High RPM, small displacement synthetic, good value

[JimmyP]

Hey All,
New here. GREAT forum. I have been reading threads and ssearching for about 3 days. My wife thinks I'm having an internet affair.

My question:
I have a small 16V 4 cylinder. Revs to about 8,000 rpm in my track car.

I am looking around at alternatives to Mobil 1 15w-50 which I have been using for years. No problem, just like to have options.

I see Valvoline now makes a syth 20-50.
I am also considering the Rotella 5W-40 synthetic as well.
Or I could just stay with Mobil 1,,, but the price seems to just keep going up.

I am in the northeast, its a track only car, trailered.
I have discounted RL, Amsoil and Royal Purple all because,,,well I just think they are a bad value for the money.

My OCI is about every 8 - 10 track days which "averages" out to be "about" 800 - 1000 track miles (all pretty much at wide open throttle.
Just wondering if there is any alternative to Mobil 1, in a heavy visco, synthetic thats as protective for the engine, and maybe a better value.

If you think I'm nuts and Mobil 1 is the best value for the the protection offered, please tell me and I'll just keep using it.
I dont want anything "more" expensive than Mobil 1, so the criteria should be equal or cheaper than Mobil 1.

Thanks in advance for any opinions,,, and once again, great forum.
Cheers
Jimmy P.

 

[surfstar]

I don't think you can beat M1 since you have the restriction of equal or cheaper.

Maybe Mobil 1 Truck and SUV 5w40 would be a good option also.

 

[bulwnkl]

Perhaps a firm like Dyson Analysis could be of use to you.

 

[JimmyP]

In what way?
What services do they perform?
Thanks
jp

 

[JimmyP]

Wow, what a great experiment.
Thats some GREAT information.

So it seems like the Xw40s shed heat better?
Am I reading that correct?

No significant breakdown or drop in oil pressure hot?

That is some very interesting info.
I have been wanting to try the Rotella T 5w40 synthetic for a long while, but was afraid that it only comes up to a 40.
Then reading here, I read that Mobil 1 15w50 is a very light 50.
That pushed me a little more towards trying the 5W40, now after reading your post I am heaviliy leaning towards running it for a season (or at least a few OCIs and checking it out.

I guess the biggest fear I had was the protection offered by the w50 oils. Heck if you were running down to a w30 at 8500 rpms with no adverse effects I guess my fears were totally unfounded.

I also read in another set of posts here that the base stock Shell uses for the Rotella T synthetic is the same as they use in their race oils? Have you heard any truth to that?

As for my OCI,,, I usually change it as soon as it starts to change color, which has always been right around that 8 event mark. Basically as soon as I can start seeing it on the dipstick, I change it. I never thought it would only take a few days for it to break down.

Thanks for all the great info and sharing the results of your experiment. That was very kind of you.

Nice car BTW.
I instructed for a Ferrari club get DE at Pocono last year.
Nice people, great cars.

Cheers
jimmy p.

 

[JimmyP]

Oh Mitch, one more question.
Can I assume you did this whole experiment with synthetics?

Also, would you mind sharing your specific brand / weight data?

Thanks again.
Cheers
jimmy

 

[The_Jeff]

Search this board for writings from AEHaas. Big fan of thinner oil flowing faster in hi-po apps.

 

[Mitch Alsup]

Yes, every oil in thes test was a full synthetic from {RedLine, AMSoil, and Mobil 1}by{5w30, 5W-40, and 15W-50} (although one of the 5W-40s may have been a 10W-40)--its been a couple of years.)

I don't know if the xw-40 oils shed more heat, or pickup less heat, pump with lower losses, or simply enable less heat to be produced. But, by whatever means, the data stands on its own. You should be aware that the oil cooler on the F355 Ferrari is 1/2 the size of the water radiator, and well ducted to boot (and a 10 Qt dry sumpped oil system).

None of these oils gave the slightest indication of any oil problems {Oil pressure, surging,...} and only the 5w30 oils needed any top ups at the track.

I have to back the general philosophy of A.E Haas with respect to thickness of oils--use the thinnest that gets the job done. I ran this experiment after having an e-mail conversation with him. I would not have run this experiment without an OIL TEMP GUAGE in the car; having both a temp and pressure guage adds to the safety factor. I certainly would not have run the 5w30 experiments without both guages.

Fact is, I don't think the 'viscosity' of an oil has much to do with the 'protection level' of that oil--unless something is clearly amiss with a vehicle. I often tell racers having oiling problems the solution is a bigger oil cooler not thicker oils.

 

[KJA426]

As the old saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it".

 

[Mitch Alsup]

I have a small V8* that revs to 8,500 RPMs. 2 years ago I did a long running experiment where I ran 3 different xW-50 oils, 3 different xW-40 oils and 3 different xW-30 oils in this car.

Based on the oil temperature after a long track session (and coroborated with the idle oil pressure as I arrived in my padock stall) the xW-40 oils were unquestionably better than the xW-50 oils. In choosing between the xW-30 oils and the xW-40 oils, it was oil consumption and not oil temp or pressures that lead me to pick an xW-40 oil for this vehicle. The oil temps between xW-30 oils and xW-40 oils were insignificant (3dF) while the xW-50 oils were seriously worse +15dF.

On a different point, I would not run a track engine for more than 2 days on a single batch of oil. At track stress levels, you will wear out the anti-wear package quickly.

[*] Ferrari F355B

 

[lvporschepilot]

To answer your question about Shell's Rotella T synthetic 5w-40 being the same base stock as in Ferrari's F1 engine's. I have been corresponding with Shell's website tech guru who has made several postings on the website stating that very claim that Shell's HXIV group III base stock is indeed the same base stock used in Ferrari's F1 engine's. I was also told through correspondence that the HXIV base stock is the same group III stock for Shell Helix that is factory pour in all new Ferrari's. The hths and viscosity indec are excellent with Shell Rotella synthetic and, I as well as many of my other Porsche 911 buddies use it with fantastic performance and heat reducing results. Buy it, use it, love it.

Here is one of my most readily available resource for proof of Ferrari's formula 1 base stock claim.

http://www.rotella.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=General&Number=1048&Forum=All_Forums&Words=formula%201&Match=Entire%20Phrase&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=1046& Search=true#Post1048


I have found after several correspondences, that this guy is undoubtedly as oil genius.