Israel claims to have destroyed two Iranian F-14s on the ground

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y_p_w

y_p_w

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Kind of sad to seem them destroyed, no matter what I think of Iran.

The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) have released footage showing precision drone strikes on two Iranian F-14 Tomcat fighter jets stationed at an airbase near Tehran. of those appears to be not operational (at least based on the state of one of the two tails). The strike, part of what the IDF described as a wider preemptive operation, was confirmed by IDF Spokesperson Brig. Gen. Effie Defrin during a press briefing.​
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@Astro14 , I watched this a couple of times. Does not look that real, unless the bombs were really small, plane did not come apart, did not seem to rock.

Could this be fake? It was shown on major media.

IF the video is reaI, don't think they would waste ordinance on it if they thought it was not a viable threat.

 
Propflux01 said:
I wonder if they were even flyable.
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A lot of belief that they've been manufacturing many of their own replacement parts and obviously cannibalizing whatever they had to get operational Tomcats. Rumors are maybe 20-25 max in flyable condition, but most suspect that it's far less than that.
 
y_p_w said:
They're still better than anything they can make themselves.
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What use is a fighter if they don’t feel comfortable using it?

When’s the last time they used them against an enemy or for air defence?

I forgot they even had an airforce the last year with what’s been going on.
 
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Just a civilian pilot said:
What use is a fighter if they don’t feel comfortable using it?

When’s the last time they used them against an enemy or for air defence?

I forgot they even had an airforce the last year with what’s been going on.
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If that were true, these Israelis would not have expended the effort to take any of them out. Clearly, the Israeli Air Force considered them to be a threat, why apportion the drones otherwise?

When you are fighting an air war, you integrate all of the component (air, ground, etc.) commander priorities into an integrated target list. You take out the critical stuff first, before moving onto the routine.

So, taking out Iran’s F 14s, along with their nuclear scientists, top commanders, and critical infrastructure for their economy, were all at the top of that integrated list of priorities.
 
Astro14 said:
If that were true, these Israelis would not have expended the effort to take any of them out. Clearly, the Israeli Air Force considered them to be a threat, why apportion the drones otherwise?

When you are fighting an air war, you integrate all of the component (air, ground, etc.) commander priorities into an integrated target list. You take out the critical stuff first, before moving onto the routine.

So, taking out Iran’s F 14s, along with their nuclear scientists, top commanders, and critical infrastructure for their economy, were all at the top of that integrated list of priorities.
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The Israel’s will not take chances with anything. It’s also a symbolic blow to Iran for Israel to take them out.

Iraq sent up fighters in the Gulf war, why hasn’t Iran?

Why didn't Iran send them up the first attack when they knew Isaral was taking out their air defence system leaving them naked?

Israel REALLY fears their missile program and nukes ( and the brains behind it ).
 
Just a civilian pilot said:
The Israel’s will not take chances with anything. It’s also a symbolic blow to Iran for Israel to take them out.

Iraq sent up fighters in the Gulf war, why hasn’t Iran?
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Again, why do this early in the conflict if it were not important?

I’ve been the creator of that target list in real combat, I know why things are done, how they are done, and the order matters because you have limited resources - you can only strike so many targets in a day.

There are many reasons to target might be on that list and there are many reasons why targets get moved to the top.

Some are symbolic.

Some are operational.

Some are political.

But mostly, operational considerations, like key enablers, critical capabilities, take the priority.
 
Astro14 said:
Again, why do this early in the conflict if it were not important?

I’ve been the creator of that target list in real combat, I know why things are done, how they are done, and the order matters because you have limited resources - you can only strike so many targets in a day.

There are many reasons to target might be on that list and there are many reasons why targets get moved to the top.

Some are symbolic.

Some are operational.

Some are political.

But mostly, operational considerations, like key enablers, critical capabilities, take the priority.
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Be honest, do you really believe Iran would send them up when Israel is attacking them, I don't.

I don't think Israel fears the Iranian airforce but they are not complacent.
 
spasm3 said:
@Astro14 , I watched this a couple of times. Does not look that real, unless the bombs were really small, plane did not come apart, did not seem to rock.

Could this be fake? It was shown on major media.

IF the video is reaI, don't think they would waste ordinance on it if they thought it was not a viable threat.

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That's infrared footage. Looks like some sort of small munition that set it on fire from above. Would they really need to blow it up to destroy it when fire can do the job?
 
Just a civilian pilot said:
Be honest, do you really believe Iran would send them up when Israel is attacking them, I don't.

I don't think Israel fears the Iranian airforce but they are not complacent.
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The reason to take the F14s out isn't specifically know.

What is known is Iran's adversary has a long list of objectives and key tasks and is limited by many things on how and when to action that long list. The F14s were at the top of the list. Why is up to debate. Maybe it is as simple as to demoralize the people that support air operations, so they give up and head to the hills and mountains, abandoning requirements that are necessary for any tactical or operational air activity, regardless of airframe.
 
Iran has been able to reverse engineer many of the parts for the airplane, they remain a formidable threat. Would the IRAF use them? Good question.

Here’s the analogy:

Your neighbor has a deer rifle. He said he will kill you. You are now at war. You have opportunity to break the deer rifle while it’s still in his living room.

Do you do that while you can?

Or wait until he brings it out and points it at you to try and shoot at it?

Only a fool would choose the latter. If you can kill the airplane while on the ground, you win the dogfight that never happened. If it does fly, maybe you win, maybe you don’t.

Again, depends on the operational objectives, the integrated priority target list, but, in general, you don’t want face a 4th generation fighter in the air, particularly if they have effectively reverse engineered it.

Iranian Air Force pilots have hundreds of kills over decades of conflict. They remain a credible threat with that airplane.

Here is a recently refitted one. They not only fly, they still have missiles, and the Iranians have had help doing the reverse engineering.

IMG_0883.webp


Air to Air refueling is a critical enabler. The IAF went after the tankers early on.
 
GON said:
The reason to take the F14s out isn't specifically know.

What is known is Iran's adversary has a long list of objectives and key tasks and is limited by many things on how and when to action that long list. The F14s were at the top of the list. Why is up to debate. Maybe it is as simple as to demoralize the people that support air operations, so they give up and head to the hills and mountains, abandoning requirements that are necessary for any tactical or operational air activity, regardless of airframe.
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But Iran knew the Israeli AF was targeting their air defences the first attack months ago and they let them do it because they didn't launch a single fighter.

Israeli jets were over Iran for hours.
 
Astro14 said:
Iran has been able to reverse engineer many of the parts for the airplane, they remain a formidable threat. Would the IRAF use them? Good question.

Here’s the analogy:

Your neighbor has a deer rifle. He said he will kill you. You are now at war. You have opportunity to break the deer rifle while it’s still in his living room.

Do you do that while you can?

Or wait until he brings it out and points it at you to try and shoot at it?

Only a fool would choose the latter. If you can kill the airplane while on the ground, you win the dogfight that never happened. If it does fly, maybe you win, maybe you don’t.

Again, depends on the operational objectives, the integrated priority target list, but, in general, you don’t want face a 4th generation fighter in the air, particularly if they have effectively reverse engineered it.

Iranian Air Force pilots have hundreds of kills over decades of conflict. They remain a credible threat with that airplane.

Here is a recently refitted one. They not only fly, they still have missiles, and the Iranians have had help doing the reverse engineering.

View attachment 285208

Air to Air refueling is a critical enabler. The IAF went after the tankers early on.
Click to expand...
Do you really believe Iran will send them up against any Israeli fighters?
 
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