck to think you're EV is charging for a quick trip an hour later and then discover its deader than when you plugged it in.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum


Flatly false if you look at every single 5 to 10 year prediction I've seen. Generation construction is well behind the curve. The grid may be a localized part of the problem on Aug 15 2013 in some areas, but its going to be generation in 5 years or less. The Texas grid is already down far enough on generation capacity that some scheduled plant outages and an unexpected deep cold front caused rolling brownouts a couple of years ago... and it was NOT a grid issue.


I don't deal in the realm of pretend predictions. Reality is now, not the future. There is plenty of generation available to help Texas but the grid doesn't allow the delivery of the power.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: PandaBear

The surges is easy to resolve. We already have smart meter and smart controller that the utility can turn on / off based on load to prevent blowing circuits.


A band-aid, again to mask the real problem. Load shedding devices are just a "rolling brownout" by a less frightening name.



Do you call unlimited nights and weekend on cell phone plan a band-aid, and phone companies should charge more so every minutes day and nights have the same "value"?

Let's be honest here, a lot of the things we do, like using resistive heater to dry clothes, and charging a car that could be done 2 out of 12 possible evening hours, are not critical enough that would justify raising rate on everyone for. It is much easier and cheaper to just charge a lower rate for these appliance at these hours to encourage postponing their uses till later.

Quote:
Another proposed solution is to let the grid draw power FROM people's EVs when they're plugged in and there's a power shortage, then charge later on to level the load. I like that one a little better, but it would kinda suck to think you're EV is charging for a quick trip an hour later and then discover its deader than when you plugged it in.


They can do it over my dead body. Do that enough and you will kill your battery.

 

[Shannow]

I love the idea that they can draw from your car...what's the point of having a car with limited range when the grid is limiting it even further because some "scientists" use that to make the idea of EVs look more attractive.

Then there's Panda's argument.

 

[mrsilv04]

Two questions:

Why do the sloppy and short-sighted actions of the Soviet Union and Japan have to doom the use of nuclear in the United States? Don't we have sufficient government oversight of nuclear plants?

What source for electricity do the environmentalists prefer? Or do they simply want to bash all of them, in rotation, depending on whatever the is crisis at the time?

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
What source for electricity do the environmentalists prefer? Or do they simply want to bash all of them, in rotation, depending on whatever the is crisis at the time?


Pretty much so...we had the grand opening of one of the stations that I work at 20 years ago, and to get in that day, we were barricaded out by hundreds of people in orange overalls.

As fate would have it, I was back at my family's place a few weeks later, and mother was having afternoon tea with some friends, and one of her friend's daughters was there, a former classmate.

Mum asked a leading question about what Elizabeth did that was noteworthy a few weeks prior, when Elizabeth launched into a tirade about protesting out the front of a filthy abomination that should never have been built...I explained that I was one of the people that built and was running it, and quite proud of our achievement.

Long story short
Did you catch public transport ?
No, there's no public transport that far out of the way.

Did you car pool ?
No, there was no-one from my suburb going.

When you were finished, did you go home, cook a meal on a wood fire, using sustainably harvested timber from your own self managed 5 acre woodlot ?
No, we have electric cooking.

Did you go to bed when it got dark, or watch your protest on the television ?

Room got decidedly cold at about that point in time.

 

[zzyzzx]

Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
That leaking nuclear plant is gonna poison all the sea water in the whole world eventually.



Do you realize the amount of radioactive material actually coming out of that plant? It sounds like a lot of water- but it's very misleading. It's actually only very slightly radioactive. A tiny bit. And then you are diluting it in the ocean. Honestly people are such alarmists. You receive far more radiation by spending a day outside mowing the yard than you would swimming for years in the ocean with this going on.


+1

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Two questions:

Why do the sloppy and short-sighted actions of the Soviet Union and Japan have to doom the use of nuclear in the United States? Don't we have sufficient government oversight of nuclear plants?



Statistics. You take something that has 0.00000000001% risk, have 1 subtract that and you get the success and safe rate, then you have 99.99999999999999% safety record.

Then you compound that by whatever very large number, you will get a non 100% safety record.

The point is things that could happen would happen eventually, so it is important to make sure it is not catastrophic by design if possible. Current gen reactors that relies on active safety would eventually have these things happened, so it is important to focus on how to get passive safety into future design (i.e. relies on doper broadening to go out of criticality)

Quote:
What source for electricity do the environmentalists prefer? Or do they simply want to bash all of them, in rotation, depending on whatever the is crisis at the time?


Every environmentalist has his own NIMBY preference, you can never pacify every single environmentalist out there. Some like nuclear while others like hydro, solar, geo thermal, natural gas, wind, etc.

Therefore anything that reduce consumption is always the most preferred solution.