Interesting comments from one of my former students on housing

[edyvw]

Anyone in America can own their own home and the proof is, in much of the country they cant build them fast enough, though a lot of this is catching up from the lack of construction due to covid.

Not true.
20% of homes last month were bought buy investors.
in Summit County, 3 years ago Vail Resorts pretty much bought anything that was available for sale, priced out any individual, got themselves into hot water bcs. well, workers cannot now afford to live there etc.
There is a demand, the question is: who are the buyers that are driving demand?

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Very concerned with what I see getting thrown up in a hurry. In 2002 when I was setting foot in new construction homes the quality was not fantastic, but was quite fair. They are using even cheaper disposable concealed stuff that cannot be replaced. Most notable a HVAC duct solution called Rheia. Its an octopus of some kind of flex pipes that are certainly not "Lifetime" this material will fail at some point and it will become non replaceable. Where the ducts get routed you would essentially need to gut your entire home down to studs to gain access to this.

Also has anyone seen the recent quality of construction grade cabinets, counter tops, plumbing fixtures, appliances, fans, windows, and doors. Utterly disgusting.

Most Residential HVAC contractors who have pride in their work have stopped using fiberglass ductboard as "ductwork". This is telling. They say the stuff just falls apart after 15 years or so. Think how many attics are being partially air-conditioned across the United States today from 30+ years of ductboard supply and return plenums being used.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Here in South Carolina years ago the legislature passed a law that owner occupied primary residential properties were exempt from paying county school taxes. The state pays the local schools per student, and the county is free to tax any other property - non owner occupied. The logic was to not allow the county get out of control on property taxes.

Our county is now run by fools. They won't permit single family homes anymore, but they are permitting lots and lots of rental apartments - because they can tax those.

Yes, I am moving. The only reason I haven't left yet is I have one left in college, and her nor her sister know where there going yet. Depending where they go I might follow, or I may just move to a different county.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

I need to follow-up with my city council agenda notes, but they recently met to talk about a rezoning proposal in an area very close to my house to pack in more people via reducing minimum square footage per person, and increasing allowable floors.

This is going on in every single municipality across the country.

 

[cptbarkey]

This has less to do with increasing affordable housing, and more to do with political tricks that can’t be discussed on this board. There’s nothing honorable about their intentions here.

I happen to be blessed to live in an area that is exploding with growth which is ignoring doom and gloom predictions, where even the city council is attempting to give itself $1 per year per population. This is what was magnetized to my front garage door by somebody. I just bought a blink outdoor camera system so they better wave next time.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

I happen to be blessed to live in an area that is exploding with growth which is ignoring doom and gloom predictions, where even the city council is attempting to give itself $1 per year per population. This is what was magnetized to my front garage door by somebody. I just bought a blink outdoor camera system so they better wave next time.

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I think those are pretty legit concerns. You should at least go and hear both sides, since one way or the other it will soon be affecting your life.

 

[PimTac]

I think those are pretty legit concerns. You should at least go and hear both sides, since one way or the other it will soon be affecting your life.

True. I cannot imagine having a multi family building next to your single family home will increase the value. The opposite is probably true. Once the plans are approved it’s too late. The buyer must perform their due diligence and the seller should disclose any planned developments in order to avoid legal issues later on.

 

[CKN]

Here's the property. The craziest thing is, this is a great deal. I doubt we will win the bidding war.
The reason is is so low is, it is in a 55+ community.

It's my experience even under the current conditions resales of 55plus are priced a little lower than what get be purchased outside of these neighborhoods.

 

[CKN]

I think those are pretty legit concerns. You should at least go and hear both sides, since one way or the other it will soon be affecting your life.

It sounds like they want to build property people can actually afford.....

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

It sounds like they want to build property people can actually afford.....

Being able to afford something and wanting to actually live there are two different things.

I get your point, but there is plenty of red tape involved with housing already. We don't need more political interference, we need less. Remember, we didn't have the bubble of '08 until those that don't know or understand got involved in things way over their heads to "make things affordable".... and here we are 15 years later (20 years after it became "law") and housing is 400%+ what it was before they dug their grimy hands into somebody else's sandbox.

 

[CKN]

This is the thing. They are changing zoning laws everywhere. It’s not a specific locality but a mandate from higher up. This is happening in all kinds of neighborhoods and areas.

True story. A elderly woman lives about a block away from my brother in a single family neighborhood in Tacoma that is well established. The house next to her went up for sale and it sold quickly. Instead of a new neighbor the house was demolished and the property graded. A four story apartment building went in. Now this lot was not big. It’s a smaller size city lot. The new building covers the entire lot so the residents have to park on the street. This new building also cut off all the sunlight to the elderly woman’s house. Her small garden and fruit tree are useless now. In addition the residents are noisy and toss trash into her yard. They don’t care.

These are sprouting up everywhere.

So building condos that are are affordable compared to single family housing is not a good thing if it's in your neighborhood?
Was the lot next to the lady zoned multiple housing already?

