Is there a SR-72 in our Future?

[wemay]

I've posted on this before. While driving my convertible at night, I saw an acute wedge shaped, twin engine plane on approach to Gwinn. It was only visible because the clouds above were illuminated by the nearby city lights. I spent hours searching for the plane, with no results. It had a smooth belly, a busy tail (flight controls and engine exhaust visible) and twin vertical stabs. I'd guess a 60° acute wedge shape. Looked hypersonic.

This might be closest, but intakes were not visible to me, and there were no wings. Just the acute wedge shape.

I did try to take pictures, and the camera would not focus at night.

fascinating.

 

[y_p_w]

Don't confuse similar shape with performance. Any country is free to copy.

I’m rather skeptical that it’s anything more than a demonstrator prototype. Over the years there have been many flying wing prototypes. But Chinese netizens are claiming is game over now and that this is a sign of a hypersonic fighter that will blow anything else away. But the Chinese aircraft industry still can’t make its own turbofans to power a civilian airliner and they’re still using Russian engines to power their latest fighter.

I’m kind of wondering how anything like this was visible during daytime unless it was meant to be seen.

There are some photos of this thing. I don’t see anything that would indicate it would carry weapons, but again, just a prototype obviously.

 

[y_p_w]

Bumping an old thread, mostly because this Chinese 6th gen "fighter" or what ever it is... Is extremely similar to what I describe that I saw years ago on approach to Gwinn airport in FL.

I observed a nearly identical wedge shaped aircraft with small twin tails and distinctly visible flight controls on approach to Gwinn some years back. The only difference would be that the plane I saw 'seemed' to have straight leading edges instead of the slight bend seen here. Even the busy trailing edge flight controls look strangely similar. We have/had at least one large twin engine jet flying well before this Chinese plane. Of course I speculate they copied us through industrial espionage.

If I were to 'cut off' the section of wing here where it angles outward a bit, and make it a perfect acute angle, that's the plane I saw.

From Ward Carroll.

 

[Owen Lucas]

Flying into outer space? I don't believe that.

This news is exposing people that don't know anything about planes and those who are shilling for the wrong team.

 

[y_p_w]

Flying into outer space? I don't believe that.

This news is exposing people that don't know anything about planes and those who are shilling for the wrong team.

I don’t know about being delusional per se, but a lot of Chinese netizens eat up anything that they can point to as China ascending and the United States falling apart.

Some are accused of being the "Wumao Army" - allegedly paid 0.5 yuan (I think the loose translation would be "five dimes") per comment where they'll fire up their VPN to post on western social media, news articles, YouTube, etc. to talk about how great China is and how bad the west (especially the United States) or any other countries have become. I participated in one place for a while and I can tell the language they use, where it almost seems like they have some sort of language guidebook. The United States is the "hegemon", and any American ally is a "vassal". They discount the strength of American military power. I've heard someone refer to American military aircraft/equipment as "grandpa weapons" (especially the F-16) because the original design is old, but don't seem to understand anything about how important modern radar and weapons are.

I've seen justifications that Russia was forced into invading Ukraine and that Russia has a righteous cause. Apparently China's military is "only defensive" and has a right to the most technologically advanced weapons, but they're offended when the Philippines hosted and then bought the Typhon missile launching system along with SM-6 Standard surface-to-air and Tomahawl cruise missiles.

 

[k1xv]

There already is, sort of, see the X-37B. The duration of it's last known mission was 908 days! It's not as maneuverable as an atmospheric aircraft such as the SR-71 but it's flight time is simply incredible and it flies high enough that most countries can't attack it.

But knowing the US Gov they will built both endospheric and exospheric craft.

"Why would we announce this instead of keeping it top secret?"

Most likely, our enemies are already aware of it so keeping it secret is pointless. Also the whole program could just be a sham and we might just want our enemies to waste money on developing weapons and counter-measures for a syst caused em that will never be flown. Sort of like General Patton's Invasion Army in 1944.

Remember the Reagan era "Star Wars" program? It caused the Soviets to spend so much money to counter act it that it caused the Soviet economy to collapse.

The SR-71 was made obsolete by spy satellites, drones, and other such technologies. There is no need for a SR72. Except, maybe, to develop and test technologies for other hypersonic aircraft.

 

[Cujet]

Flying into outer space? I don't believe that.

This news is exposing people that don't know anything about planes and those who are shilling for the wrong team.

I would never discount the performance capabilities of non American engines. We make some neat stuff, that's for sure, but this is darn capable in it's own right. Although not capable of getting that thing to space,,, this plane seems to have about 96,000 pounds of thrust in total. That's righteous for a 70 foot long plane.

The engines are supposedly 3ea of the multi-stage fan, low bypass WS10C's (or some variant) which produce 32,000 pounds thrust with AB. Because it was reverse engineered from the CFM-56 airliner engine and operated at higher temperatures and pressures, this engine is said to have a service life of 1500 hours.

By comparison to 43,000 pound thrust F135 engine, the Chinese WS10 engine looks a bit old-school.

 

[y_p_w]

I would never discount the performance capabilities of non American engines. We make some neat stuff, that's for sure, but this is darn capable in it's own right. Although not capable of getting that thing to space,,, this plane seems to have about 96,000 pounds of thrust in total. That's righteous for a 70 foot long plane.

The engines are supposedly 3ea of the multi-stage fan, low bypass WS10C's (or some variant) which produce 32,000 pounds thrust with AB. Because it was reverse engineered from the CFM-56 airliner engine and operated at higher temperatures and pressures, this engine is said to have a service life of 1500 hours.

By comparison to 43,000 pound thrust F135 engine, the Chinese WS10 engine looks a bit old-school.

