I am not too worried about varnishing. Oil has come along way since there was a Ford Escort on the market. Plenty of fleet vehicles have survived worse.
Honestly, does it really matter?
- Thread starter Liquid_Turbo
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With 3000 mile changes, you can probably use the oil that's on sale.
For longer change intervals, I'd use a quality synthetic.
It's important, for my peace of mind, that I use the "best" oil for my application.
So I'm going to do my research and stick to the brands that I believe in.
For longer change intervals, I'd use a quality synthetic.
It's important, for my peace of mind, that I use the "best" oil for my application.
So I'm going to do my research and stick to the brands that I believe in.
Originally Posted By: Liquid_Turbo
Honestly, does it really matter?
I'm sorry to say but that's a question that only you can answer. Your requirements and expectations will dictate whether or not it matters to you.
Honestly, does it really matter?
I'm sorry to say but that's a question that only you can answer. Your requirements and expectations will dictate whether or not it matters to you.
Same-spec oils are not the same but their ultimate effect on the engine is.
Originally Posted By: sprintman
OP is correct. It doesn't matter which brand of 40W70 you are using, your engine will last forever.
Dang gum Aussies!!
OP is correct. It doesn't matter which brand of 40W70 you are using, your engine will last forever.
Dang gum Aussies!!
Originally Posted By: DragRace
In 90% of vehicles on the road today, as long as you use the recommended oil spec and change the oil when your supposed to,and follow the rest of your maintenance routine,it's not gonna make a [censored] bit of difference what color the bottle is.
The body of the particular vehicle you own, will rust off the very frame it was built upon,before it matters what color of oil bottle you use.
This may be true in some instances and not true in other instances.
You imply that the engine (using any type of modern oil) will outlast the body of the car...I don't neceassarily agree with that. Two of my cars are examples where the type of oil does make a difference and I don't think my circumstances are unique. I have a 1993 Camry 4cyl with 230,000 miles that is in excellent condition, body is perfect, zero rust, brakes and suspension perfect, doors, interior everything, perfect, but it's starting to burn and leak some oil. In this case, the oil used in the engine throughout its life (and curently) made/makes a huge difference to the car.
Similar with my 2004 BMW 530i, great engine, great car, but if I used any old SM oil in it and drive it like it's meant to be driven, the engine would certainly wear out before the rest of the car. The car is built great, and so is the engine, but with oil-activated cam timing, high revving engine it benefits from a better than ordinary quality of oil. Especially if someone like me plans to keep the car a long time and plans to put mileage on it.
But, I do agree with you regarding a lot of cars and the way people use them and keep them. Most people think that 150,000 miles is very high, many think even 100,000 is a lot of miles, for those folks, it does not matter one bit what kind of oil they put in their cars.
Also, sadly, many cars aren't built that well to begin with, and in those cases, maybe you're totaly right, the type of oil really doesn't matter. But I would try to avoid those cars that fall into this category.
In 90% of vehicles on the road today, as long as you use the recommended oil spec and change the oil when your supposed to,and follow the rest of your maintenance routine,it's not gonna make a [censored] bit of difference what color the bottle is.
The body of the particular vehicle you own, will rust off the very frame it was built upon,before it matters what color of oil bottle you use.
This may be true in some instances and not true in other instances.
You imply that the engine (using any type of modern oil) will outlast the body of the car...I don't neceassarily agree with that. Two of my cars are examples where the type of oil does make a difference and I don't think my circumstances are unique. I have a 1993 Camry 4cyl with 230,000 miles that is in excellent condition, body is perfect, zero rust, brakes and suspension perfect, doors, interior everything, perfect, but it's starting to burn and leak some oil. In this case, the oil used in the engine throughout its life (and curently) made/makes a huge difference to the car.
Similar with my 2004 BMW 530i, great engine, great car, but if I used any old SM oil in it and drive it like it's meant to be driven, the engine would certainly wear out before the rest of the car. The car is built great, and so is the engine, but with oil-activated cam timing, high revving engine it benefits from a better than ordinary quality of oil. Especially if someone like me plans to keep the car a long time and plans to put mileage on it.
But, I do agree with you regarding a lot of cars and the way people use them and keep them. Most people think that 150,000 miles is very high, many think even 100,000 is a lot of miles, for those folks, it does not matter one bit what kind of oil they put in their cars.
Also, sadly, many cars aren't built that well to begin with, and in those cases, maybe you're totaly right, the type of oil really doesn't matter. But I would try to avoid those cars that fall into this category.
Originally Posted By: Vaca
... a lot of cars and the way people use them and keep them. Most people think that 150,000 miles is very high, many think even 100,000 is a lot of miles, for those folks, it does not matter one bit what kind of oil they put in their cars...
This is just broken in IMO!
... a lot of cars and the way people use them and keep them. Most people think that 150,000 miles is very high, many think even 100,000 is a lot of miles, for those folks, it does not matter one bit what kind of oil they put in their cars...
