Is castrol edge 0w30 too thin for gx390 powerwash?
- Thread starter kilgore
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Your engine calls for conventional 10W30 or 30 weight. Synthetic 0W30 will be fine, although if I was buying oil at a store I'd be inclined to buy 10W30 synthetic before I would 0W30.
It's too thin. The engine is air cooled, and runs fairly hot under load. I have a GX390 pressure washer and oil temp is 250 or so. Far above the test protocol for the "30" in your 0W-30.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operates.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operates.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
Cool
But now im wondering about the pump oil.
Ive been reading that some gear oils have sulfur that reacts badly with moisture. I hope the mobil1 doesnt.
Why would john deee spec a briggs and stratton synthetic gear oil. The pump is AR and engine honda lol.
But now im wondering about the pump oil.
Ive been reading that some gear oils have sulfur that reacts badly with moisture. I hope the mobil1 doesnt.
Why would john deee spec a briggs and stratton synthetic gear oil. The pump is AR and engine honda lol.
Originally Posted By: Cujet
It's too thin. The engine is air cooled, and runs fairly hot under load. I have a GX390 pressure washer and oil temp is 250 or so. Far above the test protocol for the "30" in your 0W-30.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operat4es.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
+1 Absolutely Amsoil ASE Formula 4stroke 10w30/30 Small Engine Oil would be my first pick and has been for few years in my Honda powerwasher.
It's too thin. The engine is air cooled, and runs fairly hot under load. I have a GX390 pressure washer and oil temp is 250 or so. Far above the test protocol for the "30" in your 0W-30.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operat4es.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
+1 Absolutely Amsoil ASE Formula 4stroke 10w30/30 Small Engine Oil would be my first pick and has been for few years in my Honda powerwasher.
Originally Posted By: Cujet
It's too thin. The engine is air cooled, and runs fairly hot under load. I have a GX390 pressure washer and oil temp is 250 or so. Far above the test protocol for the "30" in your 0W-30.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operates.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
It's too thin. The engine is air cooled, and runs fairly hot under load. I have a GX390 pressure washer and oil temp is 250 or so. Far above the test protocol for the "30" in your 0W-30.
Furthermore, most 0W oils have too low an HTHS for air cooled engines. In other words, viscosity above 100C is too thin. Exactly where this thing operates.
Use an oil with good HTHS numbers.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
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The owner's manual of the LPG GX390 recommends SJ SAE30 and mentions by name Pennzoil HD30, Valvoline HPO 30, Castrol HD 30. Honda also recommends synthetic 5w-30 for starting under 32F (0C) but recommends AGAINST 5w-30 synthetic when air temperatures are above 32F.
http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/engines/pdf/manuals/31ZK6601.pdf
The latest version owner's manual for the gasoline engine recommends SJ 10w-30, with alternatives 5w-30 for cooler weather and SAE30 for hotter.
http://engines.honda.com/parts-and-support/owners-manuals/GX390
I would do the same thing in MA as I do in MD for my pressure washer, run SAE30 from Spring to Fall and drain the pump and put it away for the Winter.
http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/engines/pdf/manuals/31ZK6601.pdf
The latest version owner's manual for the gasoline engine recommends SJ 10w-30, with alternatives 5w-30 for cooler weather and SAE30 for hotter.
http://engines.honda.com/parts-and-support/owners-manuals/GX390
I would do the same thing in MA as I do in MD for my pressure washer, run SAE30 from Spring to Fall and drain the pump and put it away for the Winter.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
I understand your point, however here is a quote from Gokan that explains the situation a bit:
"Also, ASTM-test authors found that HTHS viscosity at 150 C is not the only thing that is important for bearing protection but also the viscosity of the base oil is equally important. They say that less the SUS @ 100 F (such as 100N oil), more the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings, or conversely more the SUS @ 100 F (such as 200N or 350N oil), less the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings. See Page 5 of this white paper.
https://books.google.com/books?id=chx8Sw...p;q&f=false
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it."
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
I understand your point, however here is a quote from Gokan that explains the situation a bit:
"Also, ASTM-test authors found that HTHS viscosity at 150 C is not the only thing that is important for bearing protection but also the viscosity of the base oil is equally important. They say that less the SUS @ 100 F (such as 100N oil), more the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings, or conversely more the SUS @ 100 F (such as 200N or 350N oil), less the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings. See Page 5 of this white paper.
https://books.google.com/books?id=chx8Sw...p;q&f=false
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it."