There's been a lot of talk about it, where it's been assumed that they don't have the metallurgy skills (the secret sauce) yet to make single-crystal alloys in full-scale production. But regardless of that, it may have a lot to do with basic designs.

There was talk about the WS-15 being in full production several years ago, but it's not even today. And the CJ-1000A engine that they were supposed to have ready today for their C919 airliner may not be ready for 10 years. I've heard claims that the CFM LEAP-1C engines they're using today may be an older technology with the name slapped on.

 

[Cujet]

There's been a lot of talk about it, where it's been assumed that they don't have the metallurgy skills (the secret sauce) yet to make single-crystal alloys in full-scale production. But regardless of that, it may have a lot to do with basic designs.

Single crystal blades are not that difficult to make, and the process is well known. The advantages in creep reduction are remarkable. But the alloy in use remains similar, and erosion problems are not mitigated by such long structural life blades. Blade life has as much to do with the design of the engine as it does with engine management. In the case of very high temperature mil engines, blade coatings and cooling airflow play a big role. I find it interesting that some new engines are clearly 'white' inside the hot section, when new.

 

[burbguy82]

Wasn't the purpose of the 71 to spy before satellite images became a thing.

And to show American dominance, IMHO

It takes some serious doing to maintain those types of speeds, safely.

 

[y_p_w]

Single crystal blades are not that difficult to make, and the process is well known. The advantages in creep reduction are remarkable. But the alloy in use remains similar, and erosion problems are not mitigated by such long structural life blades. Blade life has as much to do with the design of the engine as it does with engine management. In the case of very high temperature mil engines, blade coatings and cooling airflow play a big role. I find it interesting that some new engines are clearly 'white' inside the hot section, when new.

I believe the claim is that they can withstand higher temperatures that help with supercruise.

Reports are that their yields are really low though. But overall they’ve been acting as if they’d catch up in a few years. But they always seem to be five years away from being five years away.

I do get a kick out of all the “academic research” coming out of China about their supposed military technologies and/advantages. Like one research paper claiming that China would “conservatively” win about 95% of its air combat engagements against the United States. Or a supposed breakthrough in afterburner technology that would increase efficiency from 90% to maybe 99%. Many they ate that up, but didn’t seem to understand that using an afterburner in and of itself is going to be a ticket to running out of fuel in a hurry, whether or not a little bit of extra performance can be wrung out.

 

[edyvw]

The airplane flew in an area where everyone could take a photo of it.
Enough for me.

 

[y_p_w]

The airplane flew in an area where everyone could take a photo of it.
Enough for me.

There was a big deal about the first sighting of the B-21 in Palmdale. However, that was a publicly announced project where Northrop Grumman had this big unveiling.

 

[edyvw]

There was a big deal about the first sighting of the B-21 in Palmdale. However, that was a publicly announced project where Northrop Grumman had this big unveiling.

Whatever this airplane is, it is stunt for domestic audience.

 

[y_p_w]

Whatever this airplane is, it is stunt for domestic audience.

Yeah. I get that it was meant to be seen. I had a brief look at one news site that still has comments attached to articles, along with a lot of pro-China posters. And also YouTube comments on videos about these new aircraft. They are just eating it up and claiming that it's western sore losers who don't acknowledge that China will wipe everyone off the map with their military technology.

 

[edyvw]

Yeah. I get that it was meant to be seen. I had a brief look at one news site that still has comments attached to articles, along with a lot of pro-China posters. And also YouTube comments on videos about these new aircraft. They are just eating it up and claiming that it's western sore losers who don't acknowledge that China will wipe everyone off the map with their military technology.

That is how Russians have done for the last 80 years. That is how every autocratic regime does it. It is all about the perception of power.
Sluggish economy, horrible real estate market etc. you need some good news.

 

[vavavroom]

I've posted on this before. While driving my convertible at night, I saw an acute wedge shaped, twin engine plane on approach to Gwinn. It was only visible because the clouds above were illuminated by the nearby city lights. I spent hours searching for the plane, with no results. It had a smooth belly, a busy tail (flight controls and engine exhaust visible) and twin vertical stabs. I'd guess a 60° acute wedge shape. Looked hypersonic.

This might be closest, but intakes were not visible to me, and there were no wings. Just the acute wedge shape.

I did try to take pictures, and the camera would not focus at night.

Out of focus, motion blur, and poor resolution combined with severe under or overexposure merely add to the mystique and intrigue of stills and footage. Everyone uses a potato for recording Bigfoot, the thylocine, UFOs, and Elvis at 7-Eleven. With a cellphone, preset focus to infinity to be prepared for a Time Magazine cover shot. Well, if you have an iPhone you don't get infinity lock. So much for that garbage.

 

[andrewg]

I think a few on here are dangerously underestimating the recent advancements in Chinese technology. Not something we should be doing.

 

[edyvw]

I think a few on here are dangerously underestimating the recent advancements in Chinese technology. Not something we should be doing.

There is a difference on technological leap forward and PR stunt.
When you want to surprise enemy, you don’t fly over your barley riveted product over cities.

 

[andrewg]

There is a difference on technological leap forward and PR stunt.
When you want to surprise enemy, you don’t fly over your barley riveted product over cities.

The Chinese are 100% a nation to be concerned about. They went from 1978 when bicycles were the most popular form of transportation to an unprecedented modernization program where they have become a modern world economic power. Militarily the Chinese have the world's largest Navy (370 surface ships and submarines). According to the Alliance for American Manufacturing the Chinese have a ship building capacity over 230 times greater than the U.S. And they have been steadily taking over the South China Sea and building military bases in that region. They have been securing resources globally. They are ahead of us on hypersonic strike capabilities. To say that this recent 6th generation aircraft is just a "PR stunt" is risky to say the least.