It depends on where you live as to how long the car body will last. When I drove my 1998 Camry down to FL a few years ago, and told people it was the original paint job, and that I had never even waxed it (except for the spray-on wax you get as last cycle at a car wash), they were stunned.
A lot depends on how dry the climate is, and whether the car is subjected to salt (either from ocean spray like in FL, or roads that are salted in the winter in colder climates).
In the desert Southwest, a car body could last almost forever.
A lot depends on how dry the climate is, and whether the car is subjected to salt (either from ocean spray like in FL, or roads that are salted in the winter in colder climates).
In the desert Southwest, a car body could last almost forever.
Here's an example based on the Audi FSI engine problems with intake valve deposits. This is an update on the problem from an RS4 owner, who has switched to RLI Biosyn 5W40 and BioPlus fuel additive, in his words.
“I’ll try to get the whole history as brief as possible. It’s lengthy, but hopefully informative.
From the time the car was broken in, the cold starts were frequently rough and power delivery was erratic. The roughness should not be confused with a hunting or oscillating idle. It was caused by misfiring, as verified with Vagcom. It eventually got to the point when there would be 30-40 random misfires in the first 15 seconds. First oil change was at 4k by the dealer.
By 8k miles, I had been in twice for “coil” issues to “correct” the CEL’s caused by the misfires. The coils were not the problem. The Service Mgr (not the SA, who was clueless) decided the fuel system should be checked. Four injectors failed the leak-down testing. Upon removing the intake to replace all 8 injectors at 8k miles, they discovered a disturbing amount of buildup on the intake valves. I saw the buildup, but did not take any photos. The dealer did a very good job of cleaning them and with the new injectors, the car ran much, much better. There have been no misfire issues since.
I have hooked up Vagcom several times after the car has been sitting for 2-3 days and zero misfires are recorded – the engine fires up nicely, just as it should. The dealer used a fair amount of solvent when they cleaned the valves, so I changed oil at 8k, using the Castrol TXT synthetic available from the dealer. At 9k miles, I swapped in my ported intake. Low and behold, after only 1000 miles on a good 501/502 oil, the intake valve buildup was already at least 1/2 of what it was at 8k. I had figured that with good injectors that were no longer leaking fuel into the cylinders when the engine was off, there would less fuel dilution of the oil, less oil vapor in the crankcase air stream and much less buildup. Apparently not.
So I cleaned the valves (major PITA), and decided to start using the RLI 5W-40 oil and fuel conditioner. At this point the car was running very strong. At 11.5k miles, I swapped in my version 2 ported manifold. After 2500 miles on the RLI oil, there was some buildup on the valves, but it was minimal. 500 miles later, I swapped manifolds again and of course the valve condition hadn’t changed much. The buildup rate is definitely slower with the RLI oil.
So what have I learned? 1) The high performance nature of the RS4 engine means it volatizes a lot of oil, plain and simple 2) Generally speaking with FSI engines, rough cold starts and misfires are probably injector related – a bad coil would misfire all the time and minor valve buildup apparently doesn’t cause misfires 3) The injector problems are isolated and may be due to a manufacturing tolerance issue 4) I’ve used Tier 1 Shell fuel exclusively, it may keep the fuel system clean, but it does absolutely nothing for intake valve deposits on a FSI engine 4) A good fuel conditioner will help with maintaining clean injectors and minimizing combustion chamber deposits, but with a FSI engine, its affect on the intake valves is minimal 5) Oil chemistry can make a difference with the rate of buildup
“I’ll try to get the whole history as brief as possible. It’s lengthy, but hopefully informative.
From the time the car was broken in, the cold starts were frequently rough and power delivery was erratic. The roughness should not be confused with a hunting or oscillating idle. It was caused by misfiring, as verified with Vagcom. It eventually got to the point when there would be 30-40 random misfires in the first 15 seconds. First oil change was at 4k by the dealer.
By 8k miles, I had been in twice for “coil” issues to “correct” the CEL’s caused by the misfires. The coils were not the problem. The Service Mgr (not the SA, who was clueless) decided the fuel system should be checked. Four injectors failed the leak-down testing. Upon removing the intake to replace all 8 injectors at 8k miles, they discovered a disturbing amount of buildup on the intake valves. I saw the buildup, but did not take any photos. The dealer did a very good job of cleaning them and with the new injectors, the car ran much, much better. There have been no misfire issues since.
I have hooked up Vagcom several times after the car has been sitting for 2-3 days and zero misfires are recorded – the engine fires up nicely, just as it should. The dealer used a fair amount of solvent when they cleaned the valves, so I changed oil at 8k, using the Castrol TXT synthetic available from the dealer. At 9k miles, I swapped in my ported intake. Low and behold, after only 1000 miles on a good 501/502 oil, the intake valve buildup was already at least 1/2 of what it was at 8k. I had figured that with good injectors that were no longer leaking fuel into the cylinders when the engine was off, there would less fuel dilution of the oil, less oil vapor in the crankcase air stream and much less buildup. Apparently not.