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Originally Posted By: Cujet
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Just how fast do you expect him to be driving his Honda powered pressure washer?
150C? You do realize this is an AIR COOLED engine, right?
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Just how fast do you expect him to be driving his Honda powered pressure washer?
150C? You do realize this is an AIR COOLED engine, right?
The gun thrust is less than 15lbs so with a pair of skates I could drive it till i runout of garden hoses or hit a slight uphill.
I rushed to change the oil just before I let a friend borrow it and then i thought about it and posted here lol.
I rushed to change the oil just before I let a friend borrow it and then i thought about it and posted here lol.
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
I understand your point, however here is a quote from Gokan that explains the situation a bit:
"Also, ASTM-test authors found that HTHS viscosity at 150 C is not the only thing that is important for bearing protection but also the viscosity of the base oil is equally important. They say that less the SUS @ 100 F (such as 100N oil), more the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings, or conversely more the SUS @ 100 F (such as 200N or 350N oil), less the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings. See Page 5 of this white paper.
https://books.google.com/books?id=chx8Sw...p;q&f=false
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it."
Why do you want to talk about kinematic viscosity at 100F when the issue is dynamic viscosity at 250F? Any oil will protect the bearings at 100F. HTHS is more relevant than SUS @100F in this instance. That's the whole point of the HTHS specification: bearing protection at high temperature and high operating stress. GC will not go through a dip in viscosity at 250F, and get thicker again at 300F. Viscosity drops steadily with increasing operating temperature, and a higher VI oil will drop less than a lower VI oil.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it.
I understand your point, however here is a quote from Gokan that explains the situation a bit:
"Also, ASTM-test authors found that HTHS viscosity at 150 C is not the only thing that is important for bearing protection but also the viscosity of the base oil is equally important. They say that less the SUS @ 100 F (such as 100N oil), more the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings, or conversely more the SUS @ 100 F (such as 200N or 350N oil), less the critical lowest HTHS viscosity required to protect the bearings. See Page 5 of this white paper.
https://books.google.com/books?id=chx8Sw...p;q&f=false
Therefore, there is no point in looking for a high-HTHS-viscosity 5W-30. Simply go to 5W-40 if you are doing high-speed driving and need more bearing protection. High HTHS viscosity alone is not sufficient -- you also need higher SAE viscosity, as your oil temperature hardly ever reaches 150 C.
Castrol 0w30 EF has an HTHS of 3.5, which is higher than almost any 30-weight. An oil temp of 250F is no problem for it."
Why do you want to talk about kinematic viscosity at 100F when the issue is dynamic viscosity at 250F? Any oil will protect the bearings at 100F. HTHS is more relevant than SUS @100F in this instance. That's the whole point of the HTHS specification: bearing protection at high temperature and high operating stress. GC will not go through a dip in viscosity at 250F, and get thicker again at 300F. Viscosity drops steadily with increasing operating temperature, and a higher VI oil will drop less than a lower VI oil.
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And about the paper: That's a paper from 1977, and even though it's old, it's very interesting. This is from the era when they were researching the effect of various VII's on temporary and long-term shear. Even though their observation that oils that started out with thicker base oils performed better for shear, that's an observation of oils available 38 years ago. But Castrol 0w30 is far advanced over those oils. It has a temporary shear ratio of .92, which is right up there with the best of 5w30's, and within about 5% of the best 10w30's.
That era was when they didn't get why the multigrades of the day didn't perform up to their viscosity grades.
Much research, then into high shear rate viscometry, and finally HTHS was included.
Funnily in regard to this discussion, the 0W, 5W, and 10W 40s only had an HTHS minimum of 2.9, exactly the same are the xW30 minimum.
It wasn't until much, much later than HTHS became a grade minimum that the 40s HAD to out perform the 30s HTHS wise.
Much research, then into high shear rate viscometry, and finally HTHS was included.
Funnily in regard to this discussion, the 0W, 5W, and 10W 40s only had an HTHS minimum of 2.9, exactly the same are the xW30 minimum.
It wasn't until much, much later than HTHS became a grade minimum that the 40s HAD to out perform the 30s HTHS wise.
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