Ice dams? Water flowing behind gutters

[JHZR2]

Obviously it has been a pretty harsh winter, and to make things worse, we routinely have freeze-thaw cycles where it will go into the high 30's or low 40s during the day, then low 20s at night. Good recipe for ice.

My home has an upper roof, then a lower roof on the front and back of the house. The upper roof drains onto the lower roof, which then drains to the ground and flows away from the house.

Today we had near a foot of snow, but it has changed to rain. It is 36F currently, so water is falling from the sky and onto the snow/roof. Im noticing that the upper roof, at the corners (its a four-sided roof) tend to drip, and the drip at one of the corners is actually coming from behind the gutter (like leaking where the gutter attaches to the flashed eave end, and I suppose under the shingle overhang into the gutter). The roofs have eaves, so this water drips about 1.5 feet from the side of the house/wall/siding. There is no water on the siding of the house, so there is none that is flowing in/on the house... Yet at least... And I guess the upper eaves stick further out than the lower roof/eaves, so the water goes straight to the ground. Which I guess is good.

No indication whatsoever of any water ingress into the house. The roofs and gutters all drain well during the year, and are clean of debris. I know that the downspout from the lower roof that is right near this dripping is about half frozen (only half of the inner area is open to flow water). Water is flowing through the non-frozen area.

The area of interest faces south/west so gets the strongest sun, FWIW. But my main issue is that water is dripping BEHIND the gutter - there are NO icicles anywhere on the house, and I don't see any water dripping over the front edge. there is ice in the downspouts but they are all somewhat clear and I do see water coming out.

Diagnosis? What can I do? Is this indicative of an ice dam?

 

[cjcride]

Sounds like it. Apparently if the roofers did the job right you should be OK is what I heard.

Running the heat too high could contribute to more melt at the base of the ice/snow which could work it's way back up the underneath of the shingles at the roof edge.

 

[Fastmover]

From what you describe I'd say you're fine and do not have an ice dam. When you have an ice dam you'll see a thick ice build-up along the edge of the roof (1-3" thick). You'll also see a lot of icicles. Rain or melting snow will make it's way through the snow, flow down the roof, hit the ice dam and back up under the shingles. Ice dams are caused by inadequate attic insulation (you experience heat loss that warms the roof and melts snow) as well as inadequate soffit ventilation. Your attic temps should be as cold as the outside air.

Your gutter may be full of ice and snow so the water has to get down somehow and some of it may be finding its way behind the gutter.

 

[JHZR2]

Here is an online image of an ice dam from gutterguys.com

And here is my doctored image to clarify...

 

[Donald]

I do not believe you have an ice dam.

Some people put heat tape in down spouts.

 

[MNgopher]

It does not sound like an ice dam. Sounds more like water is leaking between the gutter and the fascia, and then wicking back a few inches under the eave. So long as this is not happening all the time, I wouldn't worry about it. Sounds more like the gutter is temporarily clogged up with some ice and snow.

I often have the same thing occur on my south facing porch when you get the weather conditions described.

Clue number one it isn't an ice dam is the lack of icicles.

 

[Doog]

I had the same issue that caused $3k in damage. I installed a heat cable after the damage. But if you want a temporary fix here is what I learned along the way:

1. Get a pair of womens panty hose and cut off the legs
2. Go buy 2 5lb containers of calcium chloride ice melter at Walmart
3. Stuff each leg with calcium chloride and tie off open end in a knot.
4. Throw each stuffed "leg" on the roof hanging perpendicular over the gutter about 6". The calcium chloride will melt a hole in the ice dam and allow the backed up water to escape and you wont get a leak.

Sounds ridiculous but a roofer with 30 years in the trade taught me this. It is how he buys time to wait until Spring to repair leaks.

This is the stuff:

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Morton-Safe-T-Power-Calcium-Chloride-9lb/16213286

 

[Doog]

I finally had an electrician fit a dedicated line in conduit up to the eave with a GFI breaker in the house electrical panel in the basement. I also added an on/off switch inside as well. Then I installed a heat cable that has a thermostat that turns it on/off at 30-38 degrees so it will melt a series of criss crossed drain holes across the roof and in the gutter. No more ice dams.

I stopped home at lunch today...the cable is working fine.

 

[Doog]

Also, I have "ice guard" rubberized wrap under my shingles but there was so much water building up it went past the ice guard which goes up 6 feet

The first time I melted a hole in the ice dam with the roofer helping about 75-100 gallons of water came shooting out and completely soaked the guy while he was standing on a ladder.

He looked at me and said..."I told you there was a lot of water under the snow." Then got in his truck and went home.