So I cleaned the valves (major PITA), and decided to start using the RLI 5W-40 oil and fuel conditioner. At this point the car was running very strong. At 11.5k miles, I swapped in my version 2 ported manifold. After 2500 miles on the RLI oil, there was some buildup on the valves, but it was minimal. 500 miles later, I swapped manifolds again and of course the valve condition hadn’t changed much. The buildup rate is definitely slower with the RLI oil.
So what have I learned? 1) The high performance nature of the RS4 engine means it volatizes a lot of oil, plain and simple 2) Generally speaking with FSI engines, rough cold starts and misfires are probably injector related – a bad coil would misfire all the time and minor valve buildup apparently doesn’t cause misfires 3) The injector problems are isolated and may be due to a manufacturing tolerance issue 4) I’ve used Tier 1 Shell fuel exclusively, it may keep the fuel system clean, but it does absolutely nothing for intake valve deposits on a FSI engine 4) A good fuel conditioner will help with maintaining clean injectors and minimizing combustion chamber deposits, but with a FSI engine, its affect on the intake valves is minimal 5) Oil chemistry can make a difference with the rate of buildup
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X 1000
Originally Posted By: DragRace
In 90% of vehicles on the road today, as long as you use the recommended oil spec and change the oil when your supposed to,and follow the rest of your maintenance routine,it's not gonna make a [censored] bit of difference what color the bottle is.
The body of the particular vehicle you own, will rust off the very frame it was built upon,before it matters what color of oil bottle you use.
X 1000
In 90% of vehicles on the road today, as long as you use the recommended oil spec and change the oil when your supposed to,and follow the rest of your maintenance routine,it's not gonna make a [censored] bit of difference what color the bottle is.
The body of the particular vehicle you own, will rust off the very frame it was built upon,before it matters what color of oil bottle you use.
X 1000
Truthfully if the oil meets standards of regulations and is the right grade specified by manufacture- It does not matter.
However we are all individuals with different tastes, passions, choice, etc. And if there was no choice in life, everyone would be an average Joe.
However we are all individuals with different tastes, passions, choice, etc. And if there was no choice in life, everyone would be an average Joe.
Makes me glad I have a normal cars than a Audi.
Sounds like they are REAL picky engines.
Sounds like they are REAL picky engines.
I would say all conventional oils are roughly equivalent... and all synthetics are... and all high mileage oils are... but I don't think I'd say *all oil* is equivalent.
"I seriously am starting to think, after sorting through used oil analysis, that we could use any average joe oil thats certified for our cars."
In most cases the choice of motor oil is unlikely to have a significant impact on vehicle life expectancy. Personally I mostly use synthetics because I like a little extra safety margin, but going back to any decent brand of conventional oil wouldn't honestly be likely to hurt my vehicles at all. One of my vehicles right now is an '89 F150 with 178k miles on it that I bought very used from a friend. He had the oil changed every 3,000 miles with whatever the dealer or JiffyLube was pumping that day. Recently I changed the valve cover and oil pan gaskets (what a PITA job that was!) and I was amazed at how little sludge I found. A very light coat of varnish, but not enough to be of any concern. Compression is still good and oil usage is negligible. The motor is still going plenty strong.
In most cases the choice of motor oil is unlikely to have a significant impact on vehicle life expectancy. Personally I mostly use synthetics because I like a little extra safety margin, but going back to any decent brand of conventional oil wouldn't honestly be likely to hurt my vehicles at all. One of my vehicles right now is an '89 F150 with 178k miles on it that I bought very used from a friend. He had the oil changed every 3,000 miles with whatever the dealer or JiffyLube was pumping that day. Recently I changed the valve cover and oil pan gaskets (what a PITA job that was!) and I was amazed at how little sludge I found. A very light coat of varnish, but not enough to be of any concern. Compression is still good and oil usage is negligible. The motor is still going plenty strong.
Originally Posted By: My442
In 37 years of owning cars, trucks, lawn tractors, lawnmowers, etc..., I have used every brand and every type of oil. I have been very strict on change intervals and mileage.
NEVER had a lubrication issues or failure....EVER.
Your post just made me think. Since my first car in 1960, and my first new car in 1965, to date I have used only 3 brands of oil: Kendal, Castrol, and now Mobil 1. I have used only 3 grades: Kendal 40, Castrol 20W-50, and Mobil 1 15W-50.
In 37 years of owning cars, trucks, lawn tractors, lawnmowers, etc..., I have used every brand and every type of oil. I have been very strict on change intervals and mileage.
NEVER had a lubrication issues or failure....EVER.
Your post just made me think. Since my first car in 1960, and my first new car in 1965, to date I have used only 3 brands of oil: Kendal, Castrol, and now Mobil 1. I have used only 3 grades: Kendal 40, Castrol 20W-50, and Mobil 1 15W-50.
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