HPL Manual Transmission Life

[hemioiler]

I sent a request to HPL to order some fluid for my transfer case, I mentioned it was a "borg warner 44-44/48-11", the "auto" transfer case in a Ram 1500. I didn't know if they had any fluid for this application so that's why I mentioned what it was going into, rather than asking for a specific HPL product.

They ended up shipping some stuff to me which included the "HPL Manual Transmission Life, SAE 75w" which I'm assuming is for the transfer case. The other stuff I ordered was engine oil (clearly labeled as such) and two quarts of "differential life" which I asked for as well for the front diff (rear diff currently has amsoil severe gear).

So; does anyone know more about the manual transmission life product and if thats the right fluid for my transfer case? Figured I'd ask here first before wasting the time of the fine folks at HPL.

 

[MolaKule]

@hemioiler The HP MTL series was designed specifically as an MTF fluid but I don't see why it could not also be used in a transfer case.

I would assume they researched the fluid specs in terms of viscosity and additive package as a replacement.

 

[The Lube Guy]

I sent a request to HPL to order some fluid for my transfer case, I mentioned it was a "borg warner 44-44/48-11", the "auto" transfer case in a Ram 1500. I didn't know if they had any fluid for this application so that's why I mentioned what it was going into, rather than asking for a specific HPL product.

They ended up shipping some stuff to me which included the "HPL Manual Transmission Life, SAE 75w" which I'm assuming is for the transfer case. The other stuff I ordered was engine oil (clearly labeled as such) and two quarts of "differential life" which I asked for as well for the front diff (rear diff currently has amsoil severe gear).

So; does anyone know more about the manual transmission life product and if thats the right fluid for my transfer case? Figured I'd ask here first before wasting the time of the fine folks at HPL.

For that transfer case buy HPL Blue ATF CC (Cold Climate). It has the correct additive package, viscosity range, and base oil (PAO, for good cold flow) ) for your transfer case. I use it in a Borg Warner 44-44 (2016 RAM 1500, 5.7 HEMI) with great results. It's a shift-on-demand system with a clutch connecting the front drive shaft. Don't waste your time with MTF or MobilFluid LT, this ATF works the best.

 

[4WD]

I sent a request to HPL to order some fluid for my transfer case, I mentioned it was a "borg warner 44-44/48-11", the "auto" transfer case in a Ram 1500. I didn't know if they had any fluid for this application so that's why I mentioned what it was going into, rather than asking for a specific HPL product.

They ended up shipping some stuff to me which included the "HPL Manual Transmission Life, SAE 75w" which I'm assuming is for the transfer case. The other stuff I ordered was engine oil (clearly labeled as such) and two quarts of "differential life" which I asked for as well for the front diff (rear diff currently has amsoil severe gear).

So; does anyone know more about the manual transmission life product and if thats the right fluid for my transfer case? Figured I'd ask here first before wasting the time of the fine folks at HPL.

What’s FF on those ?

 

[hemioiler]

What’s FF on those ?

I'm not sure what you're asking?

 

[hemioiler]

For that transfer case buy HPL Blue ATF CC (Cold Climate). It has the correct additive package, viscosity range, and base oil (PAO, for good cold flow) ) for your transfer case. I use it in a Borg Warner 44-44 (2016 RAM 1500, 5.7 HEMI) with great results. It's a shift-on-demand system with a clutch connecting the front drive shaft. Don't waste your time with MTF or MobilFluid LT, this ATF works the best.

I appreciate the info. How did you come to that conclusion that the Blue ATF would work best in the transfer case? Just curious as to why HPL would ship the MTF then.

 

[4WD]

I'm not sure what you're asking?

Factory fill

 

[hemioiler]

Factory fill

This is what I picked up from the dealer originally:

 

[The Lube Guy]

I appreciate the info. How did you come to that conclusion that the Blue ATF would work best in the transfer case? Just curious as to why HPL would ship the MTF then.