 

[Dave Hess]

It is a circular problem. People migrate to where the better paying jobs are which increases housing demand, which forces employers to increase wages.

I am working on an 1100 sq ft, 2/2, small lot home, OK area; asking price $575K. Offered $590K. Crazy.
In Silicon Valley proper, that would be $1.5M easily. In a better area, maybe $2M.

I would rather have a much smaller, older $575K house in a nice neighborhood than a much bigger house in a terrible area with high crime and drugs.

Buying a $575K McMansion in a bad part of Houston is not a good idea….. especially if the TV show First 48 is filming in your neighborhood and city medical examiner is removing a dead body from the street.


I gave each of my adult children $70K cash to help with down payment so they can buy a house in a nicer neighborhood. I don’t want them to deal with the problems of lower income areas and have to worry about their safety.

 

[CKN]

Being able to afford something and wanting to actually live there are two different things.

I get your point, but there is plenty of red tape involved with housing already. We don't need more political interference, we need less. Remember, we didn't have the bubble of '08 until those that don't know or understand got involved in things way over their heads to "make things affordable".... and here we are 15 years later (20 years after it became "law") and housing is 400%+ what it was before they dug their grimy hands into somebody else's sandbox.

The market today doesn't reflect what happened in '08.

 

[ripcord]

In Tacoma, you don't move to ghetto, the ghetto moves to you.

 

[Fitter30]

Very concerned with what I see getting thrown up in a hurry. In 2002 when I was setting foot in new construction homes the quality was not fantastic, but was quite fair. They are using even cheaper disposable concealed stuff that cannot be replaced. Most notable a HVAC duct solution called Rheia. Its an octopus of some kind of flex pipes that are certainly not "Lifetime" this material will fail at some point and it will become non replaceable. Where the ducts get routed you would essentially need to gut your entire home down to studs to gain access to this.

Also has anyone seen the recent quality of construction grade cabinets, counter tops, plumbing fixtures, appliances, fans, windows, and doors. Utterly disgusting.

Rheia looks like commercial high pressure uninsulated flex duct but a lighter grade. Can't imagine the duct static pressure there must be. But have seen rectangle duct made from fiberglass and high density foam board where it starts to separate in 10-15 years.

 

[SC Maintenance]

So building condos that are are affordable compared to single family housing is not a good thing if it's in your neighborhood?
Was the lot next to the lady zoned multiple housing already?

Affordable for whom? If you cram more people into the same area without expanding the infrastructure first, everyone else around pays for those the couldn't "afford" it before both in terms of hard costs (new bonds for infrastructure and higher taxes to pay for it) and soft costs, traffic, lack of parking, etc. Its not more affordable, just someone else doing the paying.

 

[Pew]

Every little piece of land here has been bought up by some sort of developer - usually DR Horton. On my ride to work, virgin, large abandoned lots, and anything with grass has development now.

Here's one development by a train stop I pass.

All of this is new within the past 3 years:

Very concerned with what I see getting thrown up in a hurry. In 2002 when I was setting foot in new construction homes the quality was not fantastic, but was quite fair. They are using even cheaper disposable concealed stuff that cannot be replaced. Most notable a HVAC duct solution called Rheia. Its an octopus of some kind of flex pipes that are certainly not "Lifetime" this material will fail at some point and it will become non replaceable. Where the ducts get routed you would essentially need to gut your entire home down to studs to gain access to this.

Also has anyone seen the recent quality of construction grade cabinets, counter tops, plumbing fixtures, appliances, fans, windows, and doors. Utterly disgusting.

I love in a townhouse developed by Cemtex around 2004 and it's 100% cheap. Cabinets are cheap, those Rheia ducts are used, low freq noises travel through the floor (but it's hard to hear a vacuum.) The best thing about this place's construction is the Lennox AC/furnace and Whirlpool dish washer and fridge is still original. ~1300sqft one story and it goes for $230k

 

[JTK]

You're really depressing the heck out of me @GON

If this all holds true, I'll have 4 kids that will never be able to fly the coop.

 

[CKN]

Affordable for whom? If you cram more people into the same area without expanding the infrastructure first, everyone else around pays for those the couldn't "afford" it before both in terms of hard costs (new bonds for infrastructure and higher taxes to pay for it) and soft costs, traffic, lack of parking, etc. Its not more affordable, just someone else doing the paying.

Yep-your argument is classic "NIMBY".

 

[SC Maintenance]

You're really depressing the heck out of me @GON

If this all holds true, I'll have 4 kids that will never be able to fly the coop.

4 is tough. We currently own our home, and were hoping to purchase another before the current price ramp as a vacation home, and also so we could leave our two children a home each. My goal was to give my children college degrees (check on one, almost on 2) with no debt (I made them take a little because I want them to feel the pain of paying it back, so they don't do it again, but I paid for most, and they also got nice scholarships), instructions to max their 401K or IRA when they start their first job, and leave both a home when we die.

My thought is with a college education, retirement plan and shelter, if they screw their lives up from there its on them. I hope I get to home number 2 still.