The original factory fill is MobilFluid LT, which is what Mopar sells in those overpriced transfer case fluid quart bottles. MobilFluid LT is terrible for the clutch inside that transfer case. Every other manufacturer, except RAM, uses TES 389, TES 295, or Dexron III compatible fluid. Well, HPL ATF Blue is TES 668, TES 295, and TES 389 compatible. It uses the #1 Infineum add pack for step-shift automatic transmissions. With this fluid, your clutch pack won't overheat even under the most demanding off-road or winter driving conditions. I've seen plenty of these transfer cases burn out the clutch pack using MobilFluid LT. More Mopar wisdom, I suppose.

 

[MolaKule]

For that transfer case buy HPL Blue ATF CC (Cold Climate). It has the correct additive package, viscosity range, and base oil (PAO, for good cold flow) ) for your transfer case. I use it in a Borg Warner 44-44 (2016 RAM 1500, 5.7 HEMI) with great results. It's a shift-on-demand system with a clutch connecting the front drive shaft. Don't waste your time with MTF or MobilFluid LT, this ATF works the best.

That is the fluid I am using in my 2012 Nissan Frontier transfer case as it requires a 7.3 cSt @100C fluid.

HPL must believe the OEM fluid had a 6.3 cSt spec @100C.

 

[The Lube Guy]

HPL must believe the OEM fluid had a 6.3 cSt spec @100C.

My apologies, I don't understand this last part. Thank you.

 

[MolaKule]

My apologies, I don't understand this last part. Thank you.

The OP stated they sent him the 75W.

The MTL Life oil properties table shows their 75W oil has a viscosity of 6.242 cSt@100C.

 

[4WD]

My RockTrac takes ATF+4 - and happy enough with that being thicker than the Dex VI …

 

[The Lube Guy]

The OP stated they sent him the 75W.

The MTL Life oil properties table shows their 75W oil has a viscosity of 6.242 cSt@100C.

The HPL MTL 75W will work fine as long as it is the version without the LSD friction modifier. However, it wouldn't perform as well as HPL Green or Blue ATF. The 6 vs 7 cSt viscosity won't impact the transfer case at all. These are not as complex as automatic transmissions. In fact, I've found that in many modern automatics that call for LV fluid (~5.something cSt), a 7.something cSt ATF works very well, provided the DI package is good.

I believe HPL cross-referenced the MTL 75W to MobilFluid LT. Red Line Oil recommends MT-LV 70W/75W for the BorgWarner 44-44. However, clutch operation isn't as smooth with a GL4 MT-style fluid as it is with high-quality ATF. In any case, unless you have hypoid-style gears in a transfer case, there's no reason to use anything other than ATF. That's just my personal opinion, so I hope I'm not mistaken.

 

[4WD]

The HPL MTL 75W will work fine as long as it is the version without the LSD friction modifier. However, it wouldn't perform as well as HPL Green or Blue ATF. The 6 vs 7 cSt viscosity won't impact the transfer case at all. These are not as complex as automatic transmissions. In fact, I've found that in many modern automatics that call for LV fluid (~5.something cSt), a 7.something cSt ATF works very well, provided the DI package is good.

I believe HPL cross-referenced the MTL 75W to MobilFluid LT. Red Line Oil recommends MT-LV 70W/75W for the BorgWarner 44-44. However, clutch operation isn't as smooth with a GL4 MT-style fluid as it is with high-quality ATF. In any case, unless you have hypoid-style gears in a transfer case, there's no reason to use anything other than ATF. That's just my personal opinion, so I hope I'm not mistaken.

I’m not thinking you are - I owned only one in the last 20 years that took something other than ATF (it was synchromesh) …

 

[MolaKule]

The HPL MTL 75W will work fine as long as it is the version without the LSD friction modifier. However, it wouldn't perform as well as HPL Green or Blue ATF. The 6 vs 7 cSt viscosity won't impact the transfer case at all. These are not as complex as automatic transmissions. In fact, I've found that in many modern automatics that call for LV fluid (~5.something cSt), a 7.something cSt ATF works very well, provided the DI package is good.

I believe HPL cross-referenced the MTL 75W to MobilFluid LT. Red Line Oil recommends MT-LV 70W/75W for the BorgWarner 44-44. However, clutch operation isn't as smooth with a GL4 MT-style fluid as it is with high-quality ATF. In any case, unless you have hypoid-style gears in a transfer case, there's no reason to use anything other than ATF. That's just my personal opinion, so I hope I'm not mistaken.

Well, you are mistaken on a few points. Here are the facts:

An LV fluid is considered to be approx. 6.3 cSt@100C. A ULV LV fluid is considered to be approx. 4.5 cSt@100C. The original Dexron series came in at an average of 7.5 cSt@100C or thereabouts.

The HPL MTL Life series does not contain any LSD friction modifiers because it is an MT fluid, not a hypoid differential gear lube.

Addendum: Just to add to the understanding of Friction Modifiers; Friction Modifiers can refer to friction increasers, friction reducers, and lastly friction modifiers to attain the correct dynamic friction coefficient as in step-shift automatic transmission and other wet clutch assemblies. In CVT ATF, a friction increaser is used to attain a better traction coefficient for the belt/chain system.

Each fluid type and fluid application has a different additive package and contains different Friction Modifier and AW chemistry for the specific materials used in those transmissions or differentials.

The friction modifiers in engine oils are NOT the same friction modifiers as found in ATF's. The friction modifiers in ATF's are NOT the same friction modifiers as found in LSD gear oil.

For an LS differential with flat plate or cone clutches that friction modifier is used to prevent chatter.

In MTF's, the friction modifier is used to enhance synchro engagement/disengagement. The chemistries are entirely different and react differently.

In engine oils the Friction Modifiers are primarily there to reduce friction.

 

[The Lube Guy]

An LV fluid is considered to be approx. 6.3 cSt@100C.

When I made the statement about LV fluids being 5.something cSt @ 100C, I was thinking of ZF Lifeguard 8 (Mopar 8&9 Speed ATF) and Hyundai SP4 M, both which are somewhere around 5.6~5.7 cSt @100C and lower once they've been run in a transmission, per posted UOAs. Lifeguard 8 and SP4 M are the fluids I replaced the most with aftermarket ATFs.

The HPL MTL Life series does not contain any LSD friction modifiers because it is an MT fluid, not a hypoid differential gear lube.

This was my bad, I mixed up the MTL with HPL 75W gear oil, which is mostly used in racing applications. Sorry about that.

Thank you for correcting me.

 

[MolaKule]

When I made the statement about LV fluids being 5.something cSt @ 100C, I was thinking of ZF Lifeguard 8 (Mopar 8&9 Speed ATF) and Hyundai SP4 M, both which are somewhere around 5.6~5.7 cSt @100C and lower once they've been run in a transmission, per posted UOAs. Lifeguard 8 and SP4 M are the fluids I replaced the most with aftermarket ATFs.


This was my bad, I mixed up the MTL with HPL 75W gear oil, which is mostly used in racing applications. Sorry about that.

Thank you for correcting me.

No problem. Learning new things is a lifelong educational experience. Even I learn new things by reading technical papers.

 

[hemioiler]

Just to be very certain since this is beyond my paygrade, I reached out to HPL and they responded:

The BW 44-44 is a bit of a strange unit as regards to OEM fluid.

It’s a electronically controlled clutch pack transfer case.
Will work fine on any fluid such as an ATF or a wet clutch compatible manual trans fluid.
The HPL MTL75 is the viscosity of an ATF and has proven to work well in the transfer case and has the added load carrying additive technology of gear oils.

Either the HPl ATF Blue or the MTL75 will work great
Very similar in viscosity

Since I already have the MTL I will put that in rather than paying shipping a second and third time. As long as the MTL meets or exceeds the mopar fluid, I'm well ahead, 2 quarts of that mopar stuff at the dealer is like $180 CAD. Now add taxes and its slightly more than it cost me to ship 6 quarts of fluid from HPL across the border which included the 2 quarts of MTL that